Latest British Social Survey finds 52% of the Country are non Religious

[Taunton Blue Genie]

This board is almost the most well mannered I've encountered since the 1990's. Some like Yahoo Chat have been taken down because of the levels of abuse etc

As for the snake, what we have here is someone that can't see above the glass ceiling of science, which can vary from brilliant to completely barking up the wrong tree. If you doubt that then dig out some science books from your formative years and see how many corrections/ editions have been printed since.
So Satan used a snake and God used a donkey to pass on a message on one occasion, so what?....if life IS more than flesh and blood, and people can be possessed, what is the problem?

Look at City from the 60's to the 20's and you'll find your fair share of donkeys, mind you I'm not sure if they could also speak?

The glass ceiling of science???? How is that description consistent with the fact that science books are indeed re-written and modified once we learn more about subject matter with our improving understanding of science (i.e. increased knowledge)? A ceiling that rises perhaps . All the greatest scientific minds work on that basis. Richard Feynman used the anaology of only being able to see part of a chess board and observing only certain pieces - and as the game goes on we see not only pieces that we hadn't seen previously but we also see that some pieces move in ways that were previously not evident. Knowledge is never perfect but science has enabled people to have heart transplants, to send spacecraft into the far reaches of the universe and for us to be protected against viruses and disease. There is no shame in intelligent people knowing that they don't know everything.

However, I will ask you yet again: do you believe that the talking snake existed or is it symbolic/a parable of sorts/allegorical?
Why are you so reticent to answer that very specific question?

[truthpaste]

The glass ceiling of science???? How is that description consistent with the fact that science books are indeed re-written and modified once we learn more about subject matter with our improving understanding of science (i.e. increased knowledge)? A ceiling that rises perhaps . All the greatest scientific minds work on that basis. Richard Feynman used the anaology of only being able to see part of a chess board and observing only certain pieces - and as the game goes on we see not only pieces that we hadn't seen previously but we also see that some pieces move in ways that were previously not evident. Knowledge is never perfect but science has enabled people to have heart transplants, to send spacecraft into the far reaches of the universe and for us to be protected against viruses and disease. There is no shame in intelligent people knowing that they don't know everything.

However, I will ask you yet again: do you believe that the talking snake existed or is it symbolic/a parable of sorts/allegorical?
Why are you so reticent to answer that very specific question?

I did answer the question re creatures and voices, and I mentioned (obviously not clearly enough - apologies) that spiritual possession could make any object (like a radio or tv) or any creature speak and do many other things?
Have you never heard of people messing with ouija boards and having objects flying across the room, hearing voices or sudden chills etc etc.....because I have on many occasions.

As for science, sure the ceiling rises, the problem is mankinds arrogance, thinking that he is almost at the point of total knowledge. Remember that in 1969 when man used limited knowledge and technology to get to the moon, it is now said that the computing power available to them was only at the level of a pocket calculator!
And that was only 52 years ago. So consider what we would be using at the high end of NASA and innovation in another 50 years?? Man is way off the levels of knowledge and ability of Almighty God, even if he does own an i-Phone 13 and Sky Glass.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

I did answer the question re creatures and voices, and I mentioned (obviously not clearly enough - apologies) that spiritual possession could make any object (like a radio or tv) or any creature speak and do many other things?
Have you never heard of people messing with ouija boards and having objects flying across the room, hearing voices or sudden chills etc etc.....because I have on many occasions.

As for science, sure the ceiling rises, the problem is mankinds arrogance, thinking that he is almost at the point of total knowledge. Remember that in 1969 when man used limited knowledge and technology to get to the moon, it is now said that the computing power available to them was only at the level of a pocket calculator!
And that was only 52 years ago. So consider what we would be using at the high end of NASA and innovation in another 50 years?? Man is way off the levels of knowledge and ability of Almighty God, even if he does own an i-Phone 13 and Sky Glass.

I don't know why you keep banging on about us understanding more about science as time passes. I have already agreed that it is the case. No intelligent person claims that we are anywhere near having total knowledge.

On the other hand, and please correct me if I'm wrong, you are 100% convinced that a talking snake appeared in the Garden of Eden.

[lisvaneblue]

I don't know why you keep banging on about us understanding more about science as time passes. I have already agreed that it is the case. No intelligent person claims that we are anywhere near having total knowledge.

On the other hand, and please correct me if I'm wrong, you are 100% convinced that a talking snake appeared in the Garden of Eden.

If nothing else you are tenacious.
Let's go back to Genesis 3 and The Fall. The original Hebrew text says Eve was tempted by 'nachash'..a serpent. English editions of the bible called this a snake, but in literal translation it is a serpent.
A serpent, as you know, can be a sly, treacherous person who exploits a position of trust in order to betray it....Satan

However, it may be that a 'snake' did speak and deceive Eve, and you nor I do not understand how because our 'science' has yet to work it out. Don't dismiss it because you don't understand it.

[Taunton Blue Genie]

If nothing else you are tenacious.
Let's go back to Genesis 3 and The Fall. The original Hebrew text says Eve was tempted by 'nachash'..a serpent. English editions of the bible called this a snake, but in literal translation it is a serpent.
A serpent, as you know, can be a sly, treacherous person who exploits a position of trust in order to betray it....Satan

However, it may be that a 'snake' did speak and deceive Eve, and you nor I do not understand how because our 'science' has yet to work it out. Don't dismiss it because you don't understand it.

That is laughable tosh. Myth. Absolute nonsense.

[lisvaneblue]

That is laughable tosh. Myth. Absolute nonsense.

Thought you would say that. So trust you accept my alternative explanation?

[Taunton Blue Genie]

Thought you would say that. So trust you accept my alternative explanation?

The point is that believers either consider Bible stories as absolute truth or they consider the stories to be merely symbolic or allegorical. Once you shift to the latter option the whole edifice falls as you fall into the confused area that my lay preacher friend describes as 'pick and mix'.

If I told you that I had a discussion about high energy physics with a badger in my garden last night would you believe it? Do you have a convincing audit trail of proof to believe in the talking snake? Do you have any audit trail to prove that a person called Moses spoke to God and recorded his words? Do you have any proof of that 'God'?
Of course not. Poorly educated people thousands of years ago may have believed in those infantilising stories but we have more evidence of the Big Bang than there is regarding a deity creating the universe in a day.
Most believers don't even have an understanding of who wrote their holy books, how the content was collated, added to, sifted out and everything else.
And practically all believers swallow the first religion that is foisted upon them by parents, the state, school etc.

Talking Snake v Big Bang. There is more evidence in support of the latter.

[delmbox]

Thought you would say that. So trust you accept my alternative explanation?

Interesting thread this, would love to know your thoughts on Baloo's question:

Genuine question here as I’m curious about this line of thinking. How are you able you choose to follow one religion over another, or no religion, if your view is not to dismiss anything because it may be you just don’t fully understand it? That would seem at face value to rule no other options out, so why Christianity?