Here we go again..
Thoughts? Pro's? Con's?
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Here we go again..
Thoughts? Pro's? Con's?
One of the key reasons Scotland voted to remain in the UK was so there wasn't a risk of them leaving the EU. They've been dragged out against their will so can't blame them for wanting another vote.
Ideal timing for the SNP. Never in recent decades has there been so much dissatisfaction with Westminster and it should be all to their advantage.
I have family in Scotland. Some pro indy, some not.
It strikes me as very similar to brexit, very little strength to the economic case, mostly ideologically driven and flag waving. The argument for freedom/self-governance is probably stronger than brexit however given the greater control Westminster has over Scotland.
This is probably their window though. They would have absolutely no chance of winning a vote under a non-tory UK government.
Considering that the Conservatives secured more seats than the Labour party in the 2021 Scottish election, I'm not sure.Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
It doesn't indicate any great enthusiasm for the Labour party.
I think it's marvelous. Brexit has been predicted to be the catalyst for the break up of the UK. Why on Earth didn't Wales follow our Celtic cousins in voting against it instead of supporting the little Englander mentality?
Because that's not what Brexit was ever about, which you should know by now given it's been 6 years.
I won't point out the irony of you supporting someone leaving a union whilst also bemoaning others for wanting to leave a union..
That's not irony - are you sure you know what it means?
There is no contradiction here either, it is perfectly reasonable to think that one union is beneficial to you and another not or no longer is.
Nobody is saying that there is "irony" in Ukraine wanting to leave the USSR and later wanting to join the EU?
Another of your absurd comparisons. Which one is the UK in this? The USSR? It's true of course, unions differ, but it doesn't make the situation without irony as nearly every argument that Scotland will use to leave the UK will be a reversal of those used to remain in the EU. Sturgeons words will be used against her.
If you can't see any irony here, thats up to you I guess. (The irony goes both ways btw, including for those arguing we are stronger together as the UK, but advocating more political freedom by leaving the EU)
I'm not comparing anyone to the USSR, I'm merely pointing out it is perfectly possible to want to be in one union and not in another, there doesn't have to be any contradiction, if you feel one is beneficial to you and one is not.
Using Ukraine is a classic example of a strawman. You're comparing a dictatorship with a democratic institution. You cannot directly relate leaving the UK/joining the EU to what you have proposed.
As for Wales, we currently have more representation in the UK Parliament than we would in the EU Parliament, so I'm not really sure we'd be better off or have as much of a voice as we have now. We've also seen the cluster**** that's the Northern Ireland protocol...imagine what would happen if the rump UK didn't have to cater for both sides (which is the case for Wales as we don't have 17th century sectarian lines throughout our society)
I wasn't convinced leaving the EU was sensible and I'm not convinced leaving the UK would be either.
Good luck to them if they leave. Thou I reckon reunification in Ireland will come first. Bunglecnuts latest ruse to trash the protocol goes against the wishes of the majority and panders to an ever declining troop of crackpot dup/tuv bigots. He's even managed to pee off the moderate alliance vote. Which could be a disaster for the union, if they and their base embrace unity then it's game over.
Good post, spot on.
I've got to the point where I think we should just let them get on with it but leaving the union must mean exactly that, with all the ramifications that that will entail.
Yeah but if we were talking second preference by SNP voters then labour destroys the Tories. There is a clear majority for a centre left government in Scotland and if they get that in Westminster then the floaters in any independence vote wouldn't need risk voting yes.
Funnily enough, probably the best way to win back seats in Scotland from the SNP is a LAB/SNP coalition where the SNP bargain for a vote and independence loses. That would end the argument for a good while but would be a massive risk for Labour.
The question of independence will be decided on by a referendum rather than by the number of seats secured in the Scottish parliament though.
Thanks captain obvious. The 'we don't want to be ruled by Westminster' sentiment, that some people who might vote for independence have, changes based on how well Westminster aligns with their political views.
Obviously as I said above, the core vote for independence is ideological, but this core vote isn't large enough to win on its own.
Thanks for the epithet. A tad unnecessary perhaps.
Unnecessary like telling me that a referendum will decide whether they go independent or not?
Well that is what the thread is all about and I didn't make a personal remark.
She has not other policy and its masks there appalling drugs , education and health problems , read up on the Scottish ferry issue, the only thing keeping her in power the hatred of the English .
Let them go and deal with their budget deficits ,last year was 36.3 billion British pounds, that was with 12 billion extra for Covid , there was a 15.8 billion pounds the previous year,
Gosh nationalism ??
How did Labour let this happen ( Blair devolution perhaps ) the party was born there and ruled it ,not liked now though why ??
Have you not seen the British deficit/debt?
And the UK probably has the better chance of pulling that back , I very much doubt Scotland could on their own .
Yes. What is your point? In the past 20 years we've had the financial crash and Covid. Is there any wonder the debt has risen. The deficit is now starting to come down so in real terms the debt will fall.
I always thought the left were happy for government borrowing if it meant better benefits and services. during Covid this current Tory government actually went centre left on us with the free money they were giving away.
Your comments go to show its not about borrowing etc, its about being against the politics of your adversary.
Does it really bother you that much if someone calls you a pretty non offensive name?
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