Coronavirus update - NO MORE RESTRICTIONS

[The Lone Gunman]

Unless someone has a terminally ill relative or close friend who they know is not going to be around for Christmas 2021, I don't get this clamour to "save our Christmas".

Ironically, I do have a terminally ill relative who is in an extremely vulnerable position and that's precisely why I'm not going to put her at any further risk by trying to 'save Christmas'.

Under the current rules here in Wales, I'm not allowed to go and sit with her in her garden, but I could meet up with her in a pub if she was able to leave her house - which she isn't. Pretty soon it's possible that I could go to a football match with approximately 4,000 other people, but not be allowed to sit in a garden with a terminally ill relative.

It's all about the science, allegedly.

[Jordi Culé]

They're following the science, like they've been doing all along.

Honest.

I’ve been generally a supporter of Welsh Government’s strategy in regards to Covid-19 although there are a number of idiosyncrasies which have bewildered.

This five day Christmas thing wreaks of leaders not being able to lead, tell the truth about the situation and lacking balls. Throw in they don’t want to be portrayed as the Grinch.

I hope they’ve got explanations for us all if the figures in January are on the up and we’re in an extended firebreak period. I also hope those who enjoy the festivities think it was worth it just to hear a family member sing Shakey on the karaoke.

‘Merry Christmas Everyone’.

[Jordi Culé]

Ironically, I do have a terminally ill relative who is in an extremely vulnerable position and that's precisely why I'm not going to put her at any further risk by trying to 'save Christmas'.

Under the current rules here in Wales, I'm not allowed to go and sit with her in her garden, but I could meet up with her in a pub if she was able to leave her house - which she isn't. Pretty soon it's possible that I could go to a football match with approximately 4,000 other people, but not be allowed to sit in a garden with a terminally ill relative.

It's all about the science, allegedly.

Mass testing available in Merthyr from Saturday. On the same day there were a number of local football matches played. Rugby matches can’t be played as it would exceed the rule of 30.

As clear as crystal isn’t it?

[surge]

Ironically, I do have a terminally ill relative who is in an extremely vulnerable position and that's precisely why I'm not going to put her at any further risk by trying to 'save Christmas'.

Under the current rules here in Wales, I'm not allowed to go and sit with her in her garden, but I could meet up with her in a pub if she was able to leave her house - which she isn't. Pretty soon it's possible that I could go to a football match with approximately 4,000 other people, but not be allowed to sit in a garden with a terminally ill relative.

It's all about the science, allegedly.

Person 1: the rules don't make sense
Person 2: there are too many rules, I don't understand them

At the moment you are person 1 but you are still more likely to follow the rules (or break the rules in a safe way) than person 2 who is interviewed on the TV frequently but needs the rules to be as simple as possible.

Gardens have been included in these restrictions because in winter it is much more likely that people meeting in a garden will need or want to go indoors into the home, and as already explained a lot of the transmission of coronavirus is happening in people’s homes: https://gov.wales/coronavirus-regula...#section-39235

Ideally, the rules would be that you can meet in a garden but only doing so in a safe way. Here is part a, b, c and d on how you can make this safer. However, that stops us being "in it together" which, so the theory goes, is a way that ensures compliance is higher and a person who feels there are already too many rules will stop listening after "you can meet in a garden".

We know that the longer you spend with someone, the closer you get to them and the less ventilation there is the more likely the virus will spread between you. I am sure you are far more likely to want to get close and spend longer with a person you care about than a stranger at a football match so it is a riskier situation and while you can do it safely a Person 2 cannot.

[surge]

I’ve been generally a supporter of Welsh Government’s strategy in regards to Covid-19 although there are a number of idiosyncrasies which have bewildered.

This five day Christmas thing wreaks of leaders not being able to lead, tell the truth about the situation and lacking balls. Throw in they don’t want to be portrayed as the Grinch.

I hope they’ve got explanations for us all if the figures in January are on the up and we’re in an extended firebreak period. I also hope those who enjoy the festivities think it was worth it just to hear a family member sing Shakey on the karaoke.

‘Merry Christmas Everyone’.

The police struggle to control 700 people breaking the rules at a rave. How many people celebrate Christmas, if you include those doing so as a non-religious holiday, in the UK? Police won't be able to stop several thousands doing what they want, and once they do what they want once why not again and again, so government has instead given us a break with guidance over a short period of time. It's likely to have a horrible impact in January but better than people sticking up two fingers in December, January and February because everyone is breaking the rules all the time now anyway.

Christmas isn't a religious festival in the UK for majority of people. It's gathering close together to get through the darkest, most depressing part of the year and this year has been more depressing than most. I can also see why some people would rather do everything possible so that they can gather at next Christmas rather than finish the year off with the most depressing of notes.

[goats]

I’ve been generally a supporter of Welsh Government’s strategy in regards to Covid-19 although there are a number of idiosyncrasies which have bewildered.

This five day Christmas thing wreaks of leaders not being able to lead, tell the truth about the situation and lacking balls. Throw in they don’t want to be portrayed as the Grinch.

I hope they’ve got explanations for us all if the figures in January are on the up and we’re in an extended firebreak period. I also hope those who enjoy the festivities think it was worth it just to hear a family member sing Shakey on the karaoke.

‘Merry Christmas Everyone’.

Crazy stuff, does anyone really care about Christmas?? Most people aren’t religious so it’s not that angle. I guess they are happy to wipe out some of their relatives, which is even more nuts.

[Rjk]

Crazy stuff, does anyone really care about Christmas?? Most people aren’t religious so it’s not that angle. I guess they are happy to wipe out some of their relatives, which is even more nuts.

Yes lots of non religious people care about christmas. I guess the politicians probably figured tht many people are going to have a christmas anyway, so they may as well relax the rules a little and try to stop people from going too far.

[Jordi Culé]

Yes lots of non religious people care about christmas. I guess the politicians probably figured tht many people are going to have a christmas anyway, so they may as well relax the rules a little and try to stop people from going too far.

Perhaps they should've done an advisory information campaign?

Something like an advert of a Christmas family get together, with the grand kids all over Nan and Bampa, the mama and dads drinking sherry, singing and dancing to 'Rockin Around the Christmas Tree'.

They could then cut straight to mid January where Nan and Bampa are wheeled in together Llwydcoed crematorium. The last song played before they draw the curtains being ironically 'Rockin Around the Christmas Tree'.

The whole thing would end with the words "Well that was worth it!" whilst Boris, Sturgeon and Drakeford give a sympathetic smile.

[lardy]

Crazy stuff, does anyone really care about Christmas?? Most people aren’t religious so it’s not that angle. I guess they are happy to wipe out some of their relatives, which is even more nuts.

Hmm is Christmas a big deal? Does anyone care about it?

It's a toughie!

[Vindec]

Hmm is Christmas a big deal? Does anyone care about it?

It's a toughie!

No. It's not a toughie. It's ridiculous risking the lives and health of families and the possibility of a third lockdown just for a few days boozing and eating with people you only usually see at Christmas.

[lardy]

No. It's not a toughie. It's ridiculous risking the lives and health of families and the possibility of a third lockdown just for a few days boozing and eating with people you only usually see at Christmas.

I agree, but it's not because no one cares about Christmas.

[jeepster]

Perhaps they should've done an advisory information campaign?

Something like an advert of a Christmas family get together, with the grand kids all over Nan and Bampa, the mama and dads drinking sherry, singing and dancing to 'Rockin Around the Christmas Tree'.

They could then cut straight to mid January where Nan and Bampa are wheeled in together Llwydcoed crematorium. The last song played before they draw the curtains being ironically 'Rockin Around the Christmas Tree'.

The whole thing would end with the words "Well that was worth it!" whilst Boris, Sturgeon and Drakeford give a sympathetic smile.

This made me smile then the reality kicks in.You could be on to a winner here could be the most watched advert.

[goats]

Can people travel to Wales from England after this lockdown? Some friends of mine want to know if they can hire a self contained house for a few days around Christmas?

[xsnaggle]

Can people travel to Wales from England after this lockdown? Some friends of mine want to know if they can hire a self contained house for a few days around Christmas?

Self-contained house?????????????

[Rjk]

https://www.wired.com/story/the-astr...t-up-to-snuff/

[Rjk]

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/20...mpression=true

more cronyism from the Tories. disgusting stuff

[Croesy Blue]

https://www.wired.com/story/the-astr...t-up-to-snuff/

None of that really strikes me as being as bad as the article makes out really. What's wrong with combining different parts of the trial to estimate the efficiency?

It doesn't look a perfectly controlled experiment with the different doses providing different efficiencies but is that really a major problem when the minimum efficiency is still over 60%?

[Croesy Blue]

Yes lots of non religious people care about christmas. I guess the politicians probably figured tht many people are going to have a christmas anyway, so they may as well relax the rules a little and try to stop people from going too far.

That's how I saw it too, relaxing the rules means people will be less likely to just do whatever they want.

What does everyone on here plan to do? I'll be seeing my parents after a couple of weeks of not doing anything risky who are only in their 50s so not overly at risk. But won't be seeing any extended family at all this year.

[goats]

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/p...rdiff-19346265

[the other bob wilson]

https://www.wired.com/story/the-astr...t-up-to-snuff/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...zeneca-vaccine

[lisvaneblue]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...zeneca-vaccine

Now that the trial details are in the public domain I doubt the US FDA will approve it until further trails are done in elderly patients. I guess the UK MHRA might approve it for use in those under 55, but not the elderly based on current data.

[Hilts]

Still reckon the Oxford will be first rolled out to the vulnerable.

Pubs shut again from Tuesday I reckon.

[Delbert]

The claim made by AstraZeneca / Oxford that the vaccine has 70% efficacy seems hard to justify given that figure was achieved by combining the results of 2 different dosing regimes one of which was a small subset containing no over 55s (90%) and the other a larger group which did contain over 55s (62%).

Surely the correct headline should be the vaccine has 62% efficacy but that further studies are to be carried out on a large representative population to see if the half dose then full dose regime does have greater efficacy.

Given the enormous political capital invested in this vaccine by the UK Government I wonder whether this has had the effect of pressurising AstraZeneca / Oxford to make a claim which at this point in time, according to some independent scientific opinion, does not appear to stand up to close scrutiny? A headline of 62% efficacy would not have looked great compared to the 95% efficacy claimed by the other 2 vaccines.

[the other bob wilson]

The claim made by AstraZeneca / Oxford that the vaccine has 70% efficacy seems hard to justify given that figure was achieved by combining the results of 2 different dosing regimes one of which was a small subset containing no over 55s (90%) and the other a larger group which did contain over 55s (62%).

Surely the correct headline should be the vaccine has 62% efficacy but that further studies are to be carried out on a large representative population to see if the half dose then full dose regime does have greater efficacy.

Given the enormous political capital invested in this vaccine by the UK Government I wonder whether this has had the effect of pressurising AstraZeneca / Oxford to make a claim which at this point in time, according to some independent scientific opinion, does not appear to stand up to close scrutiny? A headline of 62% efficacy would not have looked great compared to the 95% efficacy claimed by the other 2 vaccines.

And yet flu vaccines have 60% efficacy apparently, so while I can understand the need for further testing of the 90% claim on older people, it seems that the Oxford vaccine falls within standards which have been accepted for other vaccines.

[Rjk]

And yet flu vaccines have 60% efficacy apparently, so while I can understand the need for further testing of the 90% claim on older people, it seems that the Oxford vaccine falls within standards which have been accepted for other vaccines.

if they're effectively cherry picking results to appear better the. really we don't know what the efficacy is.