So it's National Insurance then

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

Thanks Sludge, she has been in a care home since May last year. I spoke with Age Cymru a few weeks ago, they were really helpful in helping make sense of the system after the council confused the hell out of me. We are looking at the deferred payment agreement so we don't have to sell her house. Do you think Age Cymru can kick the council up the arse then?

If anyone can do it they can

Is anyone living in the house at the moment as their only residence ?

[dandywarhol]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

Do pensioners pay NI still?

To clarify working pensioners will pay the new tax.

[Re-sign Carl Dale]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

If your mother and father are still alive but your mother is in a care home isn't the assumption made that only your mother's share of the house (50% assuming tenants in common) is taken into consideration? Furthermore would your father be required to sell the house he lives if your mother dies before him?

Sorry for the daft question but I am trying to get to grips with my understanding of the past and present situation because things must have changed since I was involved in this issue for my parents.

If both parents are alive, the value of the home is completely ignored providing that one owner (or anyone relative over the age of 60 is living there as their main home) - it doesn't matter if t's owned as tenants in common or jointly tenancy.

Top advice from Ian about Lasting Power of Attorney - absolutely essential for everyone of any age. The example I give clients is Kate Garraway who had to rely on financial support from friends and family when her husband was suffering from Covid and everything was frozen as he hadn't set up Power of Attorney.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

Yes fortunately we have POA in place, before my mum's dementia set in.
With Cardiff there's a £330 set up charge, then no interest providing you pay back with 56 days of the end of the contract. The house is in a holiday area so we are renting it out to help with her funding, trying hard to avoid selling it as it's an investment for myself and brothers in the long run as well as generating income now.
Thank you

I think the deferred payment scheme will mean a charge is made on the house and in order to avoid selling mum's house you have to between you pay that charge or the council will force a sale

[bluesp]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

If anyone can do it they can

Is anyone living in the house at the moment as their only residence ?

Nice one, I'll go back to them.
No, it's rented out for the summer/ autumn at the moment

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

And there is debate about one tax , however in 2023 the levy will appear separated on wage slips as a health levy , for me I want to see the overall of the NHS and Social Care in which is coming in a bill as you have to have a plan to spend this in the right places there is so much waste and abuse of the NHS services because the services is free in its ( entirety unlike a lot of other countries where you get basic minimum health care free and pay insurance thereafter for social care ie Italy and Germany to name two ).

The big move for me would be to drag the social care back under the NHS umbrella , get rid of private companies running social care , to ensure we get the buck we deserve not for someone to profit from , and critically pay those carers a decent wage

I totally agree

Private companies raking in the money and paying crap wages to the carers

Many on under 9 quid an hour

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

Nice one, I'll go back to them.
No, it's rented out for the summer/ autumn at the moment

Get some advice on your concerns too , you are helping mum but it's understandable you have a future life too

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

something always doesn't seem to add up with care in this country. the costs are always eye watering. thousands per week. that can wipe through a value of a house in a couple of years.
yet at the same time there is no money to pay the carers adequately, they are hugely stressed and leaving the industry in droves.

where does it all go?

I don't know how to address it but the current system is completely broken.
someone who is really rich, can afford to pay for their care in old age from pensions and investments or rental income that they don't need to work for, so their house isn't touched.
whereas many other people will end up losing everything they e ever saved to pay for their last few years.

If social care was brought under direct control of NHS and local authorities then that would be a start .....better wages , secure employment , workers rights .......but for many years thanks to thatcher private companies bid for care packages from local councils

They treat the staff like shit and pay them shit ........and therfore the standard of care is shit

Yet the private companies roll more and more money in , year in year out

And anyone who thinks the care staff looking after their loved ones in a nice home are on good wages ........don't be mistaken

The owners of these care homes ?

Minted

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

thank feck for those immigrants that are willing to work for peanuts...oh yeah, they all got sent home

Well I wasn't going to say it but ....

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

If both parents are alive, the value of the home is completely ignored providing that one owner (or anyone relative over the age of 60 is living there as their main home) - it doesn't matter if t's owned as tenants in common or jointly tenancy.

Top advice from Ian about Lasting Power of Attorney - absolutely essential for everyone of any age. The example I give clients is Kate Garraway who had to rely on financial support from friends and family when her husband was suffering from Covid and everything was frozen as he hadn't set up Power of Attorney.

Does the other half , as it were or any relative living there as their main home whilst wife or husband is in care home eventually have to pay care home fees for loved one as you say the house is ignored ?

I assume savings are then looked at ?

But once they run out what happens regarding care fees , if the house isn't counted and there is no savings or investments left .....who pays ?

[life on mars]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

This is a brave political move by Johnson it will be interesting to see how this plays out .

[Rjk]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

If social care was brought under direct control of NHS and local authorities then that would be a start .....better wages , secure employment , workers rights .......but for many years thanks to thatcher private companies bid for care packages from local councils

They treat the staff like shit and pay them shit ........and therfore the standard of care is shit

Yet the private companies roll more and more money in , year in year out

And anyone who thinks the care staff looking after their loved ones in a nice home are on good wages ........don't be mistaken

The owners of these care homes ?

Minted

I think it needs to be all under the NHS, local authorities should not be involved.
if the budgets are controlled by the same group then there aren't conflicts of interest and they can focus on better outcomes for patients.
they might be able to redirect some NHS money into care to ensure better availability, meaning less beds are blocked and less hospital acquired infections etc

[the other bob wilson]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

This is a brave political move by Johnson it will be interesting to see how this plays out .

There's an argument about whether it should NI, income tax or some other form of tax, but I don't see he had much choice - don't forget he was telling us he had a plan for social care before the pandemic was heard about.

[Feedback]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

Sounds like the politics of envy there to me. Plus, just because you are living in a house worth over £500000 doesn’t mean you are rich. There are two or three bed semis in Cardiff worth that. Plus again that most pensioners have worked hard all their life, paid their taxes and National Insurance, and spent/saved their money prudently, so why should they have their property snatched off them later in life.

the point here is that the NICs paid by today's pensioners were based on life expectancy after retirement of 5 may be 10 years. We are now seeing pensioners live well into their 90s, meaning the cost of their pension is 3x what it was originally thought to be. You factor in social care and health care costs too and suddenly you appreciate today's pensioners have paid in nowhere near enough.

the issue is that pensioners forma huge voting block, and governments are scared of upsetting the block for fear of losing large swathes of votes.

something had to be done, although whether the way to finance it was the way chosen by this government is debatable.

[Feedback]

Re: So it's National Insurance then

From today yes,

only if they work, which is fair enough