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Thread: Rubin Has Had His Chances

  1. #26

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Heís probably not as good or as bad as people make out but the truth is usually somewhere in between.

    Problem is people over hype him and then on messages boards people feel like they have to retaliate and be overall negative because others are overall positive (I think thatís similar to Bulut debates).

    For me Iíve never thought he was as good as others said but I wished him well, he clearly has talent. I think heís benefited working under just one manager this season, I think his overall game is now much better than it was. The lack of assists is dissapointing but as people point out we arenít a very good attacking team in open play generally, so itís hard to expect a player like him to do it all especially when most of the forward play seems to come out wide.

    When heís played I generally think heís done more than most, he keen to take the ball and will always try a pass even if itís not the easy option. Personally think heís done more the Turnbull, maybe bother together might work although not sure Bulut would consider it.

    I did say on here at the start of the season I thought he should have gone on loan to a league 2 club and to play every game and to then come back hopefully full of confidence in January or to even move up to a league 1 club. That got shot down but I still think it would have benefited him long term.

    He needs to play now until the end of the season and push on.

  2. #27

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    This is exactly how i see it. Young players are overhyped, and maybe those who take exception to those who analyse Colwill's game in a way that doesn't fit their point of view should show some caution when making judgements over a young player who is still developing both physically and mentally, you'd have thought that they had watched enough football over the years to understand that things don't always work out the way they think they will concerning developing players. So it's them who put the pressure on by being loud and garish when a little bit of caution needs exercising.

    Take a look at how emotive some of the posts are in this thread. 'Haters' 'One of our own' that's just deflection really, it's meaningless, and it doesn't address any of the issues raised about Colwill.

    We have had countless threads on Colwill, but nothing of substance in my opinion. The posters who feel the need to defend him don't really give good reason as to why some aspects of his game seems a bit flawed on times, and those who are critical just pick up on the obvious things that we all sort of knew already, so there's no balance from either side, battle lines are drawn and it gets emotive.

    Colwill sure does have ability. Great technique, that's certain. But in my opinion he lacks vision and composure, there have been several occasions this season where he has been in very good positions and he has fluffed his lines, snatching at the ball, pulling it wide etc. Then he produces what i think is the best cross i've seen from a city player this season (Against Blackburn-The one we didn't score from) The technique, weight, pace and where he put it was all majestic. Yet we don't have thee kinds of debates, it's either the managers fault, the formation, the players around him, or that people just hate him. Absolutely ridiculous and child like. I've no doubt all those things i've listed can and do hinder him as a player, but they aren't an excuse for his poor decision making, his poor technique at crucial times and his lack of awareness on times. That's on him, and i'll also say this, with better players comes more expectation and less tolerance, things actually become more difficult, the same way it would for us lot if we were thrown in with people who expected more from us, higher standards and no excuses. By that logic Kion etete would do better for Liverpool or Man City that he does with us because there would be a supply. As we know, that's nonsence, he'd be three seconds behind those players in thinking.
    I think.Colwill is a less composed footballer than he was two seasons ago, that suggests to me that heís been handled poorly by his managers at the club in the intervening period.

  3. #28

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by 2b2bdoo View Post
    Heís probably not as good or as bad as people make out but the truth is usually somewhere in between.

    Problem is people over hype him and then on messages boards people feel like they have to retaliate and be overall negative because others are overall positive (I think thatís similar to Bulut debates).

    For me Iíve never thought he was as good as others said but I wished him well, he clearly has talent. I think heís benefited working under just one manager this season, I think his overall game is now much better than it was. The lack of assists is dissapointing but as people point out we arenít a very good attacking team in open play generally, so itís hard to expect a player like him to do it all especially when most of the forward play seems to come out wide.

    When heís played I generally think heís done more than most, he keen to take the ball and will always try a pass even if itís not the easy option. Personally think heís done more the Turnbull, maybe bother together might work although not sure Bulut would consider it.

    I did say on here at the start of the season I thought he should have gone on loan to a league 2 club and to play every game and to then come back hopefully full of confidence in January or to even move up to a league 1 club. That got shot down but I still think it would have benefited him long term.

    He needs to play now until the end of the season and push on.
    The game he is playing under Bulut isn't his game. He isn't a 'Workmanlike' midfielder, closing down and pressuring opponents isn't natural to him, he's a player with the ball, without it he's limited. That's not his fault, that's his shape and height, Although he's worked really hard at it, He deserves credit.

    But then some people say that we should build a team around him, bring players in to compliment his ability, let others do his running etc. That all sounds great, but for that to happen you have to be a really good player, special, and you would have had to show on a consistent basis why all of those things should apply, and wait for it, even in a team that doesn't put emphasis on front foot football, because that's the situation he's in, and he has to make the most of it. In fairness, he does try, but it rarely comes off.

    I hate the constant excuses on here for players. It's lazy, and some people use it as a way of attacking the club, when what they really ought to do is just attack the club! Nobody can criticise a player when they try creative stuff and it doesn't come off, or another player isn't on their wave length. But when a player is in a good position to make something happen and they don't, or take the wrong option, they it's on them, nobody else, it's their responsibility.

    Thing is, i'd bet that most Professional people at the top of their tree take responsibility for their own performance, even when things are against them, because good people find a way to succeed, there's going to be adversity, things aren't going to go a footballers way, they have to work it out themselves, that's why they're out there doing something they love and are rewarded handsomely for it. That's the level of responsibility they have, They need to find a way. And that's why me and the rest of us are posting shit on here and aren't rewarded for something that we love doing, because we just have to turn up and put half a shift in, and nobody wants to pay to watch us.

  4. #29

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    I think.Colwill is a less composed footballer than he was two seasons ago, that suggests to me that he’s been handled poorly by his managers at the club in the intervening period.
    Or he's just developed into a less composed footballer. You may be right with your suggestion, but we don't know for sure.

  5. #30

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    Or he's just developed into a less composed footballer. You may be right with your suggestion, but we don't know for sure.
    I think heís been badly coached, I donít recall Dave Jones moaning about Jason koumasĒs lack of defensive play.

  6. #31

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by olderblue View Post
    I think heís been badly coached, I donít recall Dave Jones moaning about Jason koumasĒs lack of defensive play.
    Jason Koumas was a naturally quicker, stronger and more tenacious footballer with far superior talent.

    Pointless comparison.

  7. #32

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    Or he's just developed into a less composed footballer. You may be right with your suggestion, but we don't know for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Der Kaiser View Post
    Jason Koumas was a naturally quicker, stronger and more tenacious footballer with far superior talent.

    Pointless comparison.
    In your opinion

  8. #33

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Der Kaiser View Post
    Jason Koumas was a naturally quicker, stronger and more tenacious footballer with far superior talent.

    Pointless comparison.
    And Koumas wasn't that committed by all accounts. Steven Gerrard said that Koumas was a much better player than he was as a youth player. It goes to show that ability alone isn't always enough. Determination and sacrifice with the ability to adapt to circumstances are as much an essential as natural ability.

  9. #34

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by olderblue View Post
    I think he’s been badly coached, I don’t recall Dave Jones moaning about Jason koumas”s lack of defensive play.
    Wow didn’t expect that comparison.

  10. #35

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    Or he's just developed into a less composed footballer. You may be right with your suggestion, but we don't know for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2b2bdoo View Post
    Wow didn’t expect that comparison.
    What skilful footballer that can create something out of nothing? Get you off your seat, itís not that big a leap
    I donít remember Koumas tracking back and tackling, I do remember being at Luton on a Valentines night and watching Koumas get us the 3 3 draw,
    I can remember Koumas scoring 2 away at Doncaster or Rotherham one sunny April and winning the game

    Skilful creative players are often stifled and yet, like Tomlin they create the parts of the game you remember
    Weíre not exactly blessed with players that can turn something out of nothing at the moment, but Iíll bet you remember the way Colwill scored the goal against the Wurzels and created the winner against Ipswich.

    Heís a talent, personally Iíd treat him like a thorough bred, weíve got enough cart horses there already

  11. #36

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by olderblue View Post
    What skilful footballer that can create something out of nothing? Get you off your seat, it’s not that big a leap
    I don’t remember Koumas tracking back and tackling, I do remember being at Luton on a Valentines night and watching Koumas get us the 3 3 draw,
    I can remember Koumas scoring 2 away at Doncaster or Rotherham one sunny April and winning the game

    Skilful creative players are often stifled and yet, like Tomlin they create the parts of the game you remember
    We’re not exactly blessed with players that can turn something out of nothing at the moment, but I’ll bet you remember the way Colwill scored the goal against the Wurzels and created the winner against Ipswich.

    He’s a talent, personally I’d treat him like a thorough bred, we’ve got enough cart horses there already
    I don’t disagree, Koumas was brilliant, goals, assist, give him the ball and he would make something happen. His first loan no one would get near him. Colwill is miles and miles off that at the moment.

  12. #37

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuerto View Post
    Or he's just developed into a less composed footballer. You may be right with your suggestion, but we don't know for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2b2bdoo View Post
    I don’t disagree, Koumas was brilliant, goals, assist, give him the ball and he would make something happen. His first loan no one would get near him. Colwill is miles and miles off that at the moment.
    He will always be, as long as heís badly coached and not encouraged to play a real number 10 role
    Letís put it another way, would you rather see Wintle trying to play that role?

    Of course not, and yet we have a manager that persisted in trying to make that happen???

    I like Ralls, I like watching Siopis and on Monday they were an effective partnership away from home, but from what we have seen at home matches most of the season two DM either doesnít work, or bores the pants off fans and in some cases like Friday,both.

    We play a ridged boring, risk adverse system under Bulut most of the time, Iíd rather play Colwill and Ramsey together and create a system where that can happen, itís the only way Colwill will really develop, and you never know, we might score some goals from open play?

  13. #38

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by olderblue View Post
    He will always be, as long as he’s badly coached and not encouraged to play a real number 10 role
    Let’s put it another way, would you rather see Wintle trying to play that role?

    Of course not, and yet we have a manager that persisted in trying to make that happen???

    I like Ralls, I like watching Siopis and on Monday they were an effective partnership away from home, but from what we have seen at home matches most of the season two DM either doesn’t work, or bores the pants off fans and in some cases like Friday,both.

    We play a ridged boring, risk adverse system under Bulut most of the time, I’d rather play Colwill and Ramsey together and create a system where that can happen, it’s the only way Colwill will really develop, and you never know, we might score some goals from open play?
    I agree about Colwill, I’ve said similar.

    I just think the comparison to Koumas is way off, that’s ok though, it’s all about opinions, we don’t need to agree.

  14. #39

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Colwill might have "had his chances" but in really poor teams that play equally dire football. Just look at what he does for Wales u21s.

  15. #40

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by life on mars View Post
    Looked at some stats ..

    22 / 23 he played 26 games ,

    23 / to date has played 36 times

    Since Jan 21 played 58 times and scored 6 goals in all competitions .. inc Welsh full Internationals not U21 ??

    https://www.soccerbase.com/players/p...&season_id=155

    This makes interesting reading https://footystats.org/players/wales/rubin-colwill , seems to say he is a good dribbler and crosser ,hasn't provided many assists

    Average City wage is 880 euros , Rubin allegedly on half of that 446 ???

    https://m.aiscore.com/salary/player-...rkn6in92w6i0ql

    Market value is £ million

    Rubin Colwill is a Midfielder who has appeared in 32 matches this season in Championship, playing a total of 1362 minutes. Rubin Colwill gets an average of 0 assists for every 90 minutes that the player is on the pitch. See how they rank against other Championship Players.

    Rubin Colwill scored a total of 1 goals so far this season in the Championship ,places him at 11th in the Cardiff City squad's Top Scorers list.

    Scores a goal every 1,362 minutes , No Assists, No Bookings


    For me should have done or shown more with the opportunities handed to him at such a tender age
    Colwillís issue is the lack of willing runners behind the lines, mostly centrally. His touch and vision will suit a higher standard. With Brennan Jonson at 9 for Wales Colwillís passes will find him time and time again. Equally, if we played Grant at 9 (as he did for WBA), instead of slow 9s, you will see a Colwill that will find his runs time and time again. This has happened to players who leave top clubs for lower clubs, or when Giggs played in Wales teams with weaker players - the lower grade players arenít
    good enough to read his balls and patterns of player.

    Colwillís footwork and vision is superb. Etete and Diedhou just wonít make those central sprint ls beyond the centre backs that will exploit Colwillís skill. Watch him flourish for Wales in the next 12 months or at a better club.

  16. #41

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Koumas is actually a good comparison. But Koumas was 5 years older and had played 250 league games before he signed for us. The difference between the two when comparing is that Koumas was a player with considerably more experience when he played for us.

    He was also given a consistent run in what was an attack minded team.

    During Colwill's short run in the team, his performances were vastly superior to anything Robinson, Wintle or Turnbull have produced playing in the same position.

    I really don't understand the negativity toward him, he's the best young player we've produced since Ramsay.

  17. #42
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    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    I think.Colwill is a less composed footballer than he was two seasons ago, that suggests to me that he’s been handled poorly by his managers at the club in the intervening period.
    Some players do get worse as they get older though through fear and responsibility and they have to do what they need to do, some people say the same about Grealish.

  18. #43
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    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by 2b2bdoo View Post
    I agree about Colwill, I’ve said similar.

    I just think the comparison to Koumas is way off, that’s ok though, it’s all about opinions, we don’t need to agree.
    Koumas was brilliant, no comparison at all there yet.

  19. #44
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    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by olderblue View Post
    What skilful footballer that can create something out of nothing? Get you off your seat, it’s not that big a leap
    I don’t remember Koumas tracking back and tackling, I do remember being at Luton on a Valentines night and watching Koumas get us the 3 3 draw,
    I can remember Koumas scoring 2 away at Doncaster or Rotherham one sunny April and winning the game

    Skilful creative players are often stifled and yet, like Tomlin they create the parts of the game you remember
    We’re not exactly blessed with players that can turn something out of nothing at the moment, but I’ll bet you remember the way Colwill scored the goal against the Wurzels and created the winner against Ipswich.

    He’s a talent, personally I’d treat him like a thorough bred, we’ve got enough cart horses there already
    Yes Koumas did his fair share of work and backtracking too, he was a great player.

    Rubin still has time, as many have said he will get better with a bit more experience and better players around him giving him more options.

  20. #45

    Re: Rubin Has Had His Chances

    Quote Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue View Post
    Yes Koumas did his fair share of work and backtracking too, he was a great player.

    Rubin still has time, as many have said he will get better with a bit more experience and better players around him giving him more options.
    Best player ever in a City shirt, for me. I totally agree. People used to coo over Mc Phail, Richard Langey or Jason Fowler but these were showponies who ponced around the park producing little or disappearing too often.

    Koumas delivered in nearly every game. Cracking goals, set piece goals, skinning his marker for fun, assists or a flurry of key passes for strikers. He was outstanding.

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