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Thread: Coronavirus update - NO MORE RESTRICTIONS

  1. #5851

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Vindec View Post
    I doubt whether all NHS staff will be first in the queue. There are many admin staff, for example, who don't work anywhere near the hospitals and many others who work nowhere near the COVID wards which are usually in separate areas and even different buildings to the main hospital. Isolating COVID patients from the rest of the hospital (in red zones) is usually well done so it would make no sense for all NHS staff to receive priority over the over 80s. Of course those on the front line should receive absolute priority but, as for the rest, I'm doubtful whether they will qualify to receive the jab in the first wave.
    Daily Telegraph and Guardian are saying that NHS staff will come first. Seems odd as in the past the Government has always followed the science, which says elderly and vulnerable should be first.

    NHS now has all the PPE it needs, has Nightingale hospitals, generally has young and healthy staff. Yet NHS staff will be offered the vaccine first.

    This means they will be able to handle all the elderly that are admitted to hospital because they haven't been vaccinated.

  2. #5852

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by the other bob wilson View Post
    R rate down to between 0-9 and 1 in the UK, but the rate in Wales is reported as being up to 1.4.
    There's only one thing for it: Drakeford and Co are going to have to outlaw the sale of tea lights and toasters until the New Year.

  3. #5853

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    Daily Telegraph and Guardian are saying that NHS staff will come first. Seems odd as in the past the Government has always followed the science, which says elderly and vulnerable should be first.

    NHS now has all the PPE it needs, has Nightingale hospitals, generally has young and healthy staff. Yet NHS staff will be offered the vaccine first.

    This means they will be able to handle all the elderly that are admitted to hospital because they haven't been vaccinated.
    NHS staff working on the front line, such as my son, should receive priority because if they caught the virus and went sick there would be fewer staff to treat the patients. NHS admin staff dealing with pensions and other admin duties in separate buildings should receive lower priority than front line staff. That was the point made in my earlier post (which you quoted).

  4. #5854

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    Daily Telegraph and Guardian are saying that NHS staff will come first. Seems odd as in the past the Government has always followed the science, which says elderly and vulnerable should be first.

    NHS now has all the PPE it needs, has Nightingale hospitals, generally has young and healthy staff. Yet NHS staff will be offered the vaccine first.

    This means they will be able to handle all the elderly that are admitted to hospital because they haven't been vaccinated.
    The elderly and vulnerable can shield, the NHS staff have no choice but be exposed to it. Also "the NHS now has all the PPE it needs" seems like a pretty broad statement

  5. #5855

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Also the disease gets worse with the higher viral load, no one is getting a higher viral load than NHS staff.

    Being young and healthy isn’t the important if you’re getting a shit ton of the virus.

  6. #5856

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Vindec View Post
    NHS staff working on the front line, such as my son, should receive priority because if they caught the virus and went sick there would be fewer staff to treat the patients. NHS admin staff dealing with pensions and other admin duties in separate buildings should receive lower priority than front line staff. That was the point made in my earlier post (which you quoted).
    Point is that your son working on the front line has the benefit of all the PPE etc that the NHS has. OK he may catch it despite all the protective equipment, and be off work for a while, but is unlikely to be seriously ill. However, an 80 year old will not have the level of protection your son has and may not survive.

    If we vaccinated the age groups that are currently filling hospital beds professionals like your son would finally find that they have breathing space.

  7. #5857

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post

    If we vaccinated the age groups that are currently filling hospital beds professionals like your son would finally find that they have breathing space.
    Not if the professionals are off sick with the virus.

  8. #5858

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    The elderly and vulnerable can shield, the NHS staff have no choice but be exposed to it. Also "the NHS now has all the PPE it needs" seems like a pretty broad statement
    A member of my family works on 'the front line' at UHW. Everything they do in the clinical setting is with the correct amount of protection, rigorous cleaning both personal and surroundings, regular monitoring and testing of staff etc.


    Yet despite all this she caught it, not from the hospital, but from her daughter catching it in school.

    Im what is generally referred to as elderly and my good lady is elderly and vulnerable. You mention shielding, we tried it in March when the outbreak started. We would have starved if we'd depended solely on supermarket deliveries. We just get on with life and have given up on house parties and raves.
    And Im not hinting that I should be front of the queue for a vaccine, but to offer it to NHS staff first, for what appears to be logistical reasons ( the need for 'vaccine hubs') seems stupid when we all know that the people filling hospital beds and putting pressure on the NHS are 60years plus and they should be sorted first

  9. #5859

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Vindec View Post
    Not if the professionals are off sick with the virus.
    The problem with the NHS is that it's getting overloaded with elderly people catching Covid and needing hospital care.

    That needs to be addressed first.

  10. #5860

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    The problem with the NHS is that it's getting overloaded with elderly people catching Covid and needing hospital care.

    That needs to be addressed first.
    So we seem to agree that NHS staff not on the front line such as Admin staff shouldn't receive priority. Where we differ is that I think staff on the front line should receive priority and you think the elderly should be first in the queue. The elderly had the opportunity to prevent getting the virus whereas health professionals working on the front line are required to do their job. They have no choice. Additionally the NHS has a duty of care particularly to their front line staff. We are not going to agree.

  11. #5861

    Re: Coronavirus update

    I think it’s a logistical thing too the first vaccine is the Pfizer one that can only be moved safely a couple of times and has to be stored at a lower temperature so it makes sense to give it to people already in the hospitals.

    I imagine the Oxford one will be one or two weeks behind and that’ll be given to care homes and over 80s.

  12. #5862

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post

    You mention shielding, we tried it in March when the outbreak started.
    You were banging on about wanting to drive to Brecon to get meat in March

  13. #5863
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    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    You were banging on about wanting to drive to Brecon to get meat in March
    If he'd gone then he might not have to go now and spread it even more.

  14. #5864

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Vindec View Post
    So we seem to agree that NHS staff not on the front line such as Admin staff shouldn't receive priority. Where we differ is that I think staff on the front line should receive priority and you think the elderly should be first in the queue. The elderly had the opportunity to prevent getting the virus whereas health professionals working on the front line are required to do their job. They have no choice. Additionally the NHS has a duty of care particularly to their front line staff. We are not going to agree.
    I no longer hear of NHS staff being off sick with Covid now that PPE shortage is sorted. However the news frequently says that staff are off with stress and exhaustion, and understandably so. That will only change when the patients flow into hospitals eases

  15. #5865

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by xsnaggle View Post
    If he'd gone then he might not have to go now and spread it even more.
    Was there for three nights last week. Have I mentioned that the butchers there do great Welsh meat?

  16. #5866

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by delmbox View Post
    You were banging on about wanting to drive to Brecon to get meat in March
    Yes, no bloody delivery slots from the supermarkets locally.

  17. #5867

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Screenshot_2020-11-28-14-38-08-961_com.android.chrome.jpg

    looks like cases are starting to creep back up. the lockdown did stop the very fast rise initially, but it's stubbornly refused to drop any further, and looks like it is creeping back up already.
    will they be able to wait until after Xmas for lockdown 3.0?

  18. #5868

    Re: Coronavirus update

    They could easily give front line staff on the covid wards the jab aswell as oldies, surely that would be a good outcome? Less people severely ill needing long term care in hospital and less staff off....

  19. #5869

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    I no longer hear of NHS staff being off sick with Covid now that PPE shortage is sorted. However the news frequently says that staff are off with stress and exhaustion, and understandably so. That will only change when the patients flow into hospitals eases
    They’ll be getting it once the other is approved, this is why they’re getting it first:

    Only NHS staff will be inoculated at first, with care home residents and vulnerable over-80s having to wait.

    It comes as experts believe the Pfizer vaccine should be moved no more than four times because it risks becoming ineffective - making it difficult to transport to care homes.

    By the time it reaches UK hospitals, it will have been moved twice - from the Pfizer production plant in Belgium to storage hubs in Britain and from there, to hospitals.
    I think sometimes we have to accept that logistic and medical experts know more than us.

    And I think a few NHS workers have died of covid recently, PPE doesn’t make you immune to it.

  20. #5870

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Rjk View Post
    Screenshot_2020-11-28-14-38-08-961_com.android.chrome.jpg

    looks like cases are starting to creep back up. the lockdown did stop the very fast rise initially, but it's stubbornly refused to drop any further, and looks like it is creeping back up already.
    will they be able to wait until after Xmas for lockdown 3.0?
    Back up to around the level it was pre firebreak today (1,400plus), but there were the highest number of tests yesterday that I've seen since I started checking the Welsh figures everyday, so that explains it to some extent - the firebreak seems to have done more harm than good in Blaenau Gwent (over 400 today), while the Rhondda and Merthyr board figures are heading upwards again.

    https://public.tableau.com/profile/p...eadlinesummary

  21. #5871

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    I no longer hear of NHS staff being off sick with Covid now that PPE shortage is sorted. However the news frequently says that staff are off with stress and exhaustion, and understandably so. That will only change when the patients flow into hospitals eases
    There were 620 NHS deaths up to the end of August. I can't find any up to date figures figures but the fact there have been many deaths indicate that the number of NHS workers catching the virus must run into the thousands.

  22. #5872

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Vindec View Post
    There were 620 NHS deaths up to the end of August. I can't find any up to date figures figures but the fact there have been many deaths indicate that the number of NHS workers catching the virus must run into the thousands.
    It's awful that there have been any deaths. However I guess most of those you mention occurred in the March-May period when PPE was in short supply, when doctors were learning how to handle the disease, and because so many people were being admitted into hospital. During the summer months UK death rates from Covid dipped considerably.

    In Uk up to end October over 55000 people died of Covid and 50,000 of those were age over 65. So the point Ive been trying to make is that the old need protection first.

    In England the NHS say that they will cover NHS staff first, which is what we have been arguing over. The experts from the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation say that care home staff and residents should be first, followed by those over 80 and front line NHS staff.
    Northern Ireland have announced their programme and it follows the Joint Committee recommendations.

    Wales has yet to say what it intends to do.

  23. #5873

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by lisvaneblue View Post
    It's awful that there have been any deaths. However I guess most of those you mention occurred in the March-May period when PPE was in short supply, when doctors were learning how to handle the disease, and because so many people were being admitted into hospital. During the summer months UK death rates from Covid dipped considerably.

    In Uk up to end October over 55000 people died of Covid and 50,000 of those were age over 65. So the point Ive been trying to make is that the old need protection first.

    In England the NHS say that they will cover NHS staff first, which is what we have been arguing over. The experts from the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation say that care home staff and residents should be first, followed by those over 80 and front line NHS staff.
    Northern Ireland have announced their programme and it follows the Joint Committee recommendations.

    Wales has yet to say what it intends to do.
    Wales starts vaccines this week.

  24. #5874

    Re: Coronavirus update

    Popped out earlier this evening to pick up some food and drove passed one of the local pubs, there were about 7or8 dickheads crammed into the doorway having a smoke literally shoulder to shoulder. No wonder it’s rising again, these people (quite a lot actually) just cannot social distance or give two fcuks about anything but themselves.

  25. #5875
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    Re: Coronavirus update

    Quote Originally Posted by Allez Allez Allez View Post
    Wales starts vaccines this week.
    Allegedly

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