Season Ticket & Match Ticket Refunds

[chris lee]

Only in football will the customer be told they lose rights simply for asking money back on a product that cannot be supplied.

Imagine if the holiday companies came out with a

"Option 1 - Donate the money to the staff who we have had to lay off
Option 2 - Use the money towards your next holiday, but we will tell you the price later. You will get entered into a draw to get an upgrade to Super Economy"

The club are using emotion to sway people to keeping their money at the club (either through a donation, or towards committing when the doors open), people can choose whichever option they want but the reality is the fans are being asked to subsidise the club. Some members of staff have lost 20% of their wages over the last 3 months, and are likely to lose their jobs when the furlough scheme ends.

The question i have is, how much money is currently invested into the academy by the club. Is that money in jeopardy of being cut back, if so by how much? If it is significant, then how many fans need to donate to make up the shortfall? If it is not in jeopardy, then how will the extra money be used by the academy to actual produce a first team player? I am not sure that the academy's lack of quality is even down to finances.

If fans are being asked to defer the money and pay towards the next season ticket, then why can't the club indicate how much a full season ticket would cost for next season? The price can drop pro-rata until the gates open.

I appreciate the club is finding things difficult, but so are the companies who are employing us. Football clubs (not just ours) have the emotion element to eke more money from fans, but if they are asking fans for more money, then fans are entitled to ask for more details.

what do you mean by lose rights for asking for money back ?

The club is offering a CASH REFUND, of course you can not take that option and keep your rights as a season ticket holder, using your own analogy that is like saying to a holiday company i want my money back but still want a free holidays when you start flying again.

[ccfc_is_my_life]

what do you mean by lose rights for asking for money back ?

The club is offering a CASH REFUND, of course you can not take that option and keep your rights as a season ticket holder, using your own analogy that is like saying to a holiday company i want my money back but still want a free holidays when you start flying again.

Exactly.

The club imo have put forward three decent enough options given the circumstances.

[CCFCC3PO]

You have made some vaild points but the initial analogy is still pointless. Clubs are offering both a refund or credit (like holiday companies are) and the additional, admittedly woolly, option of donating the credit to the Academy on top. That's one option more than holiday companies are offering. Like many people on here I have been offered credit by various airlines without knowing what their prices will be this time next year when I want to re-schedule - and, regarding those fans option for the credit route, I can't see non-Premier League teams inflating prices outrageously in order to swallow up the credit when the gates are open again. I could be wrong on the last point but it would be a huge slap in the face to their loyal fanbase and hugely counter-productive.
People often use analogies that don't stack up and which detracts from the valid points that they are making.

I still stand by the analogy because it highlights that football clubs have the real benefit of brand loyalty (itself an emotional trait) and therefore they can use that to eke more from their fans.

The other point I am trying to make, albeit not very well, is that if football clubs are asking ordinary members of the public to donate, or defer close to £100 per ticket (for entire families, that could be pushed to £200-£250), then an act of courtesy would be to demonstrate how that money is being
a) invested in the academy
b) the value of that money against future ticket prices.

I have no issue with fans choosing any of the 3 options, but would like to see more transparency. People asking for refunds in the current state of affairs is, in my opinion, to be wholly accepted and respected.

[CCFCC3PO]

what do you mean by lose rights for asking for money back ?

The club is offering a CASH REFUND, of course you can not take that option and keep your rights as a season ticket holder, using your own analogy that is like saying to a holiday company i want my money back but still want a free holidays when you start flying again.

I wasn't saying anything like that at all.

[life on mars]

Option 2. £70 off the next available season ticket.

You?

Option 1 .

And I will buy season ticket as normal .

May not see all the games though as closed doors may well exist from September in Wales .

[life on mars]

He’s no longer a Billionaire, 600m was his latest valuation and he’s spent at least 100m on our club!

I deem that very generous

[az city]

There's an option for a cash refund on season tickets.

"Should you instead opt for a cash refund, you will receive a pro-rata cash refund and will forego your status as a Season Ticket Holder, along with associated benefits. You can do so from Monday 15th June at 2pm"

They could/should have put it under an 'Option 3'.

You should be able to request the cash refund and then watch the games on your iFollow subscription.

Some added confusion now. ESPN/ESPN+ generally shows Sky games for the EFL Championship but the Leeds game isn't listed. (Actually the only listed games are the L2 play-offs.) The iFollow rule has been if it's on Sky you have to watch it on ESPN. Some clarity for us poor American buggers would help.

[Fine Lines]

Having used the live stream in ifollow a few times, I have my doubts about whether it will even be watchable when all the season ticket holders are viewing it.

[dml1954]

I still stand by the analogy because it highlights that football clubs have the real benefit of brand loyalty (itself an emotional trait) and therefore they can use that to eke more from their fans.

The other point I am trying to make, albeit not very well, is that if football clubs are asking ordinary members of the public to donate, or defer close to £100 per ticket (for entire families, that could be pushed to £200-£250), then an act of courtesy would be to demonstrate how that money is being
a) invested in the academy
b) the value of that money against future ticket prices.

I have no issue with fans choosing any of the 3 options, but would like to see more transparency. People asking for refunds in the current state of affairs is, in my opinion, to be wholly accepted and respected.

But people are not being asked to ‘donate’. The money has already been paid to the club and spent over 12 months ago. The owner is offering to put an equivalent amount of money into the academy in return for fans agreeing to renew next season at the full price, which would obviously be beneficial to the club to maintain income streams at a very difficult time. You are just making a meal out of this, as usual, to suit your own warped ideas about how the club is run. Also there is no problem with people wanting or needing a refund of the balance (more likely to be £60-£80 in most cases) as long as they are aware that they are giving up their season tickets, as a result of which they will give up their season ticket rights for next season, including being able to keep the same seat. There is nothing unusual in this at all but you obviously think it is some sort of conspiracy for the club to fleece or mislead its own fans.

[The Bloop]

But people are not being asked to ‘donate’. The money has already been paid to the club and spent over 12 months ago. The owner is offering to put an equivalent amount of money into the academy in return for fans agreeing to renew next season at the full price, which would obviously be beneficial to the club to maintain income streams at a very difficult time. You are just making a meal out of this, as usual, to suit your own warped ideas about how the club is run. Also there is no problem with people wanting or needing a refund of the balance (more likely to be £60-£80 in most cases) as long as they are aware that they are giving up their season tickets, as a result of which they will give up their season ticket rights for next season, including being able to keep the same seat. There is nothing unusual in this at all but you obviously think it is some sort of conspiracy for the club to fleece or mislead its own fans.

No one is giving up their season ticket rights for next season only for the remainder of this.
The only relevant right I see is a window in which you'll be able to secure the same seat, but if social distancing remains in place,(even if its 1metre) then fans will have to be spaced accordingly throughout the stadium.

[lisvaneblue]

But people are not being asked to ‘donate’. The money has already been paid to the club and spent over 12 months ago. The owner is offering to put an equivalent amount of money into the academy in return for fans agreeing to renew next season at the full price, which would obviously be beneficial to the club to maintain income streams at a very difficult time. You are just making a meal out of this, as usual, to suit your own warped ideas about how the club is run. Also there is no problem with people wanting or needing a refund of the balance (more likely to be £60-£80 in most cases) as long as they are aware that they are giving up their season tickets, as a result of which they will give up their season ticket rights for next season, including being able to keep the same seat. There is nothing unusual in this at all but you obviously think it is some sort of conspiracy for the club to fleece or mislead its own fans.

I think the Club are being fair but naive if they think that option 2 will get underway any time soon. Social distancing
will be in place for some time to come, although may reduce to 1 metre.
When we are allowed to watch a live game again the max stadium capacity will be 8-10 thousand. Currently there are around 16- 18,000 season ticket holders, so chances of anyone retaining their current seat is a long shot, and how do they allocate tickets if demand exceeds capacity, as no doubt it will.
Im going for option 2 and hope the Club is able to justify its optimistic approach to its faithful season ticket holders

[Hilts]

8 to 10,000 STs will be more than enough.

Without a working vaccine there will be plenty with no intention of going into a football crowd.

[lisvaneblue]

8 to 10,000 STs will be more than enough.

Without a working vaccine there will be plenty with no intention of going into a football crowd.

If you're right, then they still may have to ration places according the section of the ground you sit in. Going by past matches it seems that the majority of ST Holders go for the Ninian or Canton stands. Maybe they'll have to flat price to get an even distribution around the ground

[BLUETIT]

8 to 10,000 STs will be more than enough.

Without a working vaccine there will be plenty with no intention of going into a football crowd.

^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hopefully open up the top tier, that’s over 30,000 seats and remember some season ticket holders are family’s, as in my case, so that’s 4 who can sit together (not that I’ll be going without a vaccine, probably)

[Hilts]

If you're right, then they still may have to ration places according the section of the ground you sit in. Going by past matches it seems that the majority of ST Holders go for the Ninian or Canton stands. Maybe they'll have to flat price to get an even distribution around the ground

Yeah the younger element gather mainly in the Canton. Low risk from covid unlikely to be bothered about the crowds. My father is in his 70s and has no intention of going into a crowd without a vaccine.

[delmbox]

No one is giving up their season ticket rights for next season only for the remainder of this.
The only relevant right I see is a window in which you'll be able to secure the same seat, but if social distancing remains in place,(even if its 1metre) then fans will have to be spaced accordingly throughout the stadium.

How would this be possible though? You'd have to tell people which games they're allowed to go to, it'd be chaos. More likely to be all or nothing don't you think?

[CCFCC3PO]

How would this be possible though? You'd have to tell people which games they're allowed to go to, it'd be chaos. More likely to be all or nothing don't you think?

I can see a possibility for tickets being sold game by game, capacity limited to a certain amount. Regardless of whether people attend as a family or not. The difficulty will be people leaving the stadium, and possibly entering.

[Der Kaiser]

8 to 10,000 STs will be more than enough.

Without a working vaccine there will be plenty with no intention of going into a football crowd.

The Blues in the Super Rugby their biggest crowd for 15 years today (40,000+). I disagree with your point completely, people will flock back to sports events.

[lisvaneblue]

The Blues in the Super Rugby their biggest crowd for 15 years today (40,000+). I disagree with your point completely, people will flock back to sports events.

Hardly comparable. NZ with 1500 cases of Covid and 22 deaths and now free of it, and us....need I say more

In time we will get the crowds back, but I doubt it will be back to norm before 21/22 season unless a vaccine appears early next year or sooner.

[The Bloop]

How would this be possible though? You'd have to tell people which games they're allowed to go to, it'd be chaos. More likely to be all or nothing don't you think?

I can see a possibility for tickets being sold game by game, capacity limited to a certain amount. Regardless of whether people attend as a family or not. The difficulty will be people leaving the stadium, and possibly entering.

I can also envisage no away fans being allowed so that grounds can safely accommodate all the home fans who wish to go.
Like others I cant see myself going again until a vaccine is available.

[splott parker]

Do it the supermarket way, two metre lines outside, everyone social distancing and being very careful and considerate......once you’re inside, walk where you like, lean over people at the cold meat counter, climb over someone to get the cereal on the top shelf, squeeze past the four staff having a chat, pick up umpteen chickens, feel them, prod them, then put them back etc etc, then go back to the two metre rule at the till and leave

[CCFCC3PO]

Do it the supermarket way, two metre lines outside, everyone social distancing and being very careful and considerate......once you’re inside, walk where you like, lean over people at the cold meat counter, climb over someone to get the cereal on the top shelf, squeeze past the four staff having a chat, pick up umpteen chickens, feel them, prod them, then put them back etc etc, then go back to the two metre rule at the till and leave

Yeah, the supermarket is seriously annoying. People walking the opposite direction to the arrows, people stopping for a chat in the middle of an aisle (which pissed me off in normal times to be fair), they also took away a lot of the "offers" - our bill is about 20% higher but a lot of that is because we don't get to have our meal out once a week/2 weeks.

[CCFCC3PO]

I can also envisage no away fans being allowed so that grounds can safely accommodate all the home fans who wish to go.
Like others I cant see myself going again until a vaccine is available.

Yes, that also saves on policing.

I think capacity reduced to 20% and tickets sold game by game. I can't see any season tickets being sold for next season.

[Des Parrot]

Has anyone tried to do this? It just keeps going around in a loop, from "click here & log in" which takes you straight back to "update for".

Clubs a ....

[IanD]

Has anyone tried to do this? It just keeps going around in a loop, from "click here & log in" which takes you straight back to "update for".

Clubs a ....

Same as you....going round in circles.