Yes The Ukraine War Is Still On

[Citizen's Nephew]

Not about Zelensky being installed by the CIA, but the rest, yes, i agree. Putin is Scum and should never had invaded, but what we are seeing is the outright provocation of Russia by the west.

I find it revealing that nobody has commented on the Clare Daly speech.

We're all allegedly behind Ukraine. The key word is behind. Pushing. It's a war. We should try and stop wars. We're not doing that. We're profiting from supplying arms in the meantime and then there'll be the inevitable re-build. We all know there are only two possible outcomes. 1. Diplomatic end and a stop to the killing and slaughter (it's no good yelling "he started it" that's why we need diplomacy) or 2. The West need to stop being hypocrites and fight alongside Ukraine. This risks WWIII and Nuclear war. So 1. is the only way forward.

[blue matt]

I find it revealing that nobody has commented on the Clare Daly speech.

We're all allegedly behind Ukraine. The key word is behind. Pushing. It's a war. We should try and stop wars. We're not doing that. We're profiting from supplying arms in the meantime and then there'll be the inevitable re-build. We all know there are only two possible outcomes. 1. Diplomatic end and a stop to the killing and slaughter (it's no good yelling "he started it" that's why we need diplomacy) or 2. The West need to stop being hypocrites and fight alongside Ukraine. This risks WWIII and Nuclear war. So 1. is the only way forward.

But No1 is a no-go, you think Putin wants to sit down for a Diplomatic chat ( Didnt Macron try that at the start ) Putin doesn't want to chat, he wants to control the Dombas and Luhansk regions ( or the south and east area's if you want ) and then move and take it all
a diplomatic view might be the Ukrainians give him th South and east and should be happy with that, but it'll only be a matter of time till the troops and missiles are heading inwards to whole of the country, Putin knows the west doesn't want to get ' too involved " as it'll start WW3 and he has Nukes, so he can do what he likes

[Citizen's Nephew]

But No1 is a no-go, you think Putin wants to sit down for a Diplomatic chat ( Didnt Macron try that at the start ) Putin doesn't want to chat, he wants to control the Dombas and Luhansk regions ( or the south and east area's if you want ) and then move and take it all
a diplomatic view might be the Ukrainians give him th South and east and should be happy with that, but it'll only be a matter of time till the troops and missiles are heading inwards to whole of the country, Putin knows the west doesn't want to get ' too involved " as it'll start WW3 and he has Nukes, so he can do what he likes

If 1. is a no go and 2. is a no go.....then what exactly is the plan?

[Lither_1927]

The civilians he is killing right now are ethnic Russians, the troops are a mixture of Ukrainians and ethnic Russians. We currently have around 70 refugees, the are almost all ethnic Russians, all women & children whose Russian ethnic fathers, husbands, sons are either dead or fighting against Russia.

Please stop talking out of your arse.

Stop thinking that your anecdotal evidence is the full picture. It's not. Russia are not targeting civilians, if they were, they'd have flattened kiev with cruise missiles.

[blue matt]

If 1. is a no go and 2. is a no go.....then what exactly is the plan?

Get behind Ukraine as we are now it seems and hope they can defeat Russia and push them back

[Lither_1927]

But No1 is a no-go, you think Putin wants to sit down for a Diplomatic chat ( Didnt Macron try that at the start ) Putin doesn't want to chat, he wants to control the Dombas and Luhansk regions ( or the south and east area's if you want ) and then move and take it all
a diplomatic view might be the Ukrainians give him th South and east and should be happy with that, but it'll only be a matter of time till the troops and missiles are heading inwards to whole of the country, Putin knows the west doesn't want to get ' too involved " as it'll start WW3 and he has Nukes, so he can do what he likes

What have Russian officials said that make you think that? If Macron came out and guaranteed that Ukraine wouldn't join Nato or the EU then i'd have more sympathy for your point. He hasn't done that.

[Lither_1927]

When you use the term " Buying influence " do you mean giving aid to ? ? ?

the Ukraine is well down on the list of countries the US gives aid to, its only a few places above Russia, under $ 100 mill separates them, in the past 20 years the US has sent Russia over $ 3 Billion to help with social and economic projects, which is very close to the $ 5 bill its sent the Ukraine in 34 years

You seem to think American money going to Ukraine is out of the goodness of their hearts. How naive, it's geo political weapon to spread influence of the American empire. Let's say Ukraine pledged 100% alleigence to Russia, the "aid" would probably stop over night.

[Lither_1927]

Get behind Ukraine as we are now it seems and hope they can defeat Russia and push them back

So you're happy for the West to keep pumping arms into the Ukraine and fight until the last Ukrainian life? all because the Nato and EU fanatics want to expand all over the Russian European border and control Ukrainian agriculture.

[blue matt]

You seem to think American money going to Ukraine is out of the goodness of their hearts. How naive, it's geo political weapon to spread influence of the American empire. Let's say Ukraine pledged 100% alleigence to Russia, the "aid" would probably stop over night.

you appear to have missed the $3 Billion going to Russia over the last 20 years

The US has a massive foreign aid program, you must be pretty sceptical to think its all a geopolitical weapon to spread influence of the American empire

In Ukraines case, of course they didnt want the Ukraine to fail in its independence after breaking away from the USSR, why would they ( or the west )

[Lither_1927]

He can’t help it….young Russians sent to their deaths, 1000’s of them…..plenty more to come too

Yes the war is terrible, both sides are losing 1,000s of men. I want it to stop and offering solutions/ideas. You're behind the American empires efforts to prolong the war and waste every last Ukrainian life in their persuit of dominance and Russian humiliation.

[blue matt]

So you're happy for the West to keep pumping arms into the Ukraine and fight until the last Ukrainian life? all because the Nato and EU fanatics want to expand all over the Russian European border and control Ukrainian agriculture.

so when Russia controls the Ukraine, either by negotiations or by force, they get swallowed up into Russia , guess what, Ukraine has 4 EU countries on its border Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania

lets go back to the Putin invaded Ukraine argument because it didnt want Ukraine to join the EU and Nato and have a EU / NATO member on its doorstep, remember that argument about provocation ? ? ?

So are you happy to allow that to happen and have Putin provoked by 4 borders ( make it 5 when Finland joins Nato ), what will his play be then ? ?

but to your question, as long as the Ukraine wants the west help, then yes I am

[Citizen's Nephew]

Get behind Ukraine as we are now it seems and hope they can defeat Russia and push them back

But that's the status quo Matt. There has to be a diplomatic end to this. People make comparisons to Poland '39 but there are none. This is a fustercluck. Ukraine and its people will be destroyed. These politicians need to stop waving their dicks at each other.

[blue matt]

But that's the status quo Matt. There has to be a diplomatic end to this. People make comparisons to Poland '39 but there are none. This is a fustercluck. Ukraine and its people will be destroyed. These politicians need to stop waving their dicks at each other.

It is the status quo, yes

but as Option 1 is a no-go, and even if it did work, Putin will know he can march into another country as we won't go with option 2

I pointed out above

so when Russia controls the Ukraine, either by negotiations or by force, they get swallowed up into Russia , guess what, Ukraine has 4 EU countries on its border Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania

lets go back to the Putin invaded Ukraine argument because it didnt want Ukraine to join the EU and Nato and have a EU / NATO member on its doorstep, remember that argument about provocation ? ? ?

[Lither_1927]

so when Russia controls the Ukraine, either by negotiations or by force, they get swallowed up into Russia , guess what, Ukraine has 4 EU countries on its border Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania

lets go back to the Putin invaded Ukraine argument because it didnt want Ukraine to join the EU and Nato and have a EU / NATO member on its doorstep, remember that argument about provocation ? ? ?

So are you happy to allow that to happen and have Putin provoked by 4 borders ( make it 5 when Finland joins Nato ), what will his play be then ? ?

but to your question, as long as the Ukraine wants the west help, then yes I am

There are no sizable Russian minorities in Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania.

The fact America sends a few billion to Russia proves they're trying to buy influence.

Do you know anything about the Minsk agreement 1 and 2?

[Canton Kev]

Still no links huh?

[Packerman]

There are no sizable Russian minorities in Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania.

The fact America sends a few billion to Russia proves they're trying to buy influence.

Do you know anything about the Minsk agreement 1 and 2?

So how about the the Baltic states? they have sizeable Russian minorities, they next? will that be ok by you?

[blue matt]

There are no sizable Russian minorities in Hungary, Poland, Slovakia and Romania.

The fact America sends a few billion to Russia proves they're trying to buy influence.

Do you know anything about the Minsk agreement 1 and 2?

So America is trying to buy influence in Russia, thats never going to work is it, not sure they are that Naive

Yes, I had heard of the Minsk 1 and 2 agreement, the 1st didnt work, the 2nd nearly touched the issue and never worked either, Russian backed separatists never really took notice of it, I wonder why ? ? ? did they know they had the full support of Russia behind them and the Aszov were never going to give it up, they were fighting for their country ( though I am sure you will say that version of events are from pro EU MSM and wrong )

[Dorcus]

Christ almighty on a bike...i thought organ and mozzer were ott but you've set a new standard. The healthy didn't take the vaccine to protect themselves but for their elderly loved ones. that's why the world went into lockdown...to protect the vunerable not you, you dozy twonk.

It's Ayn Rand on steroids

[Lither_1927]

It's Ayn Rand on steroids

it's not Randian to reject an experimental vaccine.

I'm not a Rand fanatic anyway, if you followed carefully what i type you'd realise this.

[Lither_1927]

Why have you continuously ignored requests for links to some appropriate evidence?

Hello Kev, here we have a leaked phone call between the US state department and the American ambassador in Ukraine. It's from 2014 when the Moscow loyal government was violently over-thrown by a CIA/George Soros led coup.

In this phone call the senior American officials are clearly choosing who they will install as their puppet leader in Ukraine. You won't hear about this on the BBC though.
https://youtu.be/WV9J6sxCs5k
Enjoy!

[Des Parrot]

[QUOTE=Lither_1927;5321996]Stop thinking that your anecdotal evidence is the full picture. It's not. Russia are not targeting civilians, if they were, they'd have flattened kiev with cruise missiles.[/QUOTE

Russia are not targeting civilians? I’d rather believe Svetlana, her daughters and grandson who fled from Kharkiv and haven’t spoken to their husband / father since April. I’m unable to explain anecdote to her, I’d be ashamed to.

[Des Parrot]

so when Russia controls the Ukraine, either by negotiations or by force, they get swallowed up into Russia , guess what, Ukraine has 4 EU countries on its border Hungary, Poland, Slovakia

He wants to free Moldova next, cutting Ukraine off from the Black Sea

[Lither_1927]

Hello Kev, here we have a leaked phone call between the US state department and the American ambassador in Ukraine. It's from 2014 when the Moscow loyal government was violently over-thrown by a CIA/George Soros led coup.

In this phone call the senior American officials are clearly choosing who they will install as their puppet leader in Ukraine. You won't hear about this on the BBC though.
https://youtu.be/WV9J6sxCs5k
Enjoy!

https://youtu.be/WV9J6sxCs5k
Democracy in action eh!

[Lither_1927]

[QUOTE=Des Parrot;5322094]

Stop thinking that your anecdotal evidence is the full picture. It's not. Russia are not targeting civilians, if they were, they'd have flattened kiev with cruise missiles.[/QUOTE

Russia are not targeting civilians? I’d rather believe Svetlana, her daughters and grandson who fled from Kharkiv and haven’t spoken to their husband / father since April. I’m unable to explain anecdote to her, I’d be ashamed to.

Civilians will be caught in cross fire or mistakes will be made during war. But Russia actively targeting Civilians, no evidence.
You haven't answered my question about Kiev, it's functioning like a normal City. If the Russians wanted to target Civilians they could flatten Kiev.

Are you aware of the Ukrainians shelling Donbass residents around 2014? Probably not, you'd rather follow the narrative that the Russians are war hungry despotic savages.

[Wash DC Blue]

He wants to free Moldova next, cutting Ukraine off from the Black Sea

Quite a large Gas Shelf off the coast of Ukraine I think.