Political post.. @Yescymru

[Rjk]

Whilst we are in the Union, the reasons Wales is poorer than England will never be addressed.

[OurManFlint II]

Ireland (prior to EU membership) and Iceland have their own currencies. To be truly independent you have to have a currency; otherwise public spending and borrowing would have to be controlled by the country to which the currency belongs. ONS data indicates public spending in Wales is £14.7bn greater than taxes received so how is this gap to be closed if spending in Wales in effectively controlled by the UK government even if Wales was independent. It could never happen.

Do you have a link that has a breakdown on the Welsh Public spending figures?

[Vindec]

Do you have a link that has a breakdown on the Welsh Public spending figures?

Not a breakdown as such. This is where I got my information. It's now a few years old. Read from "A basket case" down.

https://www.dw.com/en/could-an-indep...one/a-49952972

[Rjk]

Not a breakdown as such. This is where I got my information. It's now a few years old. Read from "A basket case" down.

https://www.dw.com/en/could-an-indep...one/a-49952972

The fact that there is such a disparity between the economy here and other parts of the UK is more of a case of independence than against one for me.

Decisions will always be made to support the economy in London and the South East, no matter the effect on regions such as Wales.

Ireland was probably the poorest part of the UK and now it is richer than the UK, because it takes decisions that benefits itself, not london.

If Ireland had never become independent it would probably still be as poor a Wales.

[Rjk]

lets just remember that globalism wasn't around in the 1920s (or 1940s - depending on how you define independence), and that localism played a much greater part of trade. Regardless, for many many years the punt was pegged to Sterling and all spend decisions for Ireland were made in Westminster.

Ireland didn't catch up and overtake the UK until the 1990s/2000s

[WJ99mobile]

Absolutely not personally and haven't showed anything to make me choose otherwise

[lennybluebird]

Wales as is the case with Scotland will never be independent, if there not hitched up to England then they will be hitched up to Germany via brussels....people died to stop this in two wars.

[WJ99mobile]

In my opinion this died a death around 1990. The WDA was on the crest of a wave, pulling in foreign investment and manufacturing, exactly what was required to under pin independence. Then they fell to combination of corruption & illegal payments charges coupled with being outmanoeuvred by the EU funded Irish DA. The opportunity to reindustrialise Wales died there & then, through incompetence & complacency.

Should bring back the WDA

The whole of Wales is so compartmentalized it's crazy

The government could use it's powers to have future thinking development and use value adding methods and taking advantage of it's borrowing and legislative powers.

For example there's 7 miles between J34 and J35.

Buy up all the farm land in that area that they can get their hands on at £8000 an acre via compulsory purchase orders
Remediate and plan in a way that suits Wales and future projects
Sell serviced bits of land to developers for 100x what you just paid for it
Overly simplistic and long termism but Drakefords small town mentality will strangle the M4 corridor and hollow out the valleys from within with his politics

[WJ99mobile]

Whilst we are in the Union, the reasons Wales is poorer than England will never be addressed.

What are the reasons?

[Rjk]

What are the reasons?

Lack of investment, and everything being driven to generate jobs and growth in London

[OurManFlint II]

Not a breakdown as such. This is where I got my information. It's now a few years old. Read from "A basket case" down.

https://www.dw.com/en/could-an-indep...one/a-49952972

Thanks, suppose i could get into the weeds of it myself but can't be arsed, was just interested in where it was going in a nice pie chart as i'm sure things like the armed force, nuclear power/weapons and foreign aid to Israel and other none deserving countries could be cut.

Interesting how aside from 1 person the argument has simply been about economics. Living in Catalunya for 20 years its a lot more nuanced, sentiment of people, language, culture, arts, education, and hundreds of other things.

Why is the UK in massive debt if Westminster and England is so great and strong?

[Vindec]

The fact that there is such a disparity between the economy here and other parts of the UK is more of a case of independence than against one for me.

Decisions will always be made to support the economy in London and the South East, no matter the effect on regions such as Wales.

Ireland was probably the poorest part of the UK and now it is richer than the UK, because it takes decisions that benefits itself, not london.

If Ireland had never become independent it would probably still be as poor a Wales.

What currency would Wales be able to use if it became independent?

[surge]

Whatever your views on the outcomes...

Welsh government: "We have tried to make the M4 relief road work but there is no way of making it a success and it doesn't fit with our commitment to the environment. Can we have investment in public transport?

UK government: "No. Despite our commitments to climate change, we will over-ride you if necessary because we fancy winning seats in Newport and Bristol."

Welsh government: "The chief health officers are recommending a circuit break in order to best manage the virus. We are unable to provide financial support to businesses on scale needed directly, we are willing to pay costs to make sure that they can access UK services smoothly - is that okay?

UK government: "No. You should have thought about that before taking alternative action despite the prime minister having very little contact with your government. If your actions are deemed a success then it will make us look bad."

Maybe in 10 years we find that the Welsh government had the wrong idea, maybe we don't, but the lack of dialogue and respect is concerning.

[jon1959]

Wales as is the case with Scotland will never be independent, if there not hitched up to England then they will be hitched up to Germany via brussels....people died to stop this in two wars.

People died in two world wars to stop Wales becoming a member of the European Union?

Really?

Interesting to see the punchline of the 2017 UKIP manifesto is still getting air time!

[ManBearPig]

Don't we get more money from West minster than we put in?

What would Wales build upon to become self sufficient?

These are genuine questions by the way, I don't actually know what yes cymrus plans are.

Also, why is it yes Cymru and not ydw Cymru?

[The Gifaffe]

When I was a kid we had a local councillor and an MP.

Up until recently we had a councillor, an AM, an MP and an MEP.

I voted for Brexit and now the latter is history.

If I get the chance, so will my MS, or whatever they're called now.

Why would I vote for an organisation which spends millions on a feasibility study for a road which would help stop cars being stood still on the motorway, and then cancel it on environmental grounds despite having spent further millions buying Cardiff airport to protect polluting planes coming into the country(their flights to North Wales being safeguarded too being a happy accident), and on a study for a race track in the middle of the Welsh countryside, and creating a minimum price for alcohol which means the good people of Cardiff and Newport can now view a trip to Bristol as a 'Calais' run, whilst allowing swathes of land in the countryside around Cardiff and elsewhere to be built on?

All this whilst spending further fortunes on a name change and proposals to increase the number of Senedd members.

More politicians is the answer to no question ever asked.

[Rjk]

I was being sarcastic. Wales on it's own is about as wealthy as Sudan

how about per capita?

[Rjk]

What currency would Wales be able to use if it became independent?

let's use the euro

[Feedback]

comparable to chad?

don't be ridiculous

Its called a metaphor. It wasn't literal

[Feedback]

Ireland didn't catch up and overtake the UK until the 1990s/2000s

With all due respect Irish GDP is vastly inflated with the double Irish set up for large multinationals.

A large part of Irish GDP does not feed through to Ireland. If you strip out the multinationals who don't actually spend their money in Ireland, you'll see a lower GDP more in line with Northern Ireland.

[Feedback]

Lack of investment, and everything being driven to generate jobs and growth in London

Why will independence bring inward investment?

[Feedback]

let's use the euro

So not independent then, but tied to Brussels.

[Bluebirdman Of Alcathays]

So not independent then, but tied to Brussels.

Technically we wouldn't be completely alone like the US or some such (or how Britain would like to be so they can pretend their every success was singularly down to them) but we'd be a recognised nation with our own laws and tax raising powers.

[Tuerto]

With all due respect Irish GDP is vastly inflated with the double Irish set up for large multinationals.

A large part of Irish GDP does not feed through to Ireland. If you strip out the multinationals who don't actually spend their money in Ireland, you'll see a lower GDP more in line with Northern Ireland.

Ireland is almost a Tax Haven for the blue chips.

[Garth Blue]

are these similar sized countries economies so intertwined with a G8 nation that its impossible to differentiate one from the other?

How anyone believes that Wales is doing well, beggers belief. Under which metric of success would you say we are doing well?