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Thread: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

  1. #1
    First Team Heathblue's Avatar
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    Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    .

  2. #2
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Bad news.

  3. #3

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Have you noticed how Argentina , compared to Brazil has a very small black population and lots of white , blue eyed folk ?

  4. #4
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    El Loco: 'A mix of Boris Johnson and killer doll Chucky'!

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-he-stand-for

  5. #5

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Have you noticed how Argentina , compared to Brazil has a very small black population and lots of white , blue eyed folk ?
    You forget Brazil did once vote for Bolsanaro? Who was interestingly supported by Neymar, Rivaldo etc

  6. #6

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    I can see why they voted for something different. Quick look this morning and this is the state of the country:

    350 pesos to the dollar (was 35 in 2018)
    GDP annual growth rate -5%
    Unemployment at 6.2%
    Wage growth +13% in a year
    Inflation + 142% in a year.

    Think about some of the people posting on this thread talk about British politics and the need for change and then amplify it by those figures above..

    That's not to say he is the right change of course..

    Also I note the Guardian pressing the 'far-right' tab on their keyboard more than usual today but I'm not sure what specifically makes him such?

  7. #7
    First Team Heathblue's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    I can see why they voted for something different. Quick look this morning and this is the state of the country:

    350 pesos to the dollar (was 35 in 2018)
    GDP annual growth rate -5%
    Unemployment at 6.2%
    Wage growth +13% in a year
    Inflation + 142% in a year.

    Think about some of the people posting on this thread talk about British politics and the need for change and then amplify it by those figures above..

    That's not to say he is the right change of course..

    Also I note the Guardian pressing the 'far-right' tab on their keyboard more than usual today but I'm not sure what specifically makes him such?

    Maybe MSN covered it I'm not sure, but massive unrest in Spain last week, all over large demonstrations, those who have their home's, nice gov. pensions further topped up state pensions are getting envious that common plebs would just want the same, you are now called far right, maybe the comfy are worried that they might have to cut back? I'm just waiting for the time in Wales when enough say, I'm fed up of the shit housing conditions, I'm fed up of the shit transport system, I'm fed up of the shit roads, I'm fed up of my bins not being emptied for 3 weeks, I'm fed up my area never gets cleaned up, I've no objection to rising rates, water etc. But for the services being offered I do object, I understand that this is UK wide and not just down here but I basically see what goes on in Cardiff and not Aberdeen, I have no faith in any party it's essentially a uni party serving one set of masters, I'm pleased to see shocks to the system as in Argentina but that isn't an endorsement of the incumbent I'm just pleased people are looking at the media which is 95% owned by a few trying to shape the narrative and are saying **** you and you bullshit. Just look at this thread, the 1st thing the Factory jumped on is the color of the Argentina people, he never thought that the non white argentinians may probably have suffered more under the previous regime and voted in mass for change, this is the divide playbook currently in play and has been for quite some time,
    Call them racist
    Call them far right
    Call them anti this
    Call them anti that
    Call them scum if they do not agree with me
    Just call them anything if they think outside our rules. It worked for a long time but times are changing.
    The majority of people are good people who just want to work, contribute to society when they can and take out when they need but have differing views along the way and the only time they express their views is at a ballot box but if your views are not the correct ones!!!!!!! The name calling and the pile on starts until the person is canceled.

    I've just lost my dinner break typing this bullshit on my phone and if I've made loads of spelling errors I don't give a **** Jon 😂👍

    Back for any replies on the train this evening 😎

  8. #8

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
    I can see why they voted for something different. Quick look this morning and this is the state of the country:

    350 pesos to the dollar (was 35 in 2018)
    GDP annual growth rate -5%
    Unemployment at 6.2%
    Wage growth +13% in a year
    Inflation + 142% in a year.

    Think about some of the people posting on this thread talk about British politics and the need for change and then amplify it by those figures above..

    That's not to say he is the right change of course..

    Also I note the Guardian pressing the 'far-right' tab on their keyboard more than usual today but I'm not sure what specifically makes him such?
    For as long as I can remember - they have always had a bit of a basket case economy.
    Him getting in - I bet the Guardian journos and their readers loved that. Will give them headlines for a month of storied to sell to their listeners.

    Much the same as the DailyMail doing stories on left Govts / politicians, triggers the retired colonels of Tunbridge Wells.

    They wanted a changed and they voted for one - seemingly because the current one didnt offer them much of a plan to change things around.

  9. #9
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathblue View Post

    I've just lost my dinner break typing this bullshit on my phone and if I've made loads of spelling errors I don't give a **** Jon 😂👍

    Back for any replies on the train this evening 😎
    Hi Heathblue

    I don't care about spelling errors. I haven't called Argentinian voters racist. I do think 'El Loco' is bad news and gave a link to a profile piece to inform the discussion.

    FWIW I think a lot of your views are also loco but realise that you don't believe all of them and enjoy a good wind up - though still not sure of the Q alt-right bollux. Some of your other views I agree with (not many - but some).

    Hope the train is OK this evening. I think that's everything.

  10. #10

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    far right leader in charge in Argentina

    Tory government miles behind in the polls , staring down the barrel of an election defeat.

    we've been here before haven't we?
    expect some sabre rattling soon.

  11. #11

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Rjk View Post
    far right leader in charge in Argentina

    Tory government miles behind in the polls , staring down the barrel of an election defeat.

    we've been here before haven't we?
    expect some sabre rattling soon.
    Ha good point!

    I just googled his stance on the Falklands..looks like they are safe..

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...lands-veterans

  12. #12

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    El Loco: 'A mix of Boris Johnson and killer doll Chucky'!

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-he-stand-for
    Quoting the Guardian again, its a lite Tory rag which butched the Corbyn era and its policies and behaviours which you were so fond of , they say as you age you become more conservative in thought unless your barking mad like Corbyn , brother

  13. #13

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Rjk View Post
    far right leader in charge in Argentina

    Tory government miles behind in the polls , staring down the barrel of an election defeat.

    we've been here before haven't we?
    expect some sabre rattling soon.
    Add in Trump 's re- election from a cell ( cant wait for that one )

    Return of Boris to rescue the country

    Right-wing or far-right nationalist parties are the biggest party in Switzerland (Swiss People's Party) Italy (Brothers of Italy, Lega), Hungary (Fidesz) Poland (United Right), Finland (Finns Party) , Sweden (Swedish Democrats) ..

    Yep this is sure a swing ,all built around the loss of border controls ,crime ,demonstrations .

  14. #14
    First Team Heathblue's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Hi Heathblue

    I don't care about spelling errors. I haven't called Argentinian voters racist. I do think 'El Loco' is bad news and gave a link to a profile piece to inform the discussion.

    FWIW I think a lot of your views are also loco but realise that you don't believe all of them and enjoy a good wind up - though still not sure of the Q alt-right bollux. Some of your other views I agree with (not many - but some).

    Hope the train is OK this evening. I think that's everything.
    Just got on and have a seat 😂 which is a bonus Q is a massive pysop imo but it tends to trigger many and I enjoy that, I do however keep an eye on the full on Q people and some are utterly bonkers IMO, the latest is that, you will know that Jimmy carters wife has died, the Q people are expecting a 2nd high profile death and all because of what they call dog comes with the latest coming from Dan Scavino and it's the deep state taking the focus from the J6 tape release. 🤣 If it happens Twitter will be awash with it. If not they will all go back to hiding until another dog Com from Scavino. Remember this is the QAnon take not mine
    TIMING IS EVERYTHING
    "Q"
    😎

    Dog comms!!!!! Phone autocorrect 😂

  15. #15

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    what i found interesting about this result is

    voting is in person only with ID
    Ballots are hand counted
    results are done in a few hours

    No dominion machines involved !

    I think going back to basics with regards to elections should be done this way

    No sides can kick up a fuss then if you win or lose

  16. #16
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by MOZZER2 View Post
    what i found interesting about this result is

    voting is in person only with ID
    Ballots are hand counted
    results are done in a few hours

    No dominion machines involved !

    I think going back to basics with regards to elections should be done this way

    No sides can kick up a fuss then if you win or lose
    No middle of the night breakdowns, no boarding up of the voting buildings no water leaks, just simple mark the paper, drop it in the box in person, count the ballots, announce the winner when done, easy peazy. Not sure however you could get 80 million votes this way after spending the campaign in the basement

  17. #17

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    I have no idea about Argentinian politics but according to this it's a soap opera of insanity

    https://twitter.com/shaunjlawson/sta...64812610793736

  18. #18

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by MOZZER2 View Post
    what i found interesting about this result is

    voting is in person only with ID
    Ballots are hand counted
    results are done in a few hours

    No dominion machines involved !

    I think going back to basics with regards to elections should be done this way

    No sides can kick up a fuss then if you win or lose
    Yup, i'm sure that everyone would be happy with that system Mozz, and the result would be accepted.

  19. #19

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Heathblue you are on a one way ticket insanityville

  20. #20

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Voting with ID's should be compulsory . Veted independently ..

  21. #21

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Argentina was the fourth richest country in the world until the great war. Then the Peronist left-wing mafia got hold. Usual story. Rape the money makers. Tax to oblivion. Trade dies. Crime increases. Debt goes through the roof. "Ooh mother we have a default." "No shit sherlock, gee how did that happen?"

    Sssh. Don't tell the hard Left. They still haven't figured it out yet. Give them time. And a brain to figure it out. Tick tock....

  22. #22

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
    Have you noticed how Argentina , compared to Brazil has a very small black population and lots of white , blue eyed folk ?
    Oh dear. Should they produce diversity statistics to measure it all? "Get that Woke-O-Meter fired up darling, and let's make the statistics look good".

    Listen Chumski. There is a good reason for it, and it's called history. Not your favourite subject after Marxism and Maggie I know, but here's a little clue.

    Brazil: Formerly indians, and invaded by the Portuguese. They used a lot of black slavery to hack the sugar cane and coffee, and mixed with native Indians and dark skinned Portuguese. No secrets there. Oddly, they are darker. Weird, that. But if you go to Sao Paolo, and the areas to the West, there are as many Germans and Swedes there too. They also had the same lack of extradition laws like Argentina for war criminals. It is just that the percentage of population is less. They tend to me quiet and run manufacturing businesses. Alisson Becker came from German family.

    Argentina: invaded mainly by North Italians, French, Spanish and British. The British build their railways, set up football clubs, rugby clubs, polo clubs and tennis clubs. Later after World War II, a few Nazi Swedes and Germans also. Mostly fair skinned. Not much black slaves used because the country is small with less dense populations in the South due to it being barren and cold.

    If you are suggesting racism is at the heart of it, I suggest you consider migration patterns and history. The Nazi emigration story is true, but the numbers are quite small as a percentage of the population. That said, I have travelled South America, spent a month in Argentina and a month in Brazil. If you want to find the descendants of Nazis you go to Pucon in Chile and Bariloche in Argentina. It is full of descendants of German/Swiss emigres, and you see lots of stories in libraries or plaques stating how their families left between 1944-1948 "for a better life" or some nonsense. Stunning places, but people there appear so cagey compared to your average Argentine / Chilean for sure.

  23. #23
    First Team Heathblue's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Keyser Soze View Post
    Oh dear. Should they produce diversity statistics to measure it all? "Get that Woke-O-Meter fired up darling, and let's make the statistics look good".


    Listen Chumski. There is a good reason for it, and it's called history. Not your favourite subject after Marxism and Maggie I know, but here's a little clue.

    Brazil: Formerly indians, and invaded by the Portuguese. They used a lot of black slavery to hack the sugar cane and coffee, and mixed with native Indians and dark skinned Portuguese. No secrets there. Oddly, they are darker. Weird, that. But if you go to Sao Paolo, and the areas to the West, there are as many Germans and Swedes there too. They also had the same lack of extradition laws like Argentina for war criminals. It is just that the percentage of population is less. They tend to me quiet and run manufacturing businesses. Alisson Becker came from German family.

    Argentina: invaded mainly by North Italians, French, Spanish and British. The British build their railways, set up football clubs, rugby clubs, polo clubs and tennis clubs. Later after World War II, a few Nazi Swedes and Germans also. Mostly fair skinned. Not much black slaves used because the country is small with less dense populations in the South due to it being barren and cold.

    If you are suggesting racism is at the heart of it, I suggest you consider migration patterns and history. The Nazi emigration story is true, but the numbers are quite small as a percentage of the population. That said, I have travelled South America, spent a month in Argentina and a month in Brazil. If you want to find the descendants of Nazis you go to Pucon in Chile and Bariloche in Argentina. It is full of descendants of German/Swiss emigres, and you see lots of stories in libraries or plaques stating how their families left between 1944-1948 "for a better life" or some nonsense. Stunning places, but people there appear so cagey compared to your average Argentine / Chilean for sure.
    I think you have just handed SLUDGE a new R Sole as well as a history lesson 😂😂😂😂😂😂

  24. #24
    International jon1959's Avatar
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    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by Keyser Soze View Post
    Argentina was the fourth richest country in the world until the great war. Then the Peronist left-wing mafia got hold. Usual story. Rape the money makers. Tax to oblivion. Trade dies. Crime increases. Debt goes through the roof. "Ooh mother we have a default." "No shit sherlock, gee how did that happen?"

    Sssh. Don't tell the hard Left. They still haven't figured it out yet. Give them time. And a brain to figure it out. Tick tock....
    Calm down, it will all be OK for the Argentine economy now. The new President (the love child of Donald Trump and Chucky) is going to blow up the central bank and give the country to the US Dollar. Problem sorted!

  25. #25

    Re: Don't Cry For Me Argentina

    Quote Originally Posted by jon1959 View Post
    Calm down, it will all be OK for the Argentine economy now. The new President (the love child of Donald Trump and Chucky) is going to blow up the central bank and give the country to the US Dollar. Problem sorted!
    I very much doubt it, although I sent the nuanced sarcasm.

    The debt levels, currency collapse and destruction of foreign exchange reserves tell me they are on their way to oblivion. The world economy is heading to trouble, and the damage has been done to Argentina for far too long. Mainly by Peronists, but equally by the Right. De La Rua was a capitalist who tried to dollarise. From memory he was late 1990s. But the economy went into a vicious downward spiral and the ATMs could not dispense cash. Bank runs leading to disaster. Macri, a capitalist, had the right ideas a few years back, but was too timid. As a result of his timidity confidence was lost on him too. The Left wing Personists have been a disaster every time since the 1950s. Mafia, corruption, debt blowouts, hyperinflation - an utter disaster every single time.

    To make this situation easy for the average man to understand, I would equate Argentina to a decent quality aeroplane, fundamentally. Flying into a vicious storm, it loses 3 of it's four engines, and the support staff are drunk or focused on thieving the food and drink, and looting the sales kitty, and calling the pilot the cause of all the problems. With all those distractions, the odds of even the best pilot making it are nothing short of a miracle.

    What to do? Here is my take. Milei and Macri propose dollarization. In theory fine, as it was sort inflation by reducing money supply, and reduce the "currency trust" issue to foreign. But Argentina does not have enough FX reserves, and where will the dollars come from? It would cause a deflationary spiral, mass unemployment and civil strife. Singapore and Panama are often quoted as examples of countries who have successfully dollarized, or created a dollar peg in the FX markets. But they are not on the scale of Argentina, so it is impractical, unless Argentina had huge gold / FX reserves - which it does not.

    I think the only way out for Argentina is to stiff the IMF and lenders to eliminate their debt, like Iceland did after the GFC. I am against this as it creates another default. But their ace in the pack is the Vaca Loca energy field. If they can get private help in to exploit that huge gas field, they could create a sovereign wealth fund, and start again with debt at zero. Foreign lenders will forget it for a while. They always do. Evidence of that is foreign markets now lend to Greece, whereas in 2014 with the hoo-haa iwht Yannis Vourifakis lenders wanted 15-20% a year to lend to them. Lenders soon forget, until they reach 70-80% of debt-to-GDP and lenders dig out the history books again. But for Argentines, they now have energy to add to soya and beef for export markets. Fundamentally, it can be a rich country.

    Argentina's problem I think is cultural. There are just too many welfare dwellers and lazy buggers used to 80 years of cheap handouts. If someone else is doing well you can guarantee the "till dippers", who cannot resist dipping their hands in the till, will come after it. Like Chile having one of the best private pension funds in the world, until the Left wing "till dippers" nationalised it all after the last election. I think it is in the Latin blood. All Latino countries have a tendency to lean towards "till dipping" other people's money. So let's suppose Milei did dollarize, stiff the debt holders, or created a sovereign wealth fund like Norway. Even if it did work, you can guarantee that Peronist "till dippers" will come back at some point. "Let dip a little". Then "Oooh that worked, let's dip in a little more". There is always a reason. A justification. An easy convenience to dip their greasy, sweaty hands in the till again. Suddenly, the perennial short-termist (but cumulative) lack of discipline and repeated tendency to dip in the till keeps going more and more until the money is gone and they are back to huge debts again.

    Argentina is a superb country. I love it. But "till dipping" will always ruin it. Until the people stand on their own two feet, grow up and mature, and keep financial discipline and strength of character - like Norway or the Asian countries, it will always end up in trouble.

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