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Thread: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

  1. #61

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    fair enough, but still doesn't change the fact that people do cheat the system and at close to 13% for UC shows it isn't that uncommon
    Who brought in universal credit

  2. #62

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    It tickles me how obsessed Tory sympathisers are with people "taking the piss" out of the benefit system: are they envious? If you can't beat them, join them but understand these so called "benefit scroungers" are willing to accept a much lower quality of life than most of us would want for ourselves.

    Someone mentioned theres about £69 billion going to waste on benefit fraud but how do they think they would personally benefit if that were eradicated? If they think the Tories would put it to good use then they are surely going to be sorely disappointed. That money would likely end up in Tory friends and donor's pockets.

    The reality is there always has been and always will be a sub class of unemployed and unemployable people but the difference is that in the past those people and their family either perished or turned to crime and prostitution to survive. Looking at it that way, I reckon that £69 billion is a fair investment in order to keep us all safer and happier.

  3. #63

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    It tickles me how obsessed Tory sympathisers are with people "taking the piss" out of the benefit system: are they envious? If you can't beat them, join them but understand these so called "benefit scroungers" are willing to accept a much lower quality of life than most of us would want for ourselves.

    Someone mentioned theres about £69 billion going to waste on benefit fraud but how do they think they would personally benefit if that were eradicated? If they think the Tories would put it to good use then they are surely going to be sorely disappointed. That money would likely end up in Tory friends and donor's pockets.

    The reality is there always has been and always will be a sub class of unemployed and unemployable people but the difference is that in the past those people and their family either perished or turned to crime and prostitution to survive. Looking at it that way, I reckon that £69 billion is a fair investment in order to keep us all safer and happier.
    What frustrates me about posts like this is how it tries to present party politics as some kind of disney film, with goodies and baddies. Listening to some people talk about Tories is like listening to Tommy Robinson talk about Islam, or Rev Ian Paisley talk about catholic republicans.

    The very benefits system you (rightly) cherish has been run by the Tories for almost twice as long as it has Labour.

    The very NHS you (rightly) cherish has been run by the Tories for almost twice as long as it has Labour.


    Surely if there is a child you are proud of then you at least recognise the role of the parent who has looked after them the most?

    This isn't a defence of the Tories, it's a plea for reasoned debate and less punch and judy bullshit.

    There are differences between the parties, but nothing as stark as people make out, and in most cases governments would make the same decisions. Labour dont support benefit fraud any more than the Tories do, and they would both want to crack down on it and make sure it goes to those who most deserve it.

  4. #64

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    What frustrates me about posts like this is how it tries to present party politics as some kind of disney film, with goodies and baddies. Listening to some people talk about Tories is like listening to Tommy Robinson talk about Islam, or Rev Ian Paisley talk about catholic republicans.

    The very benefits system you (rightly) cherish has been run by the Tories for almost twice as long as it has Labour.

    The very NHS you (rightly) cherish has been run by the Tories for almost twice as long as it has Labour.


    Surely if there is a child you are proud of then you at least recognise the role of the parent who has looked after them the most?

    This isn't a defence of the Tories, it's a plea for reasoned debate and less punch and judy bullshit.

    There are differences between the parties, but nothing as stark as people make out, and in most cases governments would make the same decisions. Labour dont support benefit fraud any more than the Tories do, and they would both want to crack down on it and make sure it goes to those who most deserve it.
    The trouble with this post is that you've stuck your oar in it.

    It is a Disney film: the Tories are the eternal baddies, their beliefs correspond to the lowest common denominator of self interest and avarice. In Manichaeism they would be personified as Ahriman, the Prince of Darkness. That's my view of course and I wouldn't expect you to agree with it.

    However, what is certain is that the Tories have invented the myth of "benefit scroungers" to demonise the weakest in society which is their wont. It deflects rather nicely the concentration on massively wealthy spongers called tax evaders.

    Of course every budget needs careful management but the reason Labour are seemingly as concerned about it as the Tories are is simply because they know it to be a vote winner with the average constituency. In the greater scheme of things it's a trivial red herring which will never be properly corrected.

  5. #65

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Who brought in universal credit
    not sure it matters who brought in UC ( as we know Benefit fraud was happening before UC came along ), I said people don't like to see people cheating the benefits system ( which most don't ), you made it sound like it wasn't happening but was just made up by the Tories

    the fact is that Fraud levels in England, Wales and Scotland reached a historic high, with universal credit fraud up five percentage points to nearly 13%, I am not sure how people can defend that from any party

  6. #66

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    not sure it matters who brought in UC ( as we know Benefit fraud was happening before UC came along ), I said people don't like to see people cheating the benefits system ( which most don't ), you made it sound like it wasn't happening but was just made up by the Tories

    the fact is that Fraud levels in England, Wales and Scotland reached a historic high, with universal credit fraud up five percentage points to nearly 13%, I am not sure how people can defend that from any party
    Universal credit and the new benefits system is a draconian medieval way of treating people, no wonder people cut a few corners

    It matters because the Tories, your lot , brought in a new benefits system which you lot all voted for yet under the tories benefit fraud has gone up

    Figure that out

    I often wonder if any of the people wether in the tory Party or its cap doffing voters have any idea what it must be like to live on benefits , especially if you are disabled

    I mean Iain Duncan Smith who brought these changes in , you can tell by his accent he's had it tough

  7. #67

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    The trouble with this post is that you've stuck your oar in it.

    It is a Disney film: the Tories are the eternal baddies, their beliefs correspond to the lowest common denominator of self interest and avarice. In Manichaeism they would be personified as Ahriman, the Prince of Darkness. That's my view of course and I wouldn't expect you to agree with it.

    However, what is certain is that the Tories have invented the myth of "benefit scroungers" to demonise the weakest in society which is their wont. It deflects rather nicely the concentration on massively wealthy spongers called tax evaders.

    Of course every budget needs careful management but the reason Labour are seemingly as concerned about it as the Tories are is simply because they know it to be a vote winner with the average constituency. In the greater scheme of things it's a trivial red herring which will never be properly corrected.
    Miaow. Enjoy your Disney films. The real world is very very different. I used to be a member of the Respect Party - a far-left organisation until I realised it's basically all indoctrination and reality is excluded from the debate if it challenges the orthodoxy.

    I suggest you get out of that sectarian rabbit hole. The two main parties have far more in common than you think and that's because reality tends to trump ideology when you get in power.

    Like I said, neither party supports benefit fraud and both will clamp down on it. The rhetoric may change from time to time or between different parties, but not to the wild extent that you characterise it.

  8. #68

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    Miaow. Enjoy your Disney films. The real world is very very different. I used to be a member of the Respect Party - a far-left organisation until I realised it's basically all indoctrination and reality is excluded from the debate if it challenges the orthodoxy.

    I suggest you get out of that rabbit hole. The two main parties have far more in common than you think and thats because reality tends to trump ideology when you get in power.
    You have changed from a fan of Galloway to a fan of Thatcher

    Of course you have

  9. #69

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    You have changed from a fan of Galloway to a fan of Thatcher

    Of course you have
    I'm no fan of Thatcher.

    But more generally, some people move on from student union politics.

    Some people don't.


  10. #70

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Why isn’t this thread on the politics board?

  11. #71

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Why isn’t this thread on the politics board?
    You would love that wouldn't you. Bloody Tories.

  12. #72

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    Miaow. Enjoy your Disney films. The real world is very very different. I used to be a member of the Respect Party - a far-left organisation until I realised it's basically all indoctrination and reality is excluded from the debate if it challenges the orthodoxy.

    I suggest you get out of that sectarian rabbit hole. The two main parties have far more in common than you think and that's because reality tends to trump ideology when you get in power.

    Like I said, neither party supports benefit fraud and both will clamp down on it. The rhetoric may change from time to time or between different parties, but not to the wild extent that you characterise it.
    Grrrr, I didn't expect you to agree! Some people never look beyond their own narrow horizons.

  13. #73

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    not sure it matters who brought in UC ( as we know Benefit fraud was happening before UC came along ), I said people don't like to see people cheating the benefits system ( which most don't ), you made it sound like it wasn't happening but was just made up by the Tories

    the fact is that Fraud levels in England, Wales and Scotland reached a historic high, with universal credit fraud up five percentage points to nearly 13%, I am not sure how people can defend that from any party
    I don't fret about people cheating the benefits system. How does it affect me?

  14. #74

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    You would love that wouldn't you. Bloody Tories.

  15. #75

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorcus View Post
    I don't fret about people cheating the benefits system. How does it affect me?
    It might not effect you, as you might not need them, but it might play on your conscience, as them people cheating the system are taking money that could be given to the genuine people who need it, who knows ? ?

  16. #76

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    Am only messing, to satire the poor state of debate sometimes.

  17. #77

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    It might not effect you, as you might not need them, but it might play on your conscience, as them people cheating the system are taking money that could be given to the genuine people who need it, who knows ? ?
    It wouldn't play on my conscience as the government could chuck more money at it and at the same time I feel good that people are managing to get more than the scandalously low level of benefits the government dishes out.

    However I take your point but don't you think that the majority of people who fret about these things are not so concerned about "genuine" people missing out on benefits but are driven more by envy towards some people not having to work?

    By the way, the one area of genuine benefit fraud I agree should be treated very seriously is systematic abuse by setting up false names and multiple accounts etc. That is reprehensible.

  18. #78

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by blue matt View Post
    Ive seen it with my own eyes, its not that uncommon, I worked on VOG / Cardiff and Bridgend Councils as a Chippy ( Bridgend was only for a few months, the others were for years , so I have hardly been hoodwinked by the Tories to think that, and as it goes at the time of me working for the councils I was voting Labour or Plaid


    as a side note, from a quick google

    Universal credit accounted for £6bn of the estimated £8.5bn of “overpaid” benefits in 2020-21

    Fraud levels in England, Wales and Scotland reached a historic high, with universal credit fraud up five percentage points to nearly 13%
    Careful if you point certain things your labelled as a Tory and your right there is abuse of welfare claim systems someone pointed put thee is only 1% of benefit fraud , well that percentage that has been captured .

    One case I know of is someone who decided not to work anymore in her middle 60's ,she voluntary retried from NHS, took pay off/ pension , lives in a household with her working partner ( not married ) mortgage paid for she has recently been diagnosed with fibrous well after leaving work and is fully mobile , she claims benefits (Compassionate Allowances) as does her son who doesn't live there for caring for her , once you enter the benefit scheme other benefits do flow through .

  19. #79

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Careful if you point certain things your labelled as a Tory and your right there is abuse of welfare claim systems someone pointed put thee is only 1% of benefit fraud , well that percentage that has been captured .

    One case I know of is someone who decided not to work anymore in her middle 60's ,she voluntary retried from NHS, took pay off/ pension , lives in a household with her working partner ( not married ) mortgage paid for she has recently been diagnosed with fibrous well after leaving work and is fully mobile , she claims benefits (Compassionate Allowances) as does her son who doesn't live there for caring for her , once you enter the benefit scheme other benefits do flow through .
    Compassionate allowances?

    I think you will find when you are on benefits others are actually taken away from you

  20. #80

    Re: Global Prices Rises On Many Commodities

    How much money should people get?

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