Reply With QuoteThey didn’t even hide it in the end. Rotten to its core.Originally Posted by splott parker
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Just to confirm, are you saying the UK had no debt prior to Covid?
They didn’t even hide it in the end. Rotten to its core.
No, I'm saying it got much worse, having generally reduced since 2008.
These are facts. You can't dispute them anymore than you can claim City beat Liverpool in the 2012 league cup final
What on earth are you jabbering on about? Do you know anyone who received furlough payments? I know several dozen. Without govt support they would be out of a job.
Every govt would have done it, but the fact it was a Tory govt that provided it, doesn't mean it didnt happen (save for a few bizarre corners of the internet that dwell in a weird left wing dis-reality)
They still did it.
When my 6 year old daughter crosses the road, its my duty to help her. I do it. It doesn't mean someone is reasonable to call me a c**t for doing it.
The govt (ie, us) supported millions of jobs that otherwise would have gone to the wall. Thats a fact. It's a validation of your politics so support it. It's embarrassing that you dont just because it was a Conservative govt
I gather it's been emotional but "any strike action?"
They supported the jobs to keep the economy going Linus, not out off the goodness of their heart.
The rail network also had to keep running to get key workers to work.
It isn't though, you're showing your economic illiteracy again. You've just made this up.The debt is almost entirely due to helping people get through Covid.
You want the government to help people
They helped people
You moan that helping people costs money.
i've noticed he comes out quite often with that line about the Government seemingly doing something exceptional by channelling funding towards industry and the general population during the lockdowns. Does he really think that the situation would have been different if one or mote of the opposition parties had been in power at that time? Was there any other western democracy out there that just turned their back on the population and said let them cope as best they can?
You're claiming that our national debt was reduced from 2008? Sure about that?
You really are an arse licking Tory knob, aren’t you. Are you honestly disputing the well known fact that contracts/orders etc were awarded to business folk who were very close allies, even family members of Tory ministers? Furlough payments were made and had to be made regardless of who was in power, it wasn’t a hand out, it was a necessity. But!! The big winners were mates who had their nests feathered very dodgily.
It's not the 70's / 80's no more
Believe it or not it is very difficult to go on strike these days after Thatcher got here teeth into the miners
It's a last resort these days compared to back in the day of shouting all out ...............
People are on their financial knees. How long should they wait?
It's nothing to do with it. I am just living in the real world. I also applaud Macrons centrist government for doing similar and Spains socialist government. And all the others.
You just ignore that millions were kept in work because it's inconvenient, and focus on gossip. I can only assume you were not, nor know many people who received furlough payments?
No question, without the proper procurement processes in place, the process was exploited, but it doesn't change the bigger picture.
Why spend your life in abject bitterness, looking for negativity absolutely everywhere?
The mass increase in debt in the last 3 years is entirely down to Covid yes. Govt debt to GDP rapidly increased from 2008, peaked in 2016 and then reduced. It's jumped hugely since 2020 to fund covid support
What's your point? The government supported millions of jobs that otherwise would have ceased to exist. You claim it was to support the economy, but not out of the goodness of their hearts, but those two things aren't connected, and what the hell does it matter anyway? The fact is, millions of families stayed in work, and thats a good thing.
This happened in nearly every country, and every countries government should be applauded for doing the right thing in that respect. It says a lot about you that you cannot bring yourself to do it.
Applaud what exactly? They didn’t do anything extraordinary. As you said yourself nearly every country did the same.
The Tories are complete tossers but if they hadn't stumped up to see people through the covid crisis there would have been rioting on the streets
They had to do it , it's not as if they had a philosophical debate about it
It wasn't a political decision , it was not worthy in the same way that putting dirty clothes in the washing machine isn't worthy of praise
You just do it
No they didn't, they did their job in extraordinary circumstances like a binman does his, or a nurse does his, or a doctor does hers. What you do at least, is acknowledge it happened, and acknowledge things would have been awful for many millions of people if they hadn't. You are deep in the rabbit hole if you can't acknowledge something good. Just so infuriating, it's like debating with an old testament bible basher sometimes.
You think the Conservative government .....mostly very rich and attending parties .....did their job in extraordinary circumstances ?
This is a piss take ?
Doctors , nurses , health care workers , they were doing their jobs in extraordinary circumstances
Sunak was just giving the nod to sign over some money
He wasn't putting his life on the line , it's not good , it's a financial decision
Sunak and his crew soon cut the money to universal credit recipients......was that an act of doing good ?
No , it was a financial decision
How do you think the public would have reacted if the Government hadn't implemented some real Socialist values with the implementation of the furlough scheme? What do you think things would look like now if businesses and Employees hadn't had some help financially? People were in a position where they would not have been able to feed their kids, pay for shelter, heating, water etc. You make it sound like the Government gave us all a months holiday in Ibiza! Either way, this money would have had to be spent, whether through benefits or directly through Employers. I would bet that it was cheaper to go through Employers. The state had to act, they really had no option, there was no alternative.
Sludge, what I mean is that the coronavirus was extraordinary circumstances..for all governments.
I don't disagree with you at all.
I'm just recognising it happened, and recognising it was the right thing to do. The furlough scheme etc should be supported across the political spectrum, so recognising who delivered it and how is the right thing to do.
And thats the context of the train strikes - that industry and workers has benefitted from that extraordinary support, and otherwise, at the passenger levels we saw in 2020/21, there would have been no money to pay their wages.
Thats my point, thats the difference and why I don't support these strikes.
Absolutely, but something like Covid would have been planned for ,there would have been legislation in place, there would have been scenarios made up with action plans and all that.
I'm sure there was a loose plan for what happens in the event of a pandemic as there is if there was a nuclear strike on the UK, or if the UK was invaded or if an asteroid hit earth.
But all plans go out the back door when something happens and you can never fully know a scenario. Covid took the world by surprise.
That said, we could have prepared more, I agree, and we should have locked down a little earlier (although it would have made no difference long term) but given the fact the country did lock down, furlough was created, a vaccine delivered within a year etc does show a fairly quick moving state to me.
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