Reply With QuoteIt’s no the Welsh language bit I’m not fussed on , it’s the minority Indy elementOriginally Posted by Llanishen Bull
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They hardly make you do a Welsh written test and show a Plaid Cymru membership card before entry to the stadium, one Welsh song is being sung. Honestly if that's putting you off going to the games then you probably didn't want to go that much in the first place
It’s no the Welsh language bit I’m not fussed on , it’s the minority Indy element
Probably 70/80% of them support English teams.
When I was in Dublin I was speaking to this guy from Wrexham.He supported Everton.I said ever thought of supporting your home town team.He went off on some rant about South Wales having everything.
I assumed this was behind the queues before most Wales games.
As opposed to England? Also, Cardiff is the capital and SE Wales has about half of the population. North Wales also has something we don't. Wrexham.
The Welsh language is one of the few 'minority' languages in Europe to survive into the 21st Century. Was my wife's 1st language, and on my mother's side back 2 generations, the only language, so I have no problems with efforts to keep it alive and flourishing.
What does annoy me is how Welsh is put ahead of English in anything Government related. I ring the doctors [in Cardiff] and it's Welsh first, English second. When you consider there's more than a 1000 X more posts on this board than the Welsh version, it's plainly done for cultural/political reasons.
Or it’s done to keep the Welsh language where it should be, pride and place above all other languages in Wales, every little helps
What's the matter with nationalism in football? Anything that raises awareness about Welsh nationalism is fine by me. There are 56 million people in England and they are in control of 533 of the 650 parliamentary seats. That's how we ended up with over 10 years of Thatcher followed by another 7 of John Major. Does anyone remember what Wales was like back then? Cardiff was a provincial backwater that was closed on Sundays. People in the valleys had to survive on food banks. Barry was a dump.
I do think there is a growing nationalist element within Wales' support and personally I don't like some elements of it - we talked on here before about yma o hyd and thats a song I like musically but I was a tad uncomfortable with it. I've changed my opinion on that. I think delmbox and others rightly pointed out that we shouldnt take things so literally, and I agree. I didn't sing it on sunday mainly because in my head the words are "wanktimus spanktimus maximus, bubblyboo yma ooo hyd..." Anyway, I digress..
I don't like the Gareth Bale song (I dont think the FAW do either) as talking about 'fking a flag' is just a bit weird and unsavoury but equally I had mates last week happy to wave a union flag bunting on friday who belted it out on sunday, so again, we are looking too much into it.
There are probably some who use the national team as a bit of a vehicle to push an agenda and some nationalists who follow the team more now than they did, and I guess that's fine but I do think the FAW should be awake to it as these things can be divisive and the national team is for everyone in Wales, most of whom share an identity that support some kind of political union other than independence. We are nothing like Northern Ireland, but the Irish FA will obviously give a lot more thought than most on their messaging and I think it's something we should keep in mind. Certainly if I was at the FAW I would keep an eye on it to prevent it becoming an issue in the future.
I suppose that depends on how you define nationalism.
I'd hazard a guess that most of us would regard the 2016 Euro's quarter-final victory over Belgium as our national team's greatest-ever result. When you consider that all three of the Wales goals were scored by Englishmen, the notion of nationalism in football seems more than a little daft.
Cue Grangetown Blue in 3...2...1......
It's very difficult to understand what precise version of national identity people want when following Wales.
Twenty or thirty years ago going away was a bit like being a poor man's England but with greater factionalism. Dambusters songs in Nuremberg. Crews fighting each other on bridges in Milan. OK that was a product of its age but the difference between my trip to Wroclaw and Warsaw 20 years ago could not be more marked.
Bucket hats are not for me but they give those following the team an identity. It's a different take on Stadium Welsh than Daffodil faces and Max Boyce leeks but I prefer it. All those who come North/South in droves for home games, percentagewise many more speaking Welsh than within the City deserve a voice.
People express a sense of belonging in different ways. The current way with Welsh football seems inclusive and tolerant. You don't have to join some nationalistic sect who wants to burn someone's 2nd home to belt out Yma o Hyd.
It feels like every game at the moment is a celebration of being Welsh and Wales doing it on the big stage, that should be embraced really regardless of your wider stance.
Well, I obviously don't mean nationalism in the exclusionary sense. I just mean pride in who we are and what we can achieve.
Sat next to a person on Sunday who had the red shirt and bucket hat on . Got talking, told me he was a Man united season ticket holder. Part time Nationalist.
What did he do for the rest of the time?
Perhaps not, but the song's author has a conviction for defacing English-language road signs and it's pretty obvious who he's referring to when he's singing about 'everyone and everything'.
To be honest, I've got no real problem with it. Despite having been to a great many Wales games over the years, I don't go to many these days, so it doesn't really affect me. The sense of duty I once felt has long since passed and international football doesn't interest me anywhere near as much as it once did. But I do find the Welsh nationalist thing amusing and more than a little ironic given the make-up of the Wales team in recent years and the fact that all of our top clubs play in the English league system.
For all the hyperbole isn't that the point. Bit of Dafydd, bit of one nil to the sheepshaggers, a couple of Welsh hymns interspersed with whatever Zombie Nation called Zombie Nation and some Andy Williams. It doesn't try to exclude anyone. I've been home and abroad over the last decade and heard no-one think that English born players in the squad are mercenaries like Vinny Jones or Taff Van Den Hauwe. The vibe is refreshing and I love going to matches even though a home game is 120 miles away. There is far more positive singing than anti-English than in an average City game and all the clubs you remember are still in the English league pyramid. Give it a go.
Never looked upon supporting club or country as a duty more of a pleasure I'd call it.
It's a national team.
It wasnt long ago only god save the queen would be played before wales games and not hen wlad fy nhadau. Not long at all.
We should never forget its an anomaly from history we have our own team at all. We get special status to be allowed to have a team.
The mere existence of Wales having a football team is in itself political.
I was going to post very similar sentiments myself
Sound like there are two of you who have no real problem with it then!I was going to post very similar sentiments myself
I know you’re just trying to stir the pot but it’s a bit of cheap point with everything that has gone on in general the last six years. People are more than entitled to think a certain way at this point in time and I don’t think it’s undermined by either of the points you mentioned.
If anything it should be a good thing that people are engaging regardless of which side of the line they’re on.
It's a national team.
It wasnt long ago only god save the queen would be played before wales games and not hen wlad fy nhadau. Not long at all.
We should never forget its an anomaly from history we have our own team at all. We get special status to be allowed to have a team.
The mere existence of Wales having a football team is in itself political.I don't understand why national teams are now nationalist, its a mystery
Seems like it's a choice between the conservatism of identifying as british, general apathy (aka TLG) , or feeling a sense of common belonging owing to the things that make us culturally unique.
At a football match involving a football team that represents this common sense of identity, I guess it's natural that people feel empowered and inspired to express their hopes for emancipation. It seems entirely natural.
It seems silly on the other hand to go a to a Welsh football match and expect everyone to politely avoid making any reference to independence or the language in case they offend someone who finds naturally occurring things like languages and cultural identity annoying.
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