Person behind “South African bid” revealed?

[the other bob wilson]

I see Si was saying in his latest podcast that Tan’s business advisors (whoever they are) are telling him now is not the time to sell. If that is true, then it’s easy to see why - the club’s present value is low and it needs to be back in the Championship to make selling worthwhile. My question is, what has Tan done in the last three months to increase the chances of his club regaining its former value? He’s brought in a Head Coach who might prove to be an inspired appointment, but, then again, he might not. He’s overseen an exodus of players from the worst squad in last season’s Championship, but, as yet, he’s not sanctioned any incoming transfers and we appear to be relying on a nucleus of, admittedly, promising teenagers coming in to provide the necessary improvement from last season - that hardly strikes me as the actions of someone determined to get City back into the Championship.

[Elwood Blues]

I see Si was saying in his latest podcast that Tan’s business advisors (whoever they are) are telling him now is not the time to sell. If that is true, then it’s easy to see why - the club’s present value is low and it needs to be back in the Championship to make selling worthwhile. My question is, what has Tan done in the last three months to increase the chances of his club regaining its former value? He’s brought in a Head Coach who might prove to be an inspired appointment, but, then again, he might not. He’s overseen an exodus of players from the worst squad in last season’s Championship, but, as yet, he’s not sanctioned any incoming transfers and we appear to be relying on a nucleus of, admittedly, promising teenagers coming in to provide the necessary improvement from last season - that hardly strikes me as the actions of someone determined to get City back into the Championship.

One estimate I saw was

40 million up front and 40 million when we get back into the Premier League.

I have since seen that additionally Dalmans loan of around 38 million will also be repaid ( apparently Tan is responsible for paying back this loan not the club, but the new buyers are willing to pay it.

I must point out that I have no direct background knowledge, and it does seem pretty generous to me (circa £110million for a league 1 club albeit with a big chunk only due if we achieve two promotions).

But if it is anything like this, it would also seem a pretty good deal if we were in the championship as well.

It may, of course just be wishful thinking on the part of one of two of the many who profess to be 'in the know' and the actual figure is much less.

[PontBlue]

We do own the ground or at least one of the linked companies do. We lease the land it is built on from the council and we pay a nominal amount known as peppercorn rent for this lease.

[Underhill1980]

The longer this goes on the more I feel crushing disappointment is on the horizon.

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

I see Si was saying in his latest podcast that Tan’s business advisors (whoever they are) are telling him now is not the time to sell. If that is true, then it’s easy to see why - the club’s present value is low and it needs to be back in the Championship to make selling worthwhile. My question is, what has Tan done in the last three months to increase the chances of his club regaining its former value? He’s brought in a Head Coach who might prove to be an inspired appointment, but, then again, he might not. He’s overseen an exodus of players from the worst squad in last season’s Championship, but, as yet, he’s not sanctioned any incoming transfers and we appear to be relying on a nucleus of, admittedly, promising teenagers coming in to provide the necessary improvement from last season - that hardly strikes me as the actions of someone determined to get City back into the Championship.

As most financial products adverts say, "the value of your investment can go down as well as up". As you said, the "plan" to go back up seems, as usual, to be a wish rather than a strategy, so in 12 months time the club could be worth even less if we're still in League One. And is a relegation-threatened Championship club (which is no doubt what we'd be again before long if we did go back up but nothing changed in respect of the structures/personnel) worth much more than it is now?
His business advisors should have advised him to sell years ago. (Maybe they did.)

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

The phrase I remember is “peppercorn rent” that the club is paying for 125 years - I thought the rent was paid to the council. However, I’m pretty sure that the stadium appears as a club asset in its annual accounts, so I assume that, for accounting purposes, we own it?

I'm not an accountant, but I think you can include leased assets on your balance sheet.

[Ninian1962]

I see Si was saying in his latest podcast that TanÂ’s business advisors (whoever they are) are telling him now is not the time to sell. If that is true, then itÂ’s easy to see why - the clubÂ’s present value is low and it needs to be back in the Championship to make selling worthwhile. My question is, what has Tan done in the last three months to increase the chances of his club regaining its former value? HeÂ’s brought in a Head Coach who might prove to be an inspired appointment, but, then again, he might not. HeÂ’s overseen an exodus of players from the worst squad in last seasonÂ’s Championship, but, as yet, heÂ’s not sanctioned any incoming transfers and we appear to be relying on a nucleus of, admittedly, promising teenagers coming in to provide the necessary improvement from last season - that hardly strikes me as the actions of someone determined to get City back into the Championship.

Paul

New signings have been sanctioned. Last week Brian Barry-Murphy told fans that he fully expected to bring in at least two new permanent signings before the start of the season, but that the loan signings he has targeted will take longer as Premier League clubs are yet to finalise their squads for the coming season so loans will probably not come in until the second half of August.

The exodus of players was largely those out of (expensive) contracts and compensated for the £10m drop in TV and Solidarity income arising from our relegation. A lot would have had to go anyway to bring squad numbers (including the new signings) down to the levels allowed in League 1.

The new Head Coach certainly came across at the meeting as being adamant that some of the current players under contract have to change their application and attitude if they want to be in his team playing the high energy game he demands. His initial view is that they have responded well to that requirement but that additions are still needed to get the squad he wants.

[the other bob wilson]

Paul

New signings have been sanctioned. Last week Brian Barry-Murphy told fans that he fully expected to bring in at least two new permanent signings before the start of the season, but that the loan signings he has targeted will take longer as Premier League clubs are yet to finalise their squads for the coming season so loans will probably not come in until the second half of August.

The exodus of players was largely those out of (expensive) contracts and compensated for the £10m drop in TV and Solidarity income arising from our relegation. A lot would have had to go anyway to bring squad numbers (including the new signings) down to the levels allowed in League 1.

The new Head Coach certainly came across at the meeting as being adamant that some of the current players under contract have to change their application and attitude if they want to be in his team playing the high energy game he demands. His initial view is that they have responded well to that requirement but that additions are still needed to get the squad he wants.

The thing is Keith, I’m sure Erol Bulut would have said something similar to BBM back at the start of January 2024 because he believed he was going to get the players he wanted. He didn’t and became increasingly frustrated as the month went on. I’m afraid that I won’t believe we’re going to be signing new players until we actually start doing so - 14 years of Vincent Tan’s ownership means I’ve no faith in him or those running the club delivering on what they promise any more.

[the other bob wilson]

As most financial products adverts say, "the value of your investment can go down as well as up". As you said, the "plan" to go back up seems, as usual, to be a wish rather than a strategy, so in 12 months time the club could be worth even less if we're still in League One. And is a relegation-threatened Championship club (which is no doubt what we'd be again before long if we did go back up but nothing changed in respect of the structures/personnel) worth much more than it is now?
His business advisors should have advised him to sell years ago. (Maybe they did.)

Agreed.

[A Quiet Monkfish]

I see Si was saying in his latest podcast that Tan’s business advisors (whoever they are) are telling him now is not the time to sell. If that is true, then it’s easy to see why - the club’s present value is low and it needs to be back in the Championship to make selling worthwhile. My question is, what has Tan done in the last three months to increase the chances of his club regaining its former value? He’s brought in a Head Coach who might prove to be an inspired appointment, but, then again, he might not. He’s overseen an exodus of players from the worst squad in last season’s Championship, but, as yet, he’s not sanctioned any incoming transfers and we appear to be relying on a nucleus of, admittedly, promising teenagers coming in to provide the necessary improvement from last season - that hardly strikes me as the actions of someone determined to get City back into the Championship.

Presumably the same business advisors he's had for the last 16 years. We aren't going back to the championship, we aren't even going to threaten to do so. Unless we actually are challenging I genuinely think things will get rather unpleasant if it transpires Tan isn't going to sell until the club's valuation increases.

[Vic Flange]

I find the suggestion that Vincent Tan has business advisors quite funny.

[Hilts]

Have they told him it will be worth even less in L2 which is where we will go if he continues running the club the same way.

[delmbox]

We aren't going back to the championship, we aren't even going to threaten to do so.

Tell the bookies that, they've got us 2nd favourites

[TheBirchgrovePub]

I find the talk around it not being the right time for Tan to sell pointless. When would it ever be the right time? We have been on a downwards trajectory for a number of years and he's not sold up at any point, now he's suddenly going to make sure we get back to where we were 12 months ago before selling, all whilst incurring further losses. Seems a big risk. There's a lot of reasons now is not the perfect time to sell but most of them reasons are the negligence shown over the past decade that has got VT into this mess. Let's hope he sells up but I won't believe it until the ink is signed on the contract

[Trigger]

I find the talk around it not being the right time for Tan to sell pointless. When would it ever be the right time? We have been on a downwards trajectory for a number of years and he's not sold up at any point, now he's suddenly going to make sure we get back to where we were 12 months ago before selling, all whilst incurring further losses. Seems a big risk. There's a lot of reasons now is not the perfect time to sell but most of them reasons are the negligence shown over the past decade that has got VT into this mess. Let's hope he sells up but I won't believe it until the ink is signed on the contract

Yes it's bizarre. I'm not even sure any valuation would be massively different. It's not like the difference in income and exposure between the prem and champ.

[HiVis]

Unlike you, I have no need to have an 'alt' - whereas you have a multitude of them, as everyone knows.

well said NinianKnight

[Ninian1962]

Yes it's bizarre. I'm not even sure any valuation would be massively different. It's not like the difference in income and exposure between the prem and champ.

The difference in TV rights and solidarity payment income between the Championship and League 1 is £10m so there would be a big difference in valuations

[Trigger]

The difference in TV rights and solidarity payment income between the Championship and League 1 is £10m so there would be a big difference in valuations

Yes of course, i've seen £10m mentioned before. I guess i'm thinking in terms of it's not like that's the earning potential of the club moving forward indefinitely. By the time any takeover comes around we could well be on the verge of promotion to the championship

I'm sure Tan would be factoring that into his own valuation.

[North Cardiff Blue]

I find the talk around it not being the right time for Tan to sell pointless. When would it ever be the right time? We have been on a downwards trajectory for a number of years and he's not sold up at any point, now he's suddenly going to make sure we get back to where we were 12 months ago before selling, all whilst incurring further losses. Seems a big risk. There's a lot of reasons now is not the perfect time to sell but most of them reasons are the negligence shown over the past decade that has got VT into this mess. Let's hope he sells up but I won't believe it until the ink is signed on the contract

If we won the league at a canter and had a full ground and happy fans and a strong promotion of course it would make us more attractive and potentially increase the value.

I won't happen though

Maybe Tan lives in hope that it can, who knows it's up to him and Otto to decide if a deal can be done.

I don't think it's done, but they should have some meetings in the coming weeks. You can do 99% of the meetings on Zoom and maybe the final signing in person, although these days you don't even have to meet face to face.

[The Prophet of Doom]

If we won the league at a canter and had a full ground and happy fans and a strong promotion of course it would make us more attractive and potentially increase the value.

He wouldn't be thinking of selling if that were the case!!!