Reply With Quotea bit over dramatic there Erol.Originally Posted by MOZZER2
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Seems like a load of bollocks to me.
a bit over dramatic there Erol.
What bit?
There's no loyalty in football, we know that, but I agree with Bulut on this, what does it look like? He obviously didn't help himself with results, but it does speak volumes to me over Riza's character that he didn't approach Bulut and give him the heads up, it's just showing respect, especially as Riza wouldn't have been in his position if it wasn't for Riza. This shit probably happens all of the time, but we can draw conclusions from it, that Riza was weaseling behind Buluts back.
If it wasn't for Bulut...
Back in October, I got a bit of stick for my opinions regarding Riza. On 08/10/24 I posted this:
Following his sacking by Watford, Riza said: “Obviously very disappointed with the decision to be relieved of my position. I felt I was the person for continuity at the club since being there for six years. Maybe it should have been my time to take the team and continue on the journey that I love.
“For whatever reason, it wasn’t to be and it hurts, but I need to take it all onto my next objective. Looking for a Head Coach position where I can apply my processes, my experience, my knowledge and above all my humility.”
He sounds very humble, doesn't he?
So, he was looking for a Head Coach position, but took a job at City on the coaching staff under Erol Bulut. Doesn't sit quite right with me, that. I instinctively don't trust this guy and, while some are applauding his apparent confidence, it reminds me of the same sort of arrogance that Steve Morison seemed to have.
If Bulut is correct and Riza didn't consult him before taking the role, the it's pretty poor form and I think it speaks volumes. It would be interesting to hear what Riza has to say about it, though. Apparently, it was brought up in his press conference yesterday, but that seems to have been edited out of the version on the club's website.
And that stuff about 80% of the fan base wanting him to be manager, his words. Where did he get that shit from, and unless you were really good at your job, then would you really quote some shitty poll online, or whatever it was? It's the kind of thing Mourinho would say, but he can back it up, even if it gets people's backs up There's a fine line between being confident and delusional, I don't think Riza is the sharpest, not that it really matters, but if he did go behind Buluts back then it's poor form in my opinion.
Didn't Riza say, I think while he was still interim, that Bulut basically ignored everything he suggested? If that's true they clearly didn't have a great relationship and it was never likely that Riza would consult him on taking over on a temporary basis.
Did Hudson ask for Morison's blessing? Did Morison ask for McCarthy's?
Shut up Erol.
Who knows? Do you?
Incidentally, it looks from the clip like Bulut is on a TV show and the presenter was asking questions from the monitor in front of her, so perhaps they were questions for Bulut sent in by viewers?
It always pays to have a bit of context in these situations, but we rarely get it.
It's better form than people who agree to taking a job before the current occupant is sacked and we know by how long the board took to appoint a permanent replacement this wasn't happening at our club.
If it turns out Bulut and Riza didn't have a good working relationship I see no reason why Riza should have asked Bulut for his views and I highly doubt that had that happened Bulut would have appointed him to his backroom team when he gets his next job
Extremely unlikely though isn't it.
I honestly don't know. I've never worked in the game so I've no idea what's expected in situations like this, but I would have thought a courtesy call would be reasonable enough to avoid any future conflict. I really don't know, though. I guess if you don't work in football you can only judge a situation like this by your own personal standards.
If someone had given me a job as his or her assistant, got fired shortly afterwards and I was then offered their job, I'm pretty certain I'd make a courtesy call. How about you?
If my boss was sacked and left under a cloud I don't think there would be any need to make a courtesy call.
They're gone, it isn't their business any more.
They must know that the position is going to be filled, and anyone who wants to try their hand at it should be fair game.
If my boss had moved on to another role in the same organisation then that would be different.
Just my opinion.
Left under a cloud?
Bulut was sacked because the results he, his team and his coaching staff (including Riza) were producing were rubbish. He didn't leave under a cloud.
If I had his number I'd have given him a call - just to make sure he wasn't thinking of coming back..
The issue Bulut had is that Riza didn't walk when all of his other staff did. They may have been instructed to go and Riza wasn't, and if so, you have to ask the question why (and we can say the same of Tom Ramasut) wasn't Riza asked to leave?There's two likely reasons, riza and Ramasut are working for peanuts, or the pair of them have got their tongue up people's arses, a bit like any work place, we have all seen it. Riza must have been lined up before they sacked Bulut, and it's likely he was asked if he fancied it, and Bulut would know that, without him actually saying as much. I don't actually care for either man, although I do think that Riza is delusional.
I've worked for my current boss for 6 years and we get on well, so definitely if I was replacing him. If it was only a few months and we weren't close, maybe not. Being sacked and someone else taking over your role is an occupational hazard of football management more than other walks of life too.
Maybe the situation wasn't helped by the way his appointment happened. Assistant managers taking over on a temporary basis is par for the course, then by the time they made permanent, 2.5 months later, Bulut was a distant memory.
Riza and Ramasut were not part of the Bulut Team.
I suspect that Riza was identified as an additional coach by the club's 'Recruitment Team', not initially by Bulut. Bulut obviously had to agree to him coming (well I say 'obviously' but maybe nothing is obvious) but he wasn't one of his trusted side kicks. It seems from what Riza has since said that they were not thinking the same way.
Like with Ramasut for me there was no automatic assumption that Riza would leave with Bulut.
That doesn't mean that Riza shouldn't have gone through the courtesy of speaking to Bulut when he was approached to be caretaker - but it doesn't have the feel of the big betrayal that Bulut is making out.
If the translation is accurate, Bulut literally said that to call it a betrayal would be to sensationalise it.
He did.
I had the strong impression from the whole segment that he was happy to sensationalise it. He was clearly annoyed by Riza and did nothing to play down the situation. He distanced himself from the word 'betrayal', but in every other way I think he played along with and underscored that allegation.
I suppose all is fair in love, war and having the last word (or is that controlling the narrative) after a Vincent Tan sacking!
There were pretty strong rumours of Bulut and Rica not getting on going back as far as pre season (or very early in the league season) if I remember correctly and some of the things we’ve heard since Bulut’s departure back that up. I’ve never been in the position of replacing a senior colleague who has been sacked, but I think I’d only make a call to check if they were okay about me taking their job if I regarded them as a good friend - I’m pretty sure that I would not get too offended by my deputy taking my job if it was me who had been sacked.
Riza being appointed a manager was a complete joke. No other football league would have made such a stupid appointment and it's what I believe will ultimately see us relegated.
However not asking Bulut or giving Bulut a phone call I really dont see what the issue is.
The rules of hire & fire in football are alien to most of us who work in the real world.
Likewise, I guess the etiquette between managers and coaches in these situations is going to be something we cant know unless weve been there.
More concerning for me is the fact that Riza is turning up the volume on the narrative that our current predicament is down to Bulut.
Riza cannot be allowed to get away with it. He has had plenty of opportunity to lift the club away from the threat of relegation and he has failed. Shame on him for pointing the finger elsewhere (again).
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