The Two-faced, hypocritical Buffoon and his Party set for a Mauling at PMQ's Today..

[Croesy Blue]

No not at all .
If YOU dont vote Labour how the **** are they ever going to get back in ?
Indirectly you will be helping the Tories.
We need some kind of opposition or the excesses of the Tories behaviour will get worse and worse.
There , now you have done it . I have joined in .
Should still be in politics forum

It is a good point though! One I've struggled with. Are we better off voting for a party we don't really agree with to keep one we don't really like out of power.

Is anything else a wasted vote or is too many people doing tactical voting stopping the growth of a 3rd party.

If this was in the politics forum this discussion would never have happened so that's why it shouldn't be moved

[Tuerto]

No not at all .
If YOU dont vote Labour how the **** are they ever going to get back in ?
Indirectly you will be helping the Tories.
We need some kind of opposition or the excesses of the Tories behaviour will get worse and worse.
There , now you have done it . I have joined in .
Should still be in politics forum

It's a fair response Jim, and one that I wrestle with.

[the other bob wilson]

It's a fair response Jim, and one that I wrestle with.

Jimmy can see it, but I’m sometimes not sure a majority of Labour members can.

[chrisp_1927]

I don't understand why it's funny? Labour are basically slightly left leaning at the moment based on their policies aren't they.

I would rather a more left wing party too, I think it would really benefit the country. It'd never get in though is the issue so centre left is the best we could ever hope for.

How about if Labour promised to go after the ingrained wealth in the country. Nationalise the assets of grosvenor estates, earl of Plymouth etc. All these scumbags who have billions and billions of land because 800 years ago their ancestors knew the Queen. Personally , my impression of the Labour Party is that if you work hard and earn good money they will tax the hell out of you. But they're no better at taxing the super rich than the tories are. At least the tories are upfront about their bootlicking subservience to the super rich 🤣.

A pitch of ' we're going after unfair wealth to help us all, but if you work hard we'll leave you alone' . It would certainly get my vote.




Then again, my ideal vision of politics would be about 6 months of bloodthirsty communism, kill the royals, aristocracy, the lot. Then 50 years of centre right government. I think I'm in a minority of 1 with this view!! 🤣

[Croesy Blue]

How about if Labour promised to go after the ingrained wealth in the country. Nationalise the assets of grosvenor estates, earl of Plymouth etc. All these scumbags who have billions and billions of land because 800 years ago their ancestors knew the Queen. Personally , my impression of the Labour Party is that if you work hard and earn good money they will tax the hell out of you. But they're no better at taxing the super rich than the tories are. At least the tories are upfront about their bootlicking subservience to the super rich ��.

A pitch of ' we're going after unfair wealth to help us all, but if you work hard we'll leave you alone' . It would certainly get my vote.

Who do you know has worked hard and who hasn't though? How do you account for people who've inherited money or had expensive public schooling and have done better because of that?

The probalem is with all of this it ignores that some people have an easier start to life and a headstart and others don't.

I don't actually think Labour wants to go after people who work hard they actually want to go after the very people you want them to go after. That's why the media are so against them, or any non tory party.

The tories actually go after the real hard workers, hence the squeezed middle and work classes while multi millionaires get away with everything.

The problems in our country start and end with inequality.

[Doucas]

I believe in conservative values...
Reward people that go out to work.
A benefits system that's fair for the people that need it while also fair for the people that pay for it.
Ask not what your country can do for you bit what you can do for your country.
Fack socialism. Fack unions, fack scroungers.
Fack the can't work won't work brigade.
If immigrants want to come over here to work, welcome them with open arms, if they want to come over here for a free council house, nhs treatments and knock babies out and not pay thier way, then send em back.
Reward large companies with better tax schemes for them creating jobs.
Reward entrepreneurship.
Etc.

I'm a proud fully paid up member me, I get a monthly newsletter off boris , cheese n wine nights with our local MP.
Had a pint with Cameron in Cardiff.
Got a signed copy of maggies autobiography.

Boris is a vote winner.
If there was an election now he'd blast it.

There's plenty of support for the Tories on twitter.
Every lefty / South walian going into blame hysterics over this party that may or may not have happened and I bet every single one of them broke some covid rule in last 2 years or so.
I'll call anyone a liar if they say different.

Didn't break one house gathering rule?
Didn't break one mask wearing rule?
Didn't break one social distancing rule?
Didn't hug someone when they shouldn't have?

Fack off mun

This is a joke right? Rewarding people who work? Have you seen how much wages have stagnated since 2010?

Beyond deluded.

[Dorcus]

Apart from political viewpoints, there is 1 major drawback i see with Corbyn, one that is most definitely shared with Boris. I just think they're both quite stupid people, I've never really got a feeling that either of them have the iq or ability to learn that a leader needs. I wonder if some of the cock ups Boris makes are down to him being too stupid to understand what needs doing, I personally think corbyn would have had the same problem.

I do think that corbynism had an overall positive effect on the country mind. Certainly made both parties realise that there was an appetite with large sections of the population for an increase in public spending

Agree on your last point

[Dorcus]

This is a joke right? Rewarding people who work? Have you seen how much wages have stagnated since 2010?

Beyond deluded.

I've never ever met anyone who has ever made money through hard work but I've met plenty who have sitting on their fat arses and getting poor simpletons to do the graft.

I wonder how many Miners there have been over the years who sweated and toiled in miserable and gruelling conditions for hours on end who have ended up as millionaires, let alone billionaires? On the other hand I've known plenty whose health has been utterly ravaged for the sake of making others very wealthy.

[Dorcus]

Ive always voted Labour or PC in the past ( apart from the last GE ), used to be a Union rep for the GMB, Starmer appeals to be more than Corbyn ever did ( but that might be due to the right wing controlled media I read )

Fair play on admitting that Matt👍

[blue matt]

Fair play on admitting that Matt��

Ive mentioned it in the past aswell

ironically from a personal point of view, voting labour last GE when Corbyn was offering no university fee's would have saved me a massive chunk of money's, but thats another discussion

[Doucas]

I've never ever met anyone who has ever made money through hard work but I've met plenty who have sitting on their fat arses and getting poor simpletons to do the graft.

I wonder how many Miners there have been over the years who sweated and toiled in miserable and gruelling conditions for hours on end who have ended up as millionaires, let alone billionaires? On the other hand I've known plenty whose health has been utterly ravaged for the sake of making others very wealthy.

Exactly, I've earned more from investments this year than I have my salary, it's a joke that I don't have to pay more tax on it than I do.

[Elwood Blues]

Exactly, I've earned more from investments this year than I have my salary, it's a joke that I don't have to pay more tax on it than I do.

No excuses.

When the revolution comes you will be on the list

[chrisp_1927]

Who do you know has worked hard and who hasn't though? How do you account for people who've inherited money or had expensive public schooling and have done better because of that?

The probalem is with all of this it ignores that some people have an easier start to life and a headstart and others don't.

I don't actually think Labour wants to go after people who work hard they actually want to go after the very people you want them to go after. That's why the media are so against them, or any non tory party.

The tories actually go after the real hard workers, hence the squeezed middle and work classes while multi millionaires get away with everything.

The problems in our country start and end with inequality.

Essentially I'm talking about going after the landowners the earls etc. These throwbacks to feudal Britain that still control billions of wealth. I personally think that would have huge public support. The fact that they still exist in a developed, modern country is utterly baffling.

You're entirely right about certain people having a headstart over others. But most of them are still tiny fry compared to the few ultra wealthy.

If we nationalised grosvenor estates and Crown estates we could probably pay off the national debt. We need a good grass roots campaign to go after the bastards

[MacAdder]

I've never ever met anyone who has ever made money through hard work but I've met plenty who have sitting on their fat arses and getting poor simpletons to do the graft.

I wonder how many Miners there have been over the years who sweated and toiled in miserable and gruelling conditions for hours on end who have ended up as millionaires, let alone billionaires? On the other hand I've known plenty whose health has been utterly ravaged for the sake of making others very wealthy.

Exactly, I've earned more from investments this year than I have my salary, it's a joke that I don't have to pay more tax on it than I do.

WTF

[Dorcus]

WTF

Ha ha, I noticed that myself 😳

[Doucas]

WTF

I used to work with a guy who called me dorcas just to annoy me, honestly thought it was him with an account just to wind me up.

[Dorcus]

I used to work with a guy who called me dorcas just to annoy me, honestly thought it was him with an account just to wind me up.

No, not guilty, it was my grandfather's middle name 🌞

[Tuerto]

Jimmy can see it, but I’m sometimes not sure a majority of Labour members can.

The majority of members were enthusiastic and supporting of Corbyn.The parliamentary members were not. Maybe it's the other way round?

[Jimmy the Jock]

The majority of members were enthusiastic and supporting of Corbyn.The parliamentary members were not. Maybe it's the other way round?

Labour are dead if they cant portray sensible middle of the road policies added to good fiscal policies, that are believable.
Thats what the public want and they need the general public on side to get re elected.
By all means have a left leaning once they get in , but keep it quiet on the road in .
Kier Stammer has to be believable as well . People have to have faith in him .

Labour party members alone will not get the labour government back in power.

[jon1959]

Labour are dead if they cant portray sensible middle of the road policies added to good fiscal policies, that are believable.
Thats what the public want and they need the general public on side to get re elected.
By all means have a left leaning once they get in , but keep it quiet on the road in .
Kier Stammer has to be believable as well . People have to have faith in him .

Labour party members alone will not get the labour government back in power.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7731536.html

Labour's 2017 Manifesto was very popular - and Labour got 40% of the vote (Tories 43%).

Radical policies - especially around tax, investment and public ownership - do not deter most people.

In 2019 Labour crashed to 32% of the vote - with a similar Manifesto apart from an incoherent Brexit policy.

Radical policies added to a fence sitting, garbled mess of a Brexit policy - and a further 2 years of media and PLP vilification of the prospective alternative Prime Minister who didn't help himself - do deter most people.

It also helps to have a large and active membership - not one where one third have been driven out by the party leadership (purges, policy vacuums, incompetence and lies) and those that remain are demoralised and directionless.

[dml1954]

Labour are dead if they cant portray sensible middle of the road policies added to good fiscal policies, that are believable.
Thats what the public want and they need the general public on side to get re elected.
By all means have a left leaning once they get in , but keep it quiet on the road in .
Kier Stammer has to be believable as well . People have to have faith in him .

Labour party members alone will not get the labour government back in power.

So the master plan to get Labour elected would be to lie to voters about policies and the ability of its leader to lead the country. Sorry but thats already been done to death.

[the other bob wilson]

The majority of members were enthusiastic and supporting of Corbyn.The parliamentary members were not. Maybe it's the other way round?

I'm talking about their seeming inability to recognise who it is that they should be opposing. The left and right factions are as bad as each other,

[life on mars]

Labour are dead if they cant portray sensible middle of the road policies added to good fiscal policies, that are believable.
Thats what the public want and they need the general public on side to get re elected.
By all means have a left leaning once they get in , but keep it quiet on the road in .
Kier Stammer has to be believable as well . People have to have faith in him .

Labour party members alone will not get the labour government back in power.

Your last line is spot on .

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

So the master plan to get Labour elected would be to lie to voters about policies and the ability of its leader to lead the country. Sorry but thats already been done to death.

That's right , it's exactly what the Tories have done ✔

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Your last line is spot on .

Indeed he is

To get left of centre politics we need to get elected first

Nobody is going to elect labour now , its completely full of holes and sinking