Reply With QuoteUnfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY
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This is an interesting piece on the changing attitudes of in the USA where Christian evangelicals (and the Republican Party) are seen by Israel as their natural allies (despite their antisemitism) whilst American Jews are increasingly breaking from the ideology of Zionism and uncritical support of Israel.
https://newpol.org/we-anti-zionists-...r-of-u-s-jews/
Unfortunately, even she can't conjure up an answer for you re the firm evidence of Christ as reported above by the BBC and their atheist reporter who says the evidence is irrefutable.
I don't know about others, but I have no problem believing that a minor Jewish prophet and agitator called Jesus (or the original version of that name) lived, annoyed the religious hierarchy, and was executed by the Romans. Either one man or a number of different people from the same period whose stories were conflated in the (sparse) written records. That is very different from accepting all the supernatural stuff that was and is wrapped around the story and the way the cult turned into a series of linked belief systems over the next two millennia - systems that were used to control large parts of the global population through the Church.
You believe in the literal truth of the Old Testament! You believe in the truth of the four main gospels - which contradict each other and were written 30-100 years after the execution of Jesus by non-eye witnesses working in the propaganda unit of the new cult. But despite all your blind faith and credulousness the best you can come up with as proof of your beliefs is Jeremy Bowen and a sensationalist BBC drama-doc that was best remembered for its ludicrous 'facial reconstruction' punchline. Have you read the link you posted?
I'd like to see a dramatisation of a non-magic story of Jesus. just the contemporary history.
a Jewish reformer railing against corruption in the theocracy that he lives under, eventually becomes too much of a thorn in the side of the powers that be who have him bumped off.
A man with followers existing and that being recorded at a point in time is a very different thing to an entity clicking his fingers and making a talking snake
Yes, and I watched the series some 20 years ago as it went out on a weekly basis.
The particular point being addressed was SLUDGE insisting that Jesus Christ did not exist, my answer which uses the unlikely instument that is the BBC, answers that question clearly and leaves no doubt whatsoever. Also given the fact that someone who remains an atheist (to this day as far as I am aware) is saying the history is irrefutable re Christ Jesus, then you can hardly say I have called a loaded witness to the stand.
As for your assumptions about the accuracies of the Gospels, I am happy to discuss your best example of this, fire away.....
No evidence at all
Body
Grave
Nothing
If you believe in something written 2000 years ago or whenever it was to be irrefutable evidence of Jesus christ , God and the great gig in the sky then you have failed I am afraid
Some bloke walking around being nice to people 2000 years ago is not factual evidence of someone being able to do miracles or his dad up in the clouds actually existing
Don't be such a sap
Some bloke was a bit of a cult 2000 years ago , did a few public speaking events then got done over by the Romans
That's not existence of God, heaven, Jesus christ his son , the parting of the waves and a few loaves of hovis and a tin of tuna feeding 5000 homeless
Takes a Cardiff boyo to prove the existence of Jesus. In 2000 years there will be a cult of Jeremy. Couldn't make it up.
I see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood
You're completely ignoring the fact that many of us, Sludge included, aren't disagreeing with the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" that there may well have been a man called Jesus who had followers. What we, and undoubtedly the "middle eastern correspondant (atheist)" disagree with is the rest water into wine, parting of the red sea, the animals went in two by two and of course the world was made in 7 days greatest hitsI see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood
He's saying there might have been a hippy walking around 2000 plus years ago who was a bit of a chilled out , friendly chap .I see, so the experienced middle eastern correspondant (atheist) that the BBC chose, who just like you didn't want any part of it to be true, wasn't as astute as yourself? Understood
He's not saying he fed starving people in their thousands , taught blind men how to see or helped bed ridden people walk
This is hard work
He does what he wants,
He does what he wants,
Jesus Christ/God,
He does what he wants.
I'm ignoring NO facts, Sludge stated that Jesus didn't even exist. That is now dealt with. He does.
Now to your questions.
Well done for getting one appropriate question re Jesus - Water into wine.
* The Red Sea appears in the OT - Moses not Jesus.
* Creation was in 6 days, not 7.
So with regard to all the above, would you like to confirm that your issue is with the existence and power of God?
If so, what is your own origin model for complex DNA, the Universe and the existence of all things?
What evidence is there of the existence of Moses and of the veracity of the stories, including the creation story, that have been attributed to him?
Ok, so we are again moving the goalposts back a few more millenia in the hope that the Bible may turn out to be fiction and we can all go back to just worrying about our status in the Championship.
The authenticity of the Bible is a massive yet crucial issue, I'll be glad to address that next week. For the next 3 days I have much to attend to, so thanks for the questions, see you early next week - God willing
If you get hit by a bus will that be chance or gods will ?Ok, so we are again moving the goalposts back a few more millenia in the hope that the Bible may turn out to be fiction and we can all go back to just worrying about our status in the Championship.
The authenticity of the Bible is a massive yet crucial issue, I'll be glad to address that next week. For the next 3 days I have much to attend to, so thanks for the questions, see you early next week - God willing
It's all cobblers
He was a hippy who helped feed the poor
And that's it
He didn't perform miracles and he didn't have a bloke in the sky who had a white beard and ruled the universe
Because that is all fairy tales
Creation ?
Dinosaurs ? 🦕
3 days? The universe was half-finished in 3 days!Ok, so we are again moving the goalposts back a few more millenia in the hope that the Bible may turn out to be fiction and we can all go back to just worrying about our status in the Championship.
The authenticity of the Bible is a massive yet crucial issue, I'll be glad to address that next week. For the next 3 days I have much to attend to, so thanks for the questions, see you early next week - God willing
Ok, you were asking questions last week relating to how can we know that the Bible is what it claims to be, which is a set of books that is inpired by an Almighty Being from outside our time and space?
Many tests could be done, so are you happy if we look at:
(1) History (that we CAN verify elsewhere) and
(2) foreknowledge/ prophecy recorded in the Bible that someone would only have if they were outside our time & space?
Extract from motion adopted at Labour Party Conference today:
Conference condemns the ongoing Nakba in Palestine, Israel’s militarised violence attacking the Al Aqsa mosque, the forced displacements from Sheikh Jarrah and the deadly assault on Gaza.
Together with the de facto annexation of Palestinian land by accelerated settlement building and statements of Israel’s intention to proceed with annexation, it is ever clearer that Israel is intent on eliminating any prospects of Palestinian self-determination.
Conference notes the TUC 2020 Congress motion describing such settlement building and annexation as ‘another significant step’ towards the UN crime of apartheid, and calling on the European and international trade union movement to join the international campaign to stop annexation and end apartheid ...
Conference resolves to support “effective measures” including sanctions, as called for by Palestinian civil society, against actions by the Israeli government that are illegal according to international law; in particular to ensure that Israel stops the building of settlements, reverses any annexation, ends the occupation of the West Bank, the blockade of Gaza, brings down the wall and respects the right of Palestinian people, as enshrined in international law, to return to their homes.
Conference resolves that the Labour party must stand on the right side of history and abide by these resolutions in its policy, communications and political strategy.
The leadership of the Labour Party and Labour Friends of Israel and the Board of Deputies (the sounding board for any policies or training programmes about Israel/Palestine) are not happy. But I am.
I genuinely do understand the issues with Israel and Palestine and how complicated it is and how Israel has committed wrongs in the past and continues to do so, and that many of which are unjustifiable.... but looking in from the outside, it does seem a bit strange given that Muslims have often been treated appallingly from Morocco to China, about 90% of the concern is in respect of the tiny number of them that happen to live within or adjacent to the worlds only Jewish state. Just saying.Extract from motion adopted at Labour Party Conference today:
Conference condemns the ongoing Nakba in Palestine, Israel’s militarised violence attacking the Al Aqsa mosque, the forced displacements from Sheikh Jarrah and the deadly assault on Gaza.
Together with the de facto annexation of Palestinian land by accelerated settlement building and statements of Israel’s intention to proceed with annexation, it is ever clearer that Israel is intent on eliminating any prospects of Palestinian self-determination.
Conference notes the TUC 2020 Congress motion describing such settlement building and annexation as ‘another significant step’ towards the UN crime of apartheid, and calling on the European and international trade union movement to join the international campaign to stop annexation and end apartheid ...
Conference resolves to support “effective measures” including sanctions, as called for by Palestinian civil society, against actions by the Israeli government that are illegal according to international law; in particular to ensure that Israel stops the building of settlements, reverses any annexation, ends the occupation of the West Bank, the blockade of Gaza, brings down the wall and respects the right of Palestinian people, as enshrined in international law, to return to their homes.
Conference resolves that the Labour party must stand on the right side of history and abide by these resolutions in its policy, communications and political strategy.
The leadership of the Labour Party and Labour Friends of Israel and the Board of Deputies (the sounding board for any policies or training programmes about Israel/Palestine) are not happy. But I am.
I'm not sure it's a good look and it is a bit inconsistent and I would suggest it's at least part of the reason why so many of the Jewish community were fearful of Corbyn etc.
I didn't ask those questions. I asked specifically about Moses. Not that your two replies above can be considered evidence of anything, of course. When asked to produce or refer to evidence you can't simply state there is some.
What is it with the Labour Party and their meetings that the cannot bring themselves to use the word "The" ???Extract from motion adopted at Labour Party Conference today:
Conference condemns the ongoing Nakba in Palestine, Israel’s militarised violence attacking the Al Aqsa mosque, the forced displacements from Sheikh Jarrah and the deadly assault on Gaza.
Together with the de facto annexation of Palestinian land by accelerated settlement building and statements of Israel’s intention to proceed with annexation, it is ever clearer that Israel is intent on eliminating any prospects of Palestinian self-determination.
Conference notes the TUC 2020 Congress motion describing such settlement building and annexation as ‘another significant step’ towards the UN crime of apartheid, and calling on the European and international trade union movement to join the international campaign to stop annexation and end apartheid ...
Conference resolves to support “effective measures” including sanctions, as called for by Palestinian civil society, against actions by the Israeli government that are illegal according to international law; in particular to ensure that Israel stops the building of settlements, reverses any annexation, ends the occupation of the West Bank, the blockade of Gaza, brings down the wall and respects the right of Palestinian people, as enshrined in international law, to return to their homes.
Conference resolves that the Labour party must stand on the right side of history and abide by these resolutions in its policy, communications and political strategy.
The leadership of the Labour Party and Labour Friends of Israel and the Board of Deputies (the sounding board for any policies or training programmes about Israel/Palestine) are not happy. But I am.
That really annoys me.
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