This is really stupid

[delmbox]

I find that people's tolerance/acceptance of something is easy as long as it doesn't interfere with them personally, so they can put their heads in the sand. If you have young children, or in my case young grandchildren, then stuff like transgenderism will affect you whether you like it or not. How can I tolerate the idea that someone could freely suggest to my grandsons and granddaughter that they might like to consider changing their gender and if I object to this ideology, then I will be accused of "transphobia" and possibly of breaking the law. If you think this is far-fetched I challenge you to read this:

https://www.spiked-online.com/2018/1...g-on-children/

I have already put out this link earlier, but no one has responded yet.

If you think that your grandchildren are at risk of people going round suggesting to them that they might want to change their gender then may I politely suggest that their ol' grandpa is lost and paranoid in a changing world. Out of interest does it also worry you slightly that seeing two people of the same sex kissing on telly might turn them gay?

[delmbox]

If you think that your grandchildren are at risk of people going round suggesting to them that they might want to change their gender then may I politely suggest that their ol' grandpa is lost and paranoid in a changing world. Out of interest does it also worry you slightly that seeing two people of the same sex kissing on telly might turn them gay?

And also yes I have read your article. Then I had a quick glance at the website it's on. Article upon article of anti trans stuff, as well as other highlights which include "why I befriended the KKK" and "The danger of banning holocaust denial"

[lardy]

I find that people's tolerance/acceptance of something is easy as long as it doesn't interfere with them personally, so they can put their heads in the sand. If you have young children, or in my case young grandchildren, then stuff like transgenderism will affect you whether you like it or not. How can I tolerate the idea that someone could freely suggest to my grandsons and granddaughter that they might like to consider changing their gender and if I object to this ideology, then I will be accused of "transphobia" and possibly of breaking the law. If you think this is far-fetched I challenge you to read this:

https://www.spiked-online.com/2018/1...g-on-children/

I have already put out this link earlier, but no one has responded yet.

I really don't think people decide to change their gender because it was suggested as a nice idea.

[Igovernor]

Two things
1 they are not people yet they are young children who are not old enough to make these big decisions
2 To me it seems the people who are doing the suggestions are parents

[William Treseder]

I really don't think people decide to change their gender because it was suggested as a nice idea.

Don’t you? None of them?

[Heisenberg]

Two things
1 they are not people yet they are young children who are not old enough to make these big decisions
2 To me it seems the people who are doing the suggestions are parents

Now this is really stupid.

[Croesy Blue]

Let’s be fair. All 3 are nonsense. The talking snake, the Ark and the girl believing she’s a boy.
But if folk want to believe it, who are we to deny them ?

But there is scientific proof that transgender people exist. Why don’t you read up about it instead of sticking to a position you’ve just decided upon?

People were saying exactly the same thing about homosexual people 20 years ago. Why don’t you learn from history and do a bit of research before deciding something is un natural or wrong?

[Croesy Blue]

Two things
1 they are not people yet they are young children who are not old enough to make these big decisions
2 To me it seems the people who are doing the suggestions are parents

You need to read something other than a tabloid newspaper, no children are having anything done to them that is irreversible. Some teenagers get given drugs that delay puberty but any surgery takes place after people become adults and have years of counselling.

Again the same arguments were made against gay people and kids being forced into an “ideology”. People could try being on the right side of history instead of repeating mistakes by following the odd “story” in a tabloid newspaper.

I’m sure there will be the odd instance of something wrong being done, but in the majority of cases transgender kids are handled very well. And this needed to happen because of the high number of suicides among people who identified as transgender but never had any therapy of treatment.

[Croesy Blue]

From reading many threads over many years on this message board, it looks like Christians are now the last group on earth who are shown no respect and are fair game for any offensive taunts.

Yeah I remember all those national front pages saying being a Christian is wrong, people being beat up in the street for being Christian, people being afraid to come out as Christian, kids being mocked by their teachers for being Christian. What a hard life being a Christian is.

I’ve got no problem with people being religious, just don’t use your religions “rules” to try and make other people’s lives miserable.

[lardy]

Don’t you? None of them?

Yes, I don't think anyone has ever changed their gender because someone suggested it as a nice idea. Please do show me an example of it happening as I like to learn.

[Croesy Blue]

Yes, I don't think anyone has ever changed their gender because someone suggested it as a nice idea. Please do show me an example of it happening as I like to learn.

Surely no one actually believes that

Some people will believe anything a tabloid tells them ffs.

[Bluebina]

Thanks for the info - interesting. Are we seriously expected to believe there are up to half a million people in the UK who are transgender?

Was there the same percentage in the 70's?

[alan_corneli]

If she wants to be identified as a boy (and I don't have a problem with that) what is she/he doing in a class full of girls!!! Shouldn't she be in a mixed sex school.

[Heisenberg]

If she wants to be identified as a boy (and I don't have a problem with that) what is she/he doing in a class full of girls!!! Shouldn't she be in a mixed sex school.

Says he does not have a problem with it then calls the boy "she/he" and then "he".

Also, I took the trouble of Googling the school in question and it is a mixed sex school. https://www.goodschoolsguide.co.uk/s...-school-oxford

Hope that alleviates your concerns for the boy.

[Igovernor]

Says he does not have a problem with it then calls the boy "she/he" and then "he".

Also, I took the trouble of Googling the school in question and it is a mixed sex school. https://www.goodschoolsguide.co.uk/s...-school-oxford

Hope that alleviates your concerns for the boy.

What alan_corneli, should have said is that the boy should be in a mixed class not an all girls class!

[Heisenberg]

What alan_corneli, should have said is that the boy should be in a mixed class not an all girls class!

Well, he didn't say that and the boy is in a mixed class... he's a boy in a class with girls.

I was the only male in a history class in a mixed sixth form school. Should they have insisted that more males have to be in the class otherwise I wouldn't have been allowed to attend?

It's depressing how out of touch with reality some people are.

[Croesy Blue]

Two things
1 they are not people yet they are young children

[Bluebirdman Of Alcathays]

You need to read something other than a tabloid newspaper, no children are having anything done to them that is irreversible. Some teenagers get given drugs that delay puberty but any surgery takes place after people become adults and have years of counselling.

Again the same arguments were made against gay people and kids being forced into an “ideology”. People could try being on the right side of history instead of repeating mistakes by following the odd “story” in a tabloid newspaper.

I’m sure there will be the odd instance of something wrong being done, but in the majority of cases transgender kids are handled very well. And this needed to happen because of the high number of suicides among people who identified as transgender but never had any therapy of treatment.

You contradict yourself in the first paragraph - if teenagers are given drugs to delay puberty then children are having things to done to them that won't be able to be fixed later. There are plenty of people who detransition having felt they've made a grave error and find they are infertile and their bodies irrevocably changed. They are angry at how readily their feeling of being the other sex was ushered into transition when they were merely gay or lesbians, and just needed help and support. They then need to seek counselling for having to live in a state that was later found unnecessary.

The comparison with gay people is a false equivalence - gay people don't think of themselves in the "wrong" sexuality, and if they do it's perhaps because they can't come to terms with their homosexuality.

"The right side of history" - I don't read the tabloids on this and am a Corbyn voting atheist and I find it a little embarrassing that it's the right wing press who are mostly asking questions about transitioning kids and the attacks on women who have criticised elements of gender ideology and the flaws in self-ID. Women have been physically attacked and sent death threats and have been deplatformed and women's group meetings disrupted and intimidated for reasonably suggesting that people born male aren't the same as biological women no matter how they present. That doesn't sound like the right side of history.

It'd be interesting to see the figures on transgender suicides; the last transgender suicide I about read was about someone who couldn't stand the intense pain she was in after surgery.

Of course, it's a complex and difficult subject but that's all the more reason not to let a child decide they want to change their bodies for good when they're not yet even in high school.

[Croesy Blue]

You contradict yourself in the first paragraph - if teenagers are given drugs to delay puberty then children are having things to done to them that won't be able to be fixed later.

But the drugs they are given are only temporary and the effects are completely reversable.

I think it is a complex topic though and one I don't understand fully. But the way people are going on about children being forced into choices is wrong. Children were being ignored before and that was leading to suicides.

Just saying it's bollocks isn't right either, there are biological and neurogical studies that show being transgender is a real thing.

I don't get what voting for Corbyn has to do with it tbh.

[William Treseder]

Yes, I don't think anyone has ever changed their gender because someone suggested it as a nice idea. Please do show me an example of it happening as I like to learn.

I see you’ve turned it around, and old Croesy is straight in with the boot.
I’ve not said anywhere in this thread that anyone has ever changed their gender because someone suggested it was a good idea.
You posted that you “ don’t think anyone has”, suggesting that your not 100% sure.

[Bluebirdman Of Alcathays]

But the drugs they are given are only temporary and the effects are completely reversable.

I think it is a complex topic though and one I don't understand fully. But the way people are going on about children being forced into choices is wrong. Children were being ignored before and that was leading to suicides.

Just saying it's bollocks isn't right either, there are biological and neurogical studies that show being transgender is a real thing.

I don't get what voting for Corbyn has to do with it tbh.

I find it difficult to see the point of the temporary drugs. I thought the whole idea in not waiting for adulthood for people to transition is so its less complicated later on and that puberty blocking was there to enable that. I don't know the full facts either but I don't think you'd necessarily catch up with puberty especially after being chemically suppressed.

Fair enough, I assumed when you were talking about tabloids you meant the right wing press and as there'd been a link to Spiked I conflated it all as one side versus the other.

[William Treseder]

But there is scientific proof that transgender people exist. Why don’t you read up about it instead of sticking to a position you’ve just decided upon?

People were saying exactly the same thing about homosexual people 20 years ago. Why don’t you learn from history and do a bit of research before deciding something is un natural or wrong?

There you go again. As it stands, the girl in this topic is exactly that. A girl. She might want to identify as a boy, but she is, at the moment, a girl.
When she gets older, she may feel the same, or even feel stronger that she’s a man trapped in a woman’s body. She can then put the wheels in motion to surgically become a man.
Only then, can she claim to be a man.
A lot of kids at that age are confused, mixed up and emotionally unstable.

[delmbox]

I see you’ve turned it around, and old Croesy is straight in with the boot.
I’ve not said anywhere in this thread that anyone has ever changed their gender because someone suggested it was a good idea.
You posted that you “ don’t think anyone has”, suggesting that your not 100% sure.

He wasn't talking to you though, he was talking to Gofer Blue who suggested exactly that

[Croesy Blue]

There you go again. As it stands,

1. the girl in this topic is exactly that. A girl. She might want to identify as a boy, but she is, at the moment, a girl.


2. When she gets older, she may feel the same, or even feel stronger that she’s a man trapped in a woman’s body. She can then put the wheels in motion to surgically become a man.
.

1. There are scientific studies that show you can be born with the sex of one but it doesn't mean you 100% are that gender, there is a lot of interesting work maybe give it a look before making your mind up.

2. That's why no changes that aren't reversible are made until adulthood after years of therapy.

[William Treseder]

He wasn't talking to you though, he was talking to Gofer Blue who suggested exactly that

I wasn’t talking to you either but you’ve stepped in. That’s how MB’s work.