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Absolutely no facts to back this up, so no links sorry. (Not unusual on this forum I think), just a hunch on my part. Government borrowing already astronomic (>£300 billion) so the perfect "get out of jail card" for Boris.
HS2 can be scrapped saving over £100 billion (the odd £10 billion already spent on consultants etc will be written off as petty cash in the grand scheme of things). Boris will blame Shapp, Shapp will blame Sunak, Sunak will blame the COVID virus....bingo!
You have already touched on the problem with this, as the money hasn't been spent yet it wouldn't be a real saving at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
Also as I mentioned in another thread, when the economy is on its arse Governments often fund major civil infrastucture projects to get men to work and to stimulate the economy. Autobahns and the Hover Dam are 2 that spring to mind.
HS2 shouldn’t be scrapped.
Big infrastructure projects is what pushes this country forward
That wasn't the thinking ten years ago when a new Government was elected.Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
I have no problem with infrastructure projects per se and understand your argument. Phase 1 of HS2 is an unnecessary project - just to get a very few people from London to Birmingham a bit quicker. Some of the money (a fraction of the total actually) should be spent on connecting the major cities in the Midlands and the North.Quote:
Originally Posted by xsnaggle
See my reply above.Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
Ten years ago the new government were picking the country up off the bones of its arse thanks to the previous 13 years of self induced financial mismanagement.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Ah, I thought the last crash was down to the greedy bankers
Something has to give this is the biggest social funding package of recent times across the world . Hope folk recall what has done in the name of job and business protection.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
Except in Wales. M4 relief road? Swansea Lagoon..Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
Yes, explain that one to me. Include in your answer the number of politically neutral fiscal institutions that have agreed that Labour trashed the economy, the number of times the Conservatives, as the opposition, opposed Labour's spending, not forgetting in addition to reference the global economic crash.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebrickman
What should they have done differently?Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebrickman
Just about everything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
Government policy in the last ten years has got nothing to with the Labour Party, they have not been in a position to do anything which could change it because they haven't been in Government during that period. The only party which has been able to influence things in the last decade other than the Conservatives is the Lib Dems who were very much the junior partners in a coalition. That Government inherited a situation which they decided to tackle by policies which were about as far away from "big infrastructure projects" as you can get - policies which were subsequently carried on by the Conservative administrations which followed.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevebrickman
The early weeks of the current Government suggested a different approach where there would be those infrastructure projects and I can understand the thinking which says the pre Covid 19 world was different from the one the coalition faced in May 2010, but the talk this week has been about the worst recession in living memory because of the effects of the virus.
Therefore, I would assume that the current situation is regarded as being worse than the one in 2010. So, why would the Conservative Party opt for a completely changed view of public spending to the one they chose in 2010? I just don't see it happening myself and wouldn't be surprised at all to see HS2 scrapped.
I voted conservative last election but I can’t stand by that. Borrowing rates never been cheaperQuote:
Originally Posted by stevebrickman
Too many governments only deal with short term thinking.
Infrastructure should be ring fenced away from politics.
No argument from me about that. What the project is would be less important than actually doing it. Deciding the best ones to finance is an exercise for others, no me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
Again no argument from me on that. But these are not new projects to lift the economy, these are projects that have already been rejected.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dwr
Perhaps the people that consigned them to the waste paper bin should dig them out and have a rethink!!
Oh I don't want you and Steve to have to spend all night on this, just give your top 5 or 10, that should do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by sneggyblubird
Let's get the bridge to Ireland done first.
I think it was Liam Byrne, secretary to the Treasury that in 2010 left the note for new PM David Cameron to say there was no money left. So it certainly set the scene following Gordon Browns financial mismanagementQuote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
What should they have done differently?Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
The incoming Government were faced with a situation in 2010 and chose a certain way to deal with it. The party that were the dominant influence in that administration are still in power today and I find it hard to believe they would opt for a completely different approach when faced with what we are told is a financially similar, but worse, situation today - that's all I'm saying, I'm not being party political this time.Quote:
Originally Posted by lisvaneblue
But as has been previously said, the Government is going to look to make savings to pay for COVID-19, not mention Brexit, which is conveniently forgotten for now.Quote:
Originally Posted by WJ99mobile
And how could you separate infrastructure decisions from Government, when there’s (allegedly) £100bn* to be spent? The Government could wash its hands of the thing when it all goes badly wrong.
*The true figure will probably be £100zillion, as we all know what happens with large state projects.
Off the top of my head.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Cartman
Deregulation of the banks.
Sale of gold reserves
And not left a stupid childlike reference note, to such a serious subject matter .Quote:
Originally Posted by cityhammer
It will soon be known if this government are of the same mind to impose fresh austerity, if they don't take that approach they will be different than the last administrations.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Thank you for actually replying.Quote:
Originally Posted by cityhammer
Gold was a minor cock up blown out of all proportion, it can be used to signify bad decision making but the idea it in any meaningful way contributed to the 2008 crash/recession is to not understand the numbers involved.
Deregulation is the main thing Labour got wrong. However, this discussion started with the assertion that the 'Tories were left to clean up Labour's mess'. As an opposition you can't do much, all you can do is oppose. Cameron and Osborne didn't oppose deregulation because they actually would have liked to go further at that time.
As the only replies I have received on the subject of infrastructure projects in this thread have been from people trying to score party political points, I'll try and do the same. Will you support spending on big infrastructure projects by this Government if they come? Were you in support of such spending in the latter years of the decade just ended when it was part of Labour party policy?Quote:
Originally Posted by life on mars
All the infrastructure on the London side is well on its way, old oak common is coming along nicely, the removal of protesters in Bucks has now been completed so I would say Boris will not abandon HS2, but I think Crossrail 2 may well be booted into touch.
If the do go for major infrastructure to reboot the economy they need to be looking at things well outside London and keeping their promises about spending money on provincial projects, or they will be rightly castigated for it. Crossrail is years late. Crossrail 2 would be a disaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer
It should be scrapped and the money put towards fibre broadband to every property; I'm sure there would be plenty of cash left over for other infrastructure projects like regional Metros which would benefit far more people.
Plenty of work going on at the Birmingham end, not just HS2 construction, either. Office blocks shooting up and plenty of redevelopment by the central library. Another decade and Greater London will be a suburb of Birmingham. Who would have thought!Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer
Why this particularly?Quote:
Originally Posted by PontBlue
I think it has to be a careful balancing act, I wouldn't want to launch into any big forms of HS2 type infrastructure projects, I think there's a need to look at those area's and communities in the UK that needs it most, and have suffered over the years from the lack of investment.Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson