Coronavirus update - NO MORE RESTRICTIONS

[Croesy Blue]

I didn’t realise they sent 15000 oldies out of hospital into care homes back in March to free up space, thus infecting so many people in care homes which is half the deaths isn’t it?

Yeah they proper ****ed the care homes with that.

[xsnaggle]

Yeah they proper ****ed the care homes with that.

I think there is an agreement in place that Care homes have to take a certain number of old people leaving hospital treatment in order to get cetain government grants or monies. The problem was that when the pandemic broke that should have been suspended but local area medical authorities continued to make them take people.
This was evinced by the owner of that Care Home in the north East where there has been a disproportionate number of inmates dying. When she was interviewed she said something like "They kept phoning and asking if we had spaces and when I said yes but we didn't want to take them because of the virus, they told me if i didn't take them they would stop my funding."
It may have been local authorities doing it but they should have been told to suspend it by Central government.

[the other bob wilson]

Is the R figure above 1 in parts of Wales? The latest update of the Guardian's cases per 100,000 by local area table which shows rising rates and seven Welsh areas in the top eight suggests it is.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...cases-near-you

[CCFCC3PO]

Is the R figure above 1 in parts of Wales? The latest update of the Guardian's cases per 100,000 by local area table which shows rising rates and seven Welsh areas in the top eight suggests it is.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...cases-near-you

The graph showing people in hospital with Covid-19 in Wales shows there has not been the decline that has been seen in other areas of the UK. Some of this may be down to a change in the methods of reporting. It looks, though, that there are more people in hospital with Covid-19 in Wales than there are in London. Considering density of population, plus the fact that the population of London is almost 3 times that of Wales, then easing the lockdown in some of those areas in your link is rightly being done more gradually in Wales.

[Jordi Culé]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...er-coronavirus

I can see a flaw in the governments plan.

[the other bob wilson]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...er-coronavirus

I can see a flaw in the governments plan.

Why is there this obsession in Government, and with those it employs it seems, with things being "world class"? As Keir Starmer said in a recent PMQ, something that works would be good = we've had too many grandiose promises while the deaths mounted up to an appalling level.

That admission by the Chief Executive of Serco says so much about how ideology and dogma is dominating this Government even at a time like this - they're playing politics again.

[the other bob wilson]

The graph showing people in hospital with Covid-19 in Wales shows there has not been the decline that has been seen in other areas of the UK. Some of this may be down to a change in the methods of reporting. It looks, though, that there are more people in hospital with Covid-19 in Wales than there are in London. Considering density of population, plus the fact that the population of London is almost 3 times that of Wales, then easing the lockdown in some of those areas in your link is rightly being done more gradually in Wales.

If anyone is interested, this is a pretty detailed breakdown of the situation in Wales with regard to the stats by area and it's dated yesterday.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52380643

Overall, I'd say they definitely tell the tale of an improving situation and it's good to see that the very high infection rates in this country compared to the rest of the country are not being reflected in positions right at the top of the deaths by area figures. However, the analysis strikes me as a bit vague when it comes to the concerning infection rates which has Welsh regions dominating at the top end of the cases per 100,000 figures - my guess is that, while places like RCT and Merthyr have plenty of wide open spaces, the populations tend to be very tightly packed into rows and rows of small, terraced houses making spreading the virus so much easier.

[Jordi Culé]

Why is there this obsession in Government, and with those it employs it seems, with things being "world class"? As Keir Starmer said in a recent PMQ, something that works would be good = we've had too many grandiose promises while the deaths mounted up to an appalling level.

That admission by the Chief Executive of Serco says so much about how ideology and dogma is dominating this Government even at a time like this - they're playing politics again.

I’ll go further and suggest it’s all smoke and mirrors in looking proactive, competent and in control. Boris was triumphant in detailing how track and trace would defeat the virus whilst throwing out the sound bite that pubs could be open. This of course was put out there the week his mate had travelled the length of England to find childcare and test his eyesight.

Who would’ve thunk our track and trace system would be implemented half arsed and not quite ready?

Good old Boris, following the science

[Jordi Culé]

If anyone is interested, this is a pretty detailed breakdown of the situation in Wales with regard to the stats by area and it's dated yesterday.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52380643

Overall, I'd say they definitely tell the tale of an improving situation and it's good to see that the very high infection rates in this country compared to the rest of the country are not being reflected in positions right at the top of the deaths by area figures. However, the analysis strikes me as a bit vague when it comes to the concerning infection rates which has Welsh regions dominating at the top end of the cases per 100,000 figures - my guess is that, while places like RCT and Merthyr have plenty of wide open spaces, the populations tend to be very tightly packed into rows and rows of small, terraced houses making spreading the virus so much easier.

I think you’re being kind Bob.

I’ve traveled Merthyr & RCT in relation to work and for the last month been constantly surprised how little responsibility some have practiced in relation to social distancing. I visited a block of flats Monday located near a town centre where the residents had had a party. I realise my observations are anecdotal but can’t help wondering if a lack of common sense or total disregard for anything isn’t keeping our infection rates higher than other areas.

None of the persons I work with (vulnerable group) have adhered to any social distancing or lockdown restrictions.

[CCFCC3PO]

I’ll go further and suggest it’s all smoke and mirrors in looking proactive, competent and in control. Boris was triumphant in detailing how track and trace would defeat the virus whilst throwing out the sound bite that pubs could be open. This of course was put out there the week his mate had travelled the length of England to find childcare and test his eyesight.

Who would’ve thunk our track and trace system would be implemented half arsed and not quite ready?

Good old Boris, following the science

Amazingly, he is "proud of his record" and people are defending him.

[CCFCC3PO]

I think you’re being kind Bob.

I’ve traveled Merthyr & RCT in relation to work and for the last month been constantly surprised how little responsibility some have practiced in relation to social distancing. I visited a block of flats Monday located near a town centre where the residents had had a party. I realise my observations are anecdotal but can’t help wondering if a lack of common sense or total disregard for anything isn’t keeping our infection rates higher than other areas.

None of the persons I work with (vulnerable group) have adhered to any social distancing or lockdown restrictions.

I think I have recounted the tales of my furloughed neighbours. They are absolutely loving it - 80% wages, 2 of them have declined the offer to return to work. I am working from home, hours and wages cut 40%, and they are getting 5-10 visitors most days with no Social distancing at all.

As he said to me "It's great innit, hopefully get another three months of this". It's almost like he is incentivised to maintain the spread of the virus. I live in a street of 11 houses (2 empty) and I would say of the 9 occupied, 3 have regular visitors with no social distancing. Two of those houses have people furloughed (in other words, being paid to stay at home and stop the spread), the other house is a recently retired couple.

These are semi-detached houses in a cul-de-sac - gardens front and back. The guy who is thinking "it's great innit" - the same guy that keeps knocking my door and talking about work we could do to improve our house, refused to go to work on safety grounds. The fact is, his workplace is likely to be safer than his home. They had a bbq with friends over on Monday night - that went into the early hours of Tuesday and a couple stayed over.

So, anecdotally, I think a few people couldn't really care less - in fact it's a great summer holiday for some.

[the other bob wilson]

I think you’re being kind Bob.

I’ve traveled Merthyr & RCT in relation to work and for the last month been constantly surprised how little responsibility some have practiced in relation to social distancing. I visited a block of flats Monday located near a town centre where the residents had had a party. I realise my observations are anecdotal but can’t help wondering if a lack of common sense or total disregard for anything isn’t keeping our infection rates higher than other areas.

None of the persons I work with (vulnerable group) have adhered to any social distancing or lockdown restrictions.

I've come across a lot more examples of people not keeping two metres away from me in the last fortnight after having no one do that for the first six to eight weeks of the lockdown, but, overall, my experience has been that people are largely keeping to it. That said, I was barely seeing anyone from late March to the beginning of May because I was just going for the one exercise period per day by walking my dog very early in the morning and so I was hardly getting much of an idea as to what was going on.

[Jordi Culé]

I've come across a lot more examples of people not keeping two metres away from me in the last fortnight after having no one do that for the first six to eight weeks of the lockdown, but, overall, my experience has been that people are largely keeping to it. That said, I was barely seeing anyone from late March to the beginning of May because I was just going for the one exercise period per day by walking my dog very early in the morning and so I was hardly getting much of an idea as to what was going on.

For some and as commented upon by other ‘lockdown fatique’ is growing. I’ll hold my hands up here as I’ve visited my parents although circumstances are dictating that so I’m being a hypocritical ****er.

For other groups, households and in the majority some areas, lockdown hasn’t really been a consideration. It’s interesting that areas of deprivation are being highlighted as places where the infection rate is higher and linked to social conditions, types of employment and poorer health, rarely mentioned though is social habits and lack of adherence to the restrictions.

Again, only anecdotal and from what I’ve observed.

[Rjk]

If anyone is interested, this is a pretty detailed breakdown of the situation in Wales with regard to the stats by area and it's dated yesterday.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52380643

Overall, I'd say they definitely tell the tale of an improving situation and it's good to see that the very high infection rates in this country compared to the rest of the country are not being reflected in positions right at the top of the deaths by area figures. However, the analysis strikes me as a bit vague when it comes to the concerning infection rates which has Welsh regions dominating at the top end of the cases per 100,000 figures - my guess is that, while places like RCT and Merthyr have plenty of wide open spaces, the populations tend to be very tightly packed into rows and rows of small, terraced houses making spreading the virus so much easier.

Also without trying to generalise too much, the concept of social distancing is more alien to someone in the valleys in my experience.
Lived in a leafy cardiff suburb for 15 years and can probably count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I went into a neighbours house, been living in a valleys town for a couple of years and everyone here is related to at least 2 other people on the same street, and they are all in and out of each other people's houses all of the time.

[the other bob wilson]

Also without trying to generalise too much, the concept of social distancing is more alien to someone in the valleys in my experience.
Lived in a leafy cardiff suburb for 15 years and can probably count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I went into a neighbours house, been living in a valleys town for a couple of years and everyone here is related to at least 2 other people on the same street, and they are all in and out of each other people's houses all of the time.

That's a fair point, I don't want to fall into stereotyping here, but, in terms of how neighbours behave towards each other, it's much like I remember it being in the 60s and 70s in Cardiff up here. That's a great thing in my view normally, but it may well be one of the factors causing a problem currently. That said, Cardiff, Swansea, Newport and the Vale of Glamorgan are four of those seven Welsh regions that occupy the top eight of the UK infections per 100,000 people ratings and, from what I know, none of them have a similar attitude to the one you describe.

[lisvaneblue]

That's a fair point, I don't want to fall into stereotyping here, but, in terms of how neighbours behave towards each other, it's much like I remember it being in the 60s and 70s in Cardiff up here. That's a great thing in my view normally, but it may well be one of the factors causing a problem currently. That said, Cardiff, Swansea, Newport and the Vale of Glamorgan are four of those seven Welsh regions that occupy the top eight of the UK infections per 100,000 people ratings and, from what I know, none of them have a similar attitude to the one you describe.

The stats for Wales are quite worrying. Today 76 more cases, majority in N Wales, but Cardiff and RCT featuring too.

In Scotland with roughly twice our population 29 cases, and they've been lower than us on a daily basis for a while.

Northern Ireland, with a similar population to Wales has about half the total number of cases.

The only positive is that our death rate is lowish, but that is little comfort as I'd prefer people didn't catch it in the first place.

Our record on testing is awful and our tracking and tracing non existent, so I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised about our transmission rate

[CCFCC3PO]

The stats for Wales are quite worrying. Today 76 more cases, majority in N Wales, but Cardiff and RCT featuring too.

In Scotland with roughly twice our population 29 cases, and they've been lower than us on a daily basis for a while.

Northern Ireland, with a similar population to Wales has about half the total number of cases.

The only positive is that our death rate is lowish, but that is little comfort as I'd prefer people didn't catch it in the first place.

Our record on testing is awful and our tracking and tracing non existent, so I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised about our transmission rate

What is our transmission rate?

[lisvaneblue]

What is our transmission rate?

Today its 76...ie the number of new cases

[lisvaneblue]

Today its 76...ie the number of new cases

Actually its the R rate which Ive been trying g to look up and its around 0.9 I think, but some parts of Wales must be over 1...when you look at places like Denbigh with 21 new cases today

Mark Drakeford did mention the possibility of tighter restrictions in hot spots, and North Wales is the big hot spot currently

[the other bob wilson]

I see there's a study today saying that seventy per cent of those testing positive (not sure if it's for England only or the UK) report no symptoms. This must mean that the percentage of the population who have had the virus has to be higher than the figure of seven per cent I hear a lot of surely?

[Baloo]

What did Matt Hancock mean in today's briefing when he said we need to really focus on the R rate for the country as a whole before potentially applying localised lockdown measures? He seemed to say it every time it was mentioned that R may be over 1 again in certain regions. Not having a dig just couldn't follow this point which he made several times.

[xsnaggle]

What did Matt Hancock mean in today's briefing when he said we need to really focus on the R rate for the country as a whole before potentially applying localised lockdown measures? He seemed to say it every time it was mentioned that R may be over 1 again in certain regions. Not having a dig just couldn't follow this point which he made several times.

I think what he meant was that they get information form a lot of different sources and have to put it all together and find a common way forward. If for example it's 1.1 in liverpool them presumably it is lower somewhere else. That's not a lot of comfort to liverpudlians but I think they also consider the falling infection rate and stuff like that when they consider regional actions.

[Jordi Culé]

The stats for Wales are quite worrying. Today 76 more cases, majority in N Wales, but Cardiff and RCT featuring too.

In Scotland with roughly twice our population 29 cases, and they've been lower than us on a daily basis for a while.

Northern Ireland, with a similar population to Wales has about half the total number of cases.

The only positive is that our death rate is lowish, but that is little comfort as I'd prefer people didn't catch it in the first place.

Our record on testing is awful and our tracking and tracing non existent, so I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised about our transmission rate

Typical Scottish, too tight to share a virus

No stereotyping there of course.

*Slinks away*

[jon1959]

What did Matt Hancock mean in today's briefing when he said we need to really focus on the R rate for the country as a whole before potentially applying localised lockdown measures? He seemed to say it every time it was mentioned that R may be over 1 again in certain regions. Not having a dig just couldn't follow this point which he made several times.

I missed it today, but if he did say that he is contradicting the government message from earlier in the week. Regional R rates seem to be significant or not depending on the political priority of the day!

[the other bob wilson]

I think what he meant was that they get information form a lot of different sources and have to put it all together and find a common way forward. If for example it's 1.1 in liverpool them presumably it is lower somewhere else. That's not a lot of comfort to liverpudlians but I think they also consider the falling infection rate and stuff like that when they consider regional actions.

I thought he said the R was between .7 and .9 all over the Uk and so I assumed that what he meant was that, as long as that was the case, there was no need for localised lockdowns, but he seemed somewhat distracted throughout the briefing to me and so I might have got the wrong end of the stick.