People calling for Tan to go

[pomeroy]

It always amazes me that not all the idiots are on the other board. Tan owns CCFC lock stock and barrel. Almost all of the debt is owed directly to Tan and without him the club is insolvent. In other words the club, at the present moment, is not a saleable proposition and nobody, in their right mind, would offer enough to at least cover Tan’s debt. Those buffoons calling for Vincent to go must ask themselves what lunatic is prepared to pay in excess of £100 million for a Championship club soon to be manager less and threatened with relegation!!

[blue lewj]

It always amazes me that not all the idiots are on the other board. Tan owns CCFC lock stock and barrel. Almost all of the debt is owed directly to Tan and without him the club is insolvent. In other words the club, at the present moment, is not a saleable proposition and nobody, in their right mind, would offer enough to at least cover Tan’s debt. Those buffoons calling for Vincent to go must ask themselves what lunatic is prepared to pay in excess of £100 million for a Championship club soon to be manager less and threatened with relegation!!

Makes you wonder why Tan bought us in the first place.

[The Lone Gunman]

Tan owns CCFC lock stock and barrel. Almost all of the debt is owed directly to Tan and without him the club is insolvent. In other words the club, at the present moment, is not a saleable proposition and nobody, in their right mind, would offer enough to at least cover Tan’s debt.

If this is the case, does it mean Vincent Tan will own Cardiff City until he dies? And what happens then?

If not, what do you reckon are the likeliest future scenarios?

[pomeroy]

If this is the case, does it mean Vincent Tan will own Cardiff City until he dies? And what happens then?

If not, what do you reckon are the likeliest future scenarios?

If you had £100K mortgage on your house and due to a number of circumstances it is now worth £10k, however rich you are you are not minded to sell it. However if your house , again due to a number of circumstances, has the potential over time to be worth considerably more than £100k you might look at selling. IMO the club has to be worth something close to what it owes Tan for him to contemplate selling. We are lucky in the sense that most of our debt is owed to Tan not to banks or other lenders but because of this it seems likely that unless there is a quick change in the club fortunes Tan is likely to be in situ for a good time. I, like you, have little idea as to what the future holds but it seems that we, like a host of other clubs, have to come to terms with economic reality and start by stop paying grossly obscene wages to ordinary players. The average Championship player salary for 20/21 season is reported at over £29K per week, much more than your average Joe earns in a year. This lunatic scenario is not sustainable and will have to addressed by Tan, and many other clubs, in the near future.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

If you had £100K mortgage on your house and due to a number of circumstances it is now worth £10k, however rich you are you are not minded to sell it. However if your house , again due to a number of circumstances, has the potential over time to be worth considerably more than £100k you might look at selling. IMO the club has to be worth something close to what it owes Tan for him to contemplate selling. We are lucky in the sense that most of our debt is owed to Tan not to banks or other lenders but because of this it seems likely that unless there is a quick change in the club fortunes Tan is likely to be in situ for a good time. I, like you, have little idea as to what the future holds but it seems that we, like a host of other clubs, have to come to terms with economic reality and start by stop paying grossly obscene wages to ordinary players. The average Championship player salary for 20/21 season is reported at over £29K per week, much more than your average Joe earns in a year. This lunatic scenario is not sustainable and will have to addressed by Tan, and many other clubs, in the near future.

You are ignoring the running costs. On purely economic grounds most people would sell something for £10K right now if it costs them £1K a month in running costs for the year ahead and when they are unlikely to be achieve a selling price that rises more than £1K per month. The cost to Tan is escalating month by month.

[pomeroy]

You are ignoring the running costs. On purely economic grounds most people would sell something for £10K right now if it costs them £1K a month in running costs for the year ahead and when they are unlikely to be achieve a selling price that rises more than £1K per month. The cost to Tan is escalating month by month.

You ignore the fact that Tan is rich enough to afford the running costs and to a billionaire are probably just a nuisance. He is probably in a position where he could pick and choose when and if to sell but only an idiot, and you cannot call Tan an idiot, would be likely to contemplate selling up now. Having watched the U23’s this season and just now, he might get lucky and be able to cash in some budding Grealish or two coming through.

[blue lewj]

One would play in blue, one in red, and one in a mixture of red and blue, surely?

With an earwig on the badge.

[Dorcus]

I can understand people clinging to what we've currently got (which isn't much) rather than contemplate a future which could be even worse. Who knows what's round the corner?

However, there's surely a stark reality to the direction the club is heading. It must be obvious to everyone Tan is looking to extricate himself from the club at the earliest opportunity and at a price of his choosing. When the red debacle finally ended he made it clear "no further significant investment' and for all his failings I believe him to be a man of his word.

We will never make progress under his watch. His only concern is to make the club saleable and he wants hands on control of his personnel. Therefore even if he got rid of Dalman and Choo he would only likely recruit two lookalikes. He is never going to employ football people in the interests of developing the club.

It actually might be in our interests to get relegated so that he might take a much lower bid just to get out of a failed project. Hopefully that might enable more forward thinking owners to put cash and knowledge into getting us on the right road.

[Divine Wright]

I can understand people clinging to what we've currently got (which isn't much) rather than contemplate a future which could be even worse. Who knows what's round the corner?

However, there's surely a stark reality to the direction the club is heading. It must be obvious to everyone Tan is looking to extricate himself from the club at the earliest opportunity and at a price of his choosing. When the red debacle finally ended he made it clear "no further significant investment' and for all his failings I believe him to be a man of his word.

We will never make progress under his watch. His only concern is to make the club saleable and he wants hands on control of his personnel. Therefore even if he got rid of Dalman and Choo he would only likely recruit two lookalikes. He is never going to employ football people in the interests of developing the club.

It actually might be in our interests to get relegated so that he might take a much lower bid just to get out of a failed project. Hopefully that might enable more forward thinking owners to put cash and knowledge into getting us on the right road.

This is the most pertinent post in this thread.

"When the red debacle finally ended he made it clear "no further significant investment' and for all his failings I believe him to be a man of his word."

I think the majority of the people commenting in this thread seem to have conveniently forgotten this. I remember this all too clearly. It seemed petulant and for me and just reinforced any doubts I had about this guy's character. How you can say " without red, I can't market the team in Asia and therefore have to reduce investment in the team" is about as daft an excuse as I've ever heard. We are still living with the consequences of this silliness.

I think the lack of investment in the team is probably a good thing though as we undoubtedly would have ended up owing someone or other in the long run.

I've asked a few times about where we stand on the debt and the debt to equity promises yet none of those who champion this billionaire business man seem to have much of an idea either.

Whatever the case may be, the team is going backwards (or stagnating at best). If people are happy to be a languishing championship side in exchange for Tan's money then fair enough. I don't get it personally.

[Mr Soul '68]

With an earwig on the badge.

The team playing in blue would go back to just having a bluebird as a badge i.e the badge worn when I first went down in season 68/69

The team playing in red would have a giant millipede as it's badge.

Meanwhile the team playing in blue and red would feature a bluebird with a giant centipede in it's mouth

[dembethewarrior]

Money is a very good starting point though and my point is that the owner has pumped enough in for any vaguely competent CEO and Chairman to have made a better job of running the club than ours have.

I’d like to believe that Tan, Dalman and Choo would finally see the light and accept that they don’t have the football knowledge collectively to tyrn us into, for example, a Burnley, Brighton, Palace, Brentford or even a Coventry, but City fans have been talking about the need for something like a Director of Football for five years and more and we’re still as far away as ever from appointing one.

I’m guessing and I may be wrong, but I think the Mackay/Moody incident deeply effected Vincent Tan and has left him with a deep distrust of “football people” - it’s as if he has an advisor he trusts who makes recommendations on things like managerial appointments based on the sort of person they think Tan could work with.

Four of our last five managers have been, basically, defensive, long ball merchants, hence we’ve ended with the current very limited technically squad of senior pros which are so much worse at retaining the ball than almost every team they play. This has been a gradual process which Tan, Dalman and Choo have done nothing to try to halt, so I can only conclude that it is a route they have been happy to go down - for me, given his public pronouncements on the game, it seems reasonable to believe that Vincent Tan likes us to be bigger and more physical than our opponents and has little patience with what he sees as messing about with the ball at the back, it’s entirely believable that he’d want us to lump it forward as soon as possible.

I was just pointing out that too often money is seen as the answer, and people expect success just because money has been pumped in, but too often it doesn't work.

There are more important things for the club to fix.

[dembethewarrior]

The thing is, it is his club and his money. He can basically do what he likes and all the sniping and moaning is a waste of time. Fans would be better off using their time and efforts to get behind the team and help get them out of this dreadful run before it is too late. That, after all, is what the fans ‘job’ is. How can anyone call themselves a fan if they don't go to games or stop going because they don't like the manager, individual players, team tactics or the owner/chairman. That to me is the antithesis of what a fan should be.

He CAN do what he wants yes. But surely you want him to do what is best?

[dembethewarrior]

The thing is, it is his club and his money. He can basically do what he likes and all the sniping and moaning is a waste of time. Fans would be better off using their time and efforts to get behind the team and help get them out of this dreadful run before it is too late. That, after all, is what the fans ‘job’ is. How can anyone call themselves a fan if they don't go to games or stop going because they don't like the manager, individual players, team tactics or the owner/chairman. That to me is the antithesis of what a fan should be.

How Wikipedia defines sports fan

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fan_...social%20media.

[198bore]

We all know the solution is to appoint a football person to run things. Preferably someone with an affiliation with the club that can connect with the fans. But that's isn't going to happen. Tan wants his mate to run things as he trusts him with his money and said mate doesn't know anything about football so it's wipe and repeat from here on in.

[DubaiDai]

We all know the solution is to appoint a football person to run things. Preferably someone with an affiliation with the club that can connect with the fans. But that's isn't going to happen. Tan wants his mate to run things as he trusts him with his money and said mate doesn't know anything about football so it's wipe and repeat from here on in.

Why are Swansea consistently successful despite changes in manager ?
They have a senior advisor in Curtis who has been in football for many years, most spent at the club

[Hilts]

Forget a DOF. The first and most pressing matter is getting Mick and TC out of the club.

[dembethewarrior]

I am not ignoring that at all. I referred to your analogy that didn't include running costs and I included a reference to 'purely economic grounds' because ownership of football clubs are indeed not based entirely on pure economic grounds (as your analogy suggested)

Welcome to ccmb where people can't be wrong so keep on typing.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Welcome to ccmb where people can't be wrong so keep on typing.

It's no crime debating things on a message board and on a civil basis, you know. Try it sometime.

[blue lewj]

It's no crime debating things on a message board and on a civil basis, you know. Try it sometime.

Exactly that.

It isn't a case of being right and wrong.
Everybody isn't right 100% of the time either.

If you can't discuss/debate it here then where can you?

I do think some mix up support at the stadium with discussing topics on message boards though but it happens.

[dembethewarrior]

It's no crime debating things on a message board and on a civil basis, you know. Try it sometime.

I see you took my post the wrong way.

Oh well.

[dembethewarrior]

Exactly that.

It isn't a case of being right and wrong.
Everybody isn't right 100% of the time either.

If you can't discuss/debate it here then where can you?

I do think some mix up support at the stadium with discussing topics on message boards though but it happens.

In this case, I was referring to the person TBG was talking to, I thought TBG was right but the person then replied with a different view to what they originally started with, seemed like moving the goal posts as not to lose, hence my reply to TBG who although usually rather intelligent, seems to have gotten a little sensitive to my reply, judging from the response I got. Oooooh bitchy.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

In this case, I was referring to the person TBG was talking to, I thought TBG was right but the person then replied with a different view to what they originally started with, seemed like moving the goal posts as not to lose, hence my reply to TBG who although usually rather intelligent, seems to have gotten a little sensitive to my reply, judging from the response I got. Oooooh bitchy.

Laughing here, dembe, old fruit - and accompanied with apologies from yours truly

[dembethewarrior]

Laughing here, dembe, old fruit - and accompanied with apologies from yours truly

I understand the confusion as I replied to you and the post had no indication what the **** I was talking about

[Taunton Blue Genie]

I understand the confusion as I replied to you and the post had no indication what the **** I was talking about

Splendid. We are all chums again! Thank the Lord.....

[dembethewarrior]

Splendid. We are all chums again! Thank the Lord.....

Not that it matters to most, but generally I am always friends on here. A lot gets lost in translation when you type, me and my mate had a chat about it Sunday after we had disagreement/misunderstanding on the Saturday and talked it through over txt. He said to me Sunday that I was pissed off Saturday and replying in an angry manner etc, which was all laughed off when we saw each other on the Sunday and things were explained better dace to face..

Not sure why I've typed that out but it seemed relevant before I started to ramble.