Could we turn the corner with Tan etc in charge?

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Tan's legacy so far - taking a side that had been challenging for promotion for a few seasons to one set for League 1, almost halving the actual number going to home games in the process. We catastrophically failed to build on both promotions to the Premier League. We've had one of the worst records for losing money in the transfer market in Europe.

So, can we turn a corner and rise up the league again with Tan and those in charge?

[LA Bluebird]

No

[the other bob wilson]

I fear not, but someone mentioned Tan losing face if two of his teams get relegated in the same season and I recall a lot being said about this being a big thing in Malaysian culture around the time of our first season in the Premier League. Relegation below the level Cardiff and Kortrijk were at when he took over the clubs would represent a losing of face on a scale unlike anything Tan has seen before in his involvement with football and none of us can be sure how he would react to it. I’d be amazedif he’d opt to walk away from the game with the Sala situation unresolved, but it may be that he wouldn’t react in the way most expect him to.

[tforturton]

Maybe he'll throw millions at the side and get us promoted straight back up. Or maybe not.

[jon1959]

Maybe he'll throw millions at the side and get us promoted straight back up. Or maybe not.

Our problem has not been a lack of spending by Vincent Tan.

He keeps doing that, and (unlike Dalman) doesn't take anything out of the club.

Our problem is a lack of leadership, communication, decision making (not just bad decisions; often no decisions at all) and plan. We are a leaderless and directionless club - on and off the pitch.

There are positives with ticket pricing, the Academy, training grounds, Foundation and women's team. But those things barely move the scales.

Relegation will not be a catalyst for changing those fundamental weaknesses. We may well have a different (and maybe better) manager and a team full of home grown players that is competitive in League One (or maybe we won't), but the paralysis and indecision will be the same as long as we have the same ownership and governance structures.

[Nobody's Rep]

Our problem has not been a lack of spending by Vincent Tan.

He keeps doing that, and (unlike Dalman) doesn't take anything out of the club.

Our problem is a lack of leadership, communication, decision making (not just bad decisions; often no decisions at all) and plan. We are a leaderless and directionless club - on and off the pitch.

There are positives with ticket pricing, the Academy, training grounds, Foundation and women's team. But those things barely move the scales.

Relegation will not be a catalyst for changing those fundamental weaknesses. We may well have a different (and maybe better) manager and a team full of home grown players that is competitive in League One (or maybe we won't), but the paralysis and indecision will be the same as long as we have the same ownership and governance structures.

This a million times over - what we see on the pitch is a symptom not the cause - definition of madness isn't it? Doing the same things over and over and expecting different results

[goats]

Tan's legacy so far - taking a side that had been challenging for promotion for a few seasons to one set for League 1, almost halving the actual number going to home games in the process. We catastrophically failed to build on both promotions to the Premier League. We've had one of the worst records for losing money in the transfer market in Europe.

So, can we turn a corner and rise up the league again with Tan and those in charge?

Not a chance, he’s useless and might aswell give up if we go down. Maybe the shame of it will force him to anyway, his family want him too by all accounts….heres to hoping hey

[ToTaL ITK]

Tan is a bad gambler. He got lucky once and he has the bug. All of his football fantasies have been! in the end fails. Apart from our two miserable efforts in the Prem

[Steve the Tea]

Tan's legacy so far - taking a side that had been challenging for promotion for a few seasons to one set for League 1, almost halving the actual number going to home games in the process. We catastrophically failed to build on both promotions to the Premier League. We've had one of the worst records for losing money in the transfer market in Europe.

So, can we turn a corner and rise up the league again with Tan and those in charge?

No!

There is nothing I've seen in Tan's tenure at Cardiff City, since he had to reverse the rebranding fiasco, that has evidenced the faintest desire to plan for progress.

If it is true that our wage bill is one of the top-eight clubs in the Championship that is strangled by his choice of managers.

There's much more that could be written about Tan's ownership. Suffice to say there's only one thing worse than a person who knows nothing. That is someone who knows nothing but thinks he knows everything.

Bad though that is, perhaps a greater crime is that his ownership has sucked desire and passion out of the fan-base. In short he has conditioned we fans that losing doesn't hurt anymore

StT.
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[Tuerto]

I fear not, but someone mentioned Tan losing face if two of his teams get relegated in the same season and I recall a lot being said about this being a big thing in Malaysian culture around the time of our first season in the Premier League. Relegation below the level Cardiff and Kortrijk were at when he took over the clubs would represent a losing of face on a scale unlike anything Tan has seen before in his involvement with football and none of us can be sure how he would react to it. I’d be amazedif he’d opt to walk away from the game with the Sala situation unresolved, but it may be that he wouldn’t react in the way most expect him to.

Do you think that all this losing face business with Malaysians is a bit of a racial stereotype? I mean, nobody likes losing credibility no matter where they're from.

[2b2bdoo]

Tan's legacy so far - taking a side that had been challenging for promotion for a few seasons to one set for League 1, almost halving the actual number going to home games in the process. We catastrophically failed to build on both promotions to the Premier League. We've had one of the worst records for losing money in the transfer market in Europe.

So, can we turn a corner and rise up the league again with Tan and those in charge?

Bit unfair, we had winding up order after winding up order before Tan came, HMRC plus multiple other business. At the time it was about surviving as a club.

You point out he failed to build on both promotions, but failed to praise both promotions, it’s a post to push a negative picture, I think we can agree you have purposely painted a negative picture.

But no he won’t change, he’s stuck in his ways and for all the financial backing we are going backwards, if we can get a better owner then great but the grass isn’t always greener.

[Tuerto]

Do you think that all this losing face business with Malaysians is a bit of a racial stereotype? I mean, nobody likes losing credibility no matter where they're from.

Apologies, i'll change that to Cultural stereotype. Not aimed at you, so hopefully no offence.

[Pedro de la Rosa]

Do you think that all this losing face business with Malaysians is a bit of a racial stereotype? I mean, nobody likes losing credibility no matter where they're from.

My wife is Asian, it isn't a stereotype. Losing face is a much, much bigger deal to certain Asian groups.

[Tuerto]

My wife is Asian, it isn't a stereotype. Losing face is a much, much bigger deal to certain Asian groups.

Fair enough, i'll take your first hand experience over my limited knowledge on the subject.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Bit unfair, we had winding up order after winding up order before Tan came, HMRC plus multiple other business. At the time it was about surviving as a club.

You point out he failed to build on both promotions, but failed to praise both promotions, it’s a post to push a negative picture, I think we can agree you have purposely painted a negative picture.

But no he won’t change, he’s stuck in his ways and for all the financial backing we are going backwards, if we can get a better owner then great but the grass isn’t always greener.

Ultimately, what did both promotions achieve? Struggle and relegation. What good have they done as things stand?

[Pedro de la Rosa]

Fair enough, i'll take your first hand experience over my limited knowledge on the subject.

I will caveat that by saying my wife couldn't care less but businessmen will.

[Pedro de la Rosa]

Bit unfair, we had winding up order after winding up order before Tan came, HMRC plus multiple other business. At the time it was about surviving as a club.

You point out he failed to build on both promotions, but failed to praise both promotions, it’s a post to push a negative picture, I think we can agree you have purposely painted a negative picture.

But no he won’t change, he’s stuck in his ways and for all the financial backing we are going backwards, if we can get a better owner then great but the grass isn’t always greener.

We're worse almost year on year under Tan. It's been a total disaster.

[The Lone Gunman]

I will caveat that by saying my wife couldn't care less but businessmen will.

So how does that tally with Tan turning himself into an international laughing stock during the rebrand years and his frequent failures as a football club owner?

All this ‘losing face’ stuff is a load of horse shit in my opinion. All the evidence suggests it has no bearing whatsoever on how Asian owners run football clubs.

[2b2bdoo]

Ultimately, what did both promotions achieve? Struggle and relegation. What good have they done as things stand?

So you think it’s balanced? From what he took over?

[2b2bdoo]

We're worse almost year on year under Tan. It's been a total disaster.

But we have a club.

Not year on year tho, we had two promotions. I think his negatives are clear as day but let’s not rewrite it.

[Father Dougal]

So how does that tally with Tan turning himself into an international laughing stock during the rebrand years and his frequent failures as a football club owner?

All this ‘losing face’ stuff is a load of horse shit in my opinion. All the evidence suggests it has no bearing whatsoever on how Asian owners run football clubs.

I genuinely dont understand what its supposed to mean and what the implicatioms are?

Happy to be educated but its used a lot on here i just assumed everyone else knew what it meant!

[Des Parrot]

I can only talk about losing face related to Japanese culture, where it is very much a thing. After 80 years of profit, the company turned a single year loss, resulting in every Japanese manager/director over the age of 55 being “retired”, I don’t know the total but it must have been 200-300.

[JamesWales]

I don't think so. I think the whole relationship is soured now. He doesn't care about the club, but doesn't want to sell on the cheap or lose money or whatever. I have no idea what his motivation is.

Can't stress enough how much I hated the rebrand which is obviously entirely Tans fault. It has termknally weakened my relationship with the club and I can honestly say I never gave him a penny of my money when we played in rouge.

But, even I can see the positives, some of which others have pointed out. That's not to say we aren't in a bad place now, because we are.

But let's not be too "woe is me" about it. We've got promoted twice. We have one of the largest grounds in the division. We have no divine right to be a success. We are pissed off, but so are tonnes of clubs. Probably two thirds of the fan bases in our league think we are premiership clubs but only three can go up.

As for Tan, I can't see us getting back to being a promotion pushing side again under him. He has lost interest in trying to make it so

[Pedro de la Rosa]

But we have a club.

Not year on year tho, we had two promotions. I think his negatives are clear as day but let’s not rewrite it.

The first promotion ripped the club apart, it was not a success

[Pedro de la Rosa]

So how does that tally with Tan turning himself into an international laughing stock during the rebrand years and his frequent failures as a football club owner?

All this ‘losing face’ stuff is a load of horse shit in my opinion. All the evidence suggests it has no bearing whatsoever on how Asian owners run football clubs.

It absolutely is a thing, as Des says. Whether it has any impact on Tan (I don't think it will), remains to be seen. If the last 3 seasons weren't a wake up call, I don't think a relegation will be.