Reply With QuoteHave you taken into consideration, the fact that season ticket holders are counted into the attendance figures, even though they are sat at home in the warm.
Last Saturday the ground was practically empty
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Lots of comments have been made on here about the effect midday kickoffs have had on attendances this season, so I thought I'd have a look at the data. A quick note about the data used - I've used figures on worldfootball.net for average attendance figures from 2023/24 and 2024/25, so hopefully that is free of errors. I have only included the 18 clubs that took part in both last and this season's Championship, so there are no discrepancies due to relegation or promotion.
Of the 18 teams in this season's Championship that were also there last season:
Average crowds are down by a total of exactly 9,000, or an average of 500 per team. This equates to a 2.9% drop in attendances.
7 of those 18 sides have seen crowds rise. Coventry City have had the greatest increase, up almost 1.5k from last season. Second comes Watford, with a more modest increase of 642. In fact, excluding Coventry's increase in attendance, the average increase of the other 6 clubs is a mere 338. All 3 sides promoted from League 1 have seen crowds increaseby around 2k on average, but are not included in this analysis.
That leaves 11 out of 18 sides that have seen crowds fall. Stoke have had the smallest drop, with crowds falling by an average of 11, while QPR represent the other end of the scale, losing around 3.5k.
Cardiff, Stoke and Coventry have had the most home games on a Saturday lunchtime or Friday evening so far this season with 4. Our crowd has dropped by 2k while Coventry's has gone up by 1.5k
Here's a list of the number of matches moved to a Saturday lunchtime or Friday evening and average crowd of those sides:
4 times - average crowd drop of -181 (-1.2%)
3 times - average crowd drop of -885 (-5%)
2 times - average crowd drop of -423 (-2.2%)
1 time - average crowd rise of 620 (+2.6%)
0 times - average crowd drop of -1264 (-7.6%)
The word anomaly was one of the buzz words on here yesterday and I suppose trying to figure out what is anomaly and what isn't is key here.
3 sides have had 4 fixtures moved; us, Stoke and Coventry. Our average crowd has gone down by 2000, Coventry's has gone up by nearly 1,500.
5 sides have had 3 fixtures moved; Leeds crowd has gone up slightly, 3 have seen theirs go down slightly while QPR's huge crowd drop is arguably the main reason for the large drop figure here.
Only one side hasn't had a home fixture moved to a Saturday lunchtime or Friday evening - Swansea. Their crowd has gone down by a sizeable percentage, that's with having played us in their cup final as well. It's worth noting that they had 20,174 when we grabbed a point there - they're averaging 14,499 for their other 6 league matches and none of them have been moved to the alleged worst times.
Lastly, I've had a look at attendances and any relation with league positions, current and last season.
The three teams that finished in the top 6 last season have all seen crowds rise. 3 of the other 4 sides that have seen crowds rise have sides currently in a higher position in the league than they were last season. This season, sides in the bottom 6 have seen an average drop in crowds of 9%. There is more data available for anyone interested enough.
While I wouldn't say that more lunchtime kickoffs haven't had an impact on crowds, the data suggests that league position has a far greater impact.
Have you taken into consideration, the fact that season ticket holders are counted into the attendance figures, even though they are sat at home in the warm.
Last Saturday the ground was practically empty
As I said, I've taken the official attendance figures. It's impossible to take into consideration season ticket holders who don't turn up as there's no data on them. I reckon if we were going for promotion, more of them would turn up regardless of kickoff time.Originally Posted by BLUETIT
How does Riza's crowd compare directly with Bulut's?
It's much better to watch now than it was obviously.
Bearing in mind that as season ticket holders are counted whether present or not it must be assumed that all those 200 were 'on-the-day' ticket sales lost. But how does that loss of revenue equate to the money city were paid for television appearances?
2000, but that doesn't take into account whether season ticket sales were up or down.
Not worth the comparison with your mate. Riza hasn't managed a side that has played on the opening day or played Leeds at home. Those will generally attract two of our biggest crowds.
Sorry, my error, but the question stands. Regardless of season ticket sales, taking an average cost of a ticket how does the revenue from 200 tickets stack up against TV revenue?
So it's a lot of nonsense of no value whatsoever and a total waste of time
What a tool
So you don't like the answer to a question, so you won't answer it, well you have to yourself but without revealing it
I wasn't expecting that answer to be honest, and it doesn't matter to me so no need to get all defensive
Difficult to answer. I've read that the new TV deal is worth around an extra £4m per season, taken from a Plymouth messageboard.
How much would the club make from 200 tickets? I have no idea of the break down, but suppose the club miss out on £25 per person on average, £5,000 per 200 tickets, including children etc.
I make it that £4m a season equates to just under £175,000 per game, or around 7,000 tickets. Granted that these are estimates and very rough calculations, but it's clear that each Championship club will be better off financially with the new deal, even if it lost thousands of supporters every home game. Of course, that doesn't include other match day income, such as programmes, refreshments, club shop and so on. We'd only ever be guessing how much the club would lose out on from each of those.
I wasn't being defensive. The question wasn't worth answering. Once again you talk a load of bollocks and this thread could end up being yet another long yawn with you wanting to have the last word.So you don't like the answer to a question, so you won't answer it, well you have to yourself but without revealing it
I wasn't expecting that answer to be honest, and it doesn't matter to me so no need to get all defensive
So it's a lot of nonsense of no value whatsoever and a total waste of time
What a toolCouldn't put it better myself.
Please help me please help me
What data is missing? What should I have done to get this? Go on then, I'm all ears......
Have you taken into consideration average league position of the opponent for 12.30pm kick offs v 3pm kick offs?
Have you taken into consideration, the fact that season ticket holders are counted into the attendance figures, even though they are sat at home in the warm.
Last Saturday the ground was practically empty.
Unless you are there counting them you haven't got a clue how many are present.
Bored now it's a daft post and makes no sense.
It could be just an anomaly anyway
Has the meal deal offer comprising of a pint of Carling and a sausage roll had any effect on attendance?
I don't think it has encouraged the gluten intolerant vegetarian sector in.
So what are the conclusions ?
In a very quick precis
So the bit where I say "what should I have done to get this" remains unanswered.Have you taken into consideration, the fact that season ticket holders are counted into the attendance figures, even though they are sat at home in the warm.
Last Saturday the ground was practically empty.
Unless you are there counting them you haven't got a clue how many are present.
Bored now it's a daft post and makes no sense.
It could be just an anomaly anyway
Not particularly, neither have I considered whether opponents are rivals or whether they bring more or fewer away fans with them, nor whether the corresponding fixture last season was 3pm on a Saturday and what the crowds were then.
The next step beyond that is to go around every supporter with a series of questions FFS......
This is a straightforward look at average attendances and how many lunchtime fixtures clubs have had. Nothing more, nothing less.
Crowds are down based on last season, though those whose crowds have dropped are more likely to have either struggled last season or have had a downturn of fortunes this season, more than they've had fixtures changed to midday.
Where do we fit in ?
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