Fascism?

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Re: Fascism?

The Germans were National Socialists. Italy was Fascist.

Hitler modelled the NSDAP on Mussolinis black shirts. The nazis were fascists on steroids

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

You seem to think that unless someone is acting like Hitler or Mussolini they can't be fascists - the examples I gave were ones I came up with after about five minutes thinking and while I accept some are stronger than others, they all fall within the definition of that list of fourteen. The last decade or so has seen an increase in populist, nationalist type Governments and the current UK one is the most populist, nationalist one of my lifetime - you go down that route and you're heading towards fascism as outlined in that article.

No way is Boris anywhere near a fascist, honestly this is laughable. He's a liberal, he's not even that Conservative.
Boris and Theresa May let in on average 300.000 foriengers a year NET. Infact, including students Boris let in 1 million foreigners last year. How is that the work of a Fascist? You cite the rwanda deportations but that's a very very small amount of people, done for political reasons not ideological.

Boris is NOT fascist, the word Fascist has been contorted and weaponised by the left. Whipping up gullible people into believing we are living in literal FASCISM. It's scary how easily people fall for this.

[Dorcus]

Re: Fascism?

No way is Boris anywhere near a fascist, honestly this is laughable. He's a liberal, he's not even that Conservative.
Boris and Theresa May let in on average 300.000 foriengers a year NET. Infact, including students Boris let in 1 million foreigners last year. How is that the work of a Fascist? You cite the rwanda deportations but that's a very very small amount of people, done for political reasons not ideological.

Boris is NOT fascist, the word Fascist has been contorted and weaponised by the left. Whipping up gullible people into believing we are living in literal FASCISM. It's scary how easily people fall for this.

When you start studying your O' Levels you might begin to understand what Fascism really means behind convenient labels. In all fairness I hope you learn something and do well in your exams because despite your naiivety you seem a willing student.

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

Hitler modelled the NSDAP on Mussolinis black shirts. The nazis were fascists on steroids

Nah very few people get past the hysterical propoganda of National Socialism and Fascism and therefore don't know what they're talking about. I don't blame them, the propoganda is strong. Hitler may have taken aspects from Italy, but the German national Socialists were distinctly different from Italian fascists.
The main difference between Fascism and National Socialism is the role of the state in each system. Fascism is for statism, it teaches that the state is primary. And that the state forms the nation. In contrast National Socialism teaches that the native folk/people are primary and form the nation.In National Socialism the state serves the folk. National Socialism is NOT totalitarian.

Here is a quote from Italy's Fascist leader Benitto Mussolini from The Doctrine Of Fascism...

"The Fascist conception of the state is all embracing; outside of it no human or spiritual values can exist, much less have any worth. Thus understood, Fascism is totalitarian, and the Fascist state, a synthesis and a unit of all values, interprets, develops and potentiates the whole life of a people...it is not the nation that generates the state, rather it is the state that generates the nation, conferring volition and therefore real life on people. In the Fascist conception the state is an absolute before which individuals and groups are relative..."

Now contrast this with a quote from Hitler on National Socialism ...

"The state is only a means to an end. It's end and it's purpose are to preserve and promote a community of human beings who are physically aswell as spiritually kindered...states which do not serve this purpose have no justification for their existence. They are monstrosities"

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

When you start studying your O' Levels you might begin to understand what Fascism really means behind convenient labels. In all fairness I hope you learn something and do well in your exams because despite your naiivety you seem a willing student.

I've read Oswald Moseley on Fascism/National Socialism. What have you read on Fascism/National Socialism. Educate me...

[Doucas]

Re: Fascism?

You can apply that in equal measure to the left and right.

Ok go through the list I posted and tell me which ones apply to the left and why.

[Doucas]

Re: Fascism?

Not an expert but unlike anyone in this thread so far, i have actually read texts from Oswald Moseley, who was a Fascist, a very intelligent, compasionate patriot who left the Labour party to espouse a Fascist manifesto. I can send anyone his Ebooks if they want.

That link is nonesense from what i can tell. Moseley didn't propose quelling academics or anything like that. I'd urge anyone to read Moseley texts, for example, he wanted to deal with parasitic international bankers, a currupt press funded by the rich for the rich. Would you disagree with that?

What in the list isn't a sign of fascism?

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

What in the list isn't a sign of fascism?

It's all rubbish Doucas. What Fascism texts have you actually read?

[JamesWales]

Re: Fascism?

Ok go through the list I posted and tell me which ones apply to the left and why.

They all apply to communism. Every one, bar perhaps number 8, where far-left states tended to want to eradicate religion, although in doing so they would become entwined.

I'd recommend reading a few books on the horrors of communism. There are some excellent ones around by Anne Applebaum and Tomothy Snyder. Horrific reading.

[Doucas]

Re: Fascism?

It's all rubbish Doucas. What Fascism texts have you actually read?

So you can't answer then.

It's so so clear people like you, James and Mars would have supported the Nazi's in the 30s.

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

So you can't answer then.

It's so so clear people like you, James and Mars would have supported the Nazi's in the 30s.

I did answer. It's all rubbish and you're too "in it" to tell. By "in it" i mean leftist fear mongering peddled by the likes of Owen Jones etc.

I'll ask again, What fascist/National Socialist texts, written by It's proponents have you read?

[Lither_1927]

Re: Fascism?

They all apply to communism. Every one, bar perhaps number 8, where far-left states tended to want to eradicate religion, although in doing so they would become entwined.

I'd recommend reading a few books on the horrors of communism. There are some excellent ones around by Anne Applebaum and Tomothy Snyder. Horrific reading.

The roots of Communism and the bolshevik revolution are very interesting.

Lenin said: "The goal of Socialism is Communism"

[JamesWales]

Re: Fascism?

So you can't answer then.

It's so so clear people like you, James and Mars would have supported the Nazi's in the 30s.

Just another day from Doucus on CCMB with him casually accusing people of supporting one of the most murderous regimes in history.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Fascism?

They all apply to communism. Every one, bar perhaps number 8, where far-left states tended to want to eradicate religion, although in doing so they would become entwined.

I'd recommend reading a few books on the horrors of communism. There are some excellent ones around by Anne Applebaum and Tomothy Snyder. Horrific reading.

Is anybody arguing in favour of communism in this thread? Or, is it that anyone who says they are left of centre politically is now assumed to be a communist?

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Fascism?

Just another day from Doucus on CCMB with him casually accusing people of supporting one of the most murderous regimes in history.

Isn’t the point that they weren’t one of the most murderous regimes in history during the period Doucas mentions. I don’t believe for a second that the millions of Germans who backed the Nazis in the thirties did so because they were aware of what Hitler was going to do in the early forties - were they really in favour of the culling of the Jews on a scale like that?

I believe that it is completely possible for people who consider themselves to be entirely reasonable and normal to be won over by extreme parties on the right and left if the right buttons are pushed. We can argue the toss about the list of fourteen points about fascism as much as we like, but my point is that the current Government ticks more of those boxes than any other one, Conservative or Labour, of my lifetime. I said earlier in the thread that I put a question mark in the title because I wasn’t convinced that it was Fascism that I was referring to, but I do find some of the responses which followed a bit complacent - I can’t remember a time more like the thirties in my life than now and I feel it’s now a bit easier to see how people were taken in by the likes of Hitler and Mussolini back then.