The Donald Trump thread

[Heathblue]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

You may be right that Trump will win in 2020.

You are also right that polls should be distrusted (however much the pollsters claim to have learned and changed since 2016).

But you also appear to believe the polls that you want to believe (black and female support for Trump.... based on polls?)

And your take on the implications of Mueller and the impeachment hearings seems to have no other basis than Trump's own tweets and Gluey's posts (often the same thing). Maybe the effect is just to strengthen the pro and anti feeling about him and his administration - he is either a victim of the MSM and global elites or a corrupt and inept scumbag backed by a spineless Republican party - but if so (and to go back to the polls again) the best evidence is that his support struggles to reach 40% whilst his opponents are consistently around 55%.

It's not the polls that form my opinion regarding the Black and women supporters of Trump, the amount of women he attracts at his events can be seen with the naked eye although the Black vote is not as visible at these events, the increasing support can be seen on twitter over the past year I think, regarding Mueller I've not gone on a poll, this was the smoking gun that would bring him down, the amount of money, interviews and time spent resulted in a non prosecution / impeachment (not yet anyway) the UKRAINE fiasco seems to have boomeranged, again although there is still a bit of mileage left in this one, as previously said unless the smoking gun (and they have had plenty of attempts) is unveiled, he's a shoe in, he wasn't supposed to win but since his win has had access to the NSA databases, I think he'll be doubling and tripling down on his opponents alleged corruption over the next year and many more Americans will cross the divide, I thought that Michelle Obama was the secret candidate waiting in the wings to step in as I think she would have had more chance than the current mob, but UKRAINE might well go right to Obama when its all shaken down, he does seem quite quiet at the moment and hasn't endorsed his VP.

[lardy]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

It's not the polls that form my opinion regarding the Black and women supporters of Trump, the amount of women he attracts at his events can be seen with the naked eye although the Black vote is not as visible at these events, the increasing support can be seen on twitter over the past year I think, regarding Mueller I've not gone on a poll, this was the smoking gun that would bring him down, the amount of money, interviews and time spent resulted in a non prosecution / impeachment (not yet anyway) the UKRAINE fiasco seems to have boomeranged, again although there is still a bit of mileage left in this one, as previously said unless the smoking gun (and they have had plenty of attempts) is unveiled, he's a shoe in, he wasn't supposed to win but since his win has had access to the NSA databases, I think he'll be doubling and tripling down on his opponents alleged corruption over the next year and many more Americans will cross the divide, I thought that Michelle Obama was the secret candidate waiting in the wings to step in as I think she would have had more chance than the current mob, but UKRAINE might well go right to Obama when its all shaken down, he does seem quite quiet at the moment and hasn't endorsed his VP.

Oh my god, you're basing it on the footage from his rallies

They handpick the people that appear on screen. You must have seen the guy who was pulling faces behind Trump and got replaced by a pretty girl?

That and Twitter. Go on, how can you tell his support on Twitter is increasing?

[lardy]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Imagine following someone relentlessly on a football forum and sniping

I just took a look at Gluey's recent posts. Three of his last four on the politics board mentioned me (and not in a positive way). I didn't bother going back further.

Any thoughts on that?

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I know the "investigative reporter" John Solomon gets a bad press for bias whenever his "exclusives" are posted on here.

I was as shocked as anyone to find out that he shared a proposed Ukraine story with a close colleague of Rudy Guiliani by the name of Lev Parnas before it was published. Also the regular Fox appearing pair of married lawyers, Victoria Toesing and Joe DiGenova.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/biden-ukraine-dirt-file-has-private-email-between-john-solomon-and-rudy-allies

If Lev Parnas's name is familiar it may be because he and an associate were arrested by Federal agents on Wednesday at Washington airport for breaking campaign (guess which one) finance laws by disguising donations from foreign entities. They had one way tickets to Vienna. In a bizarre coincidence, Rudy Giuliani was due to fly there the next day as well.

Even more coincidentally, Solomon's last "scoop" was a deposition to a court from the "disgraced" (some would say) prosecutor, Victor Shokin. He was dismissed after pressure from the US (Biden) and EU for failing to clamp down on corruption. The whole dirt digging from private US citizen Giuliani is that this pressure was to take the heat off Biden's son who worked for a company where an investigation file had been opened.

Shokin's court deposition was in support of a Ukrainian oligarch called Dmitri Firtash, who is seeking to avoid US extradition charges for corruption. Coincidentally, the case is being heard in a court in Vienna. Even more coincidentally, lawyers representing Firtash include Victoria Toesing and Joe DiGenova. Even, even more coincidentally Toesing and DiGenova hired Parnas and his mate as "interpreters" for the case.

All this because Trump is scared of Biden.

Who says conspiracy theorists always have the most seductive tunes but at least Solomon escapes with his reputation for independent journalism recognised for what it is!

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I just took a look at Gluey's recent posts. Three of his last four on the politics board mentioned me (and not in a positive way). I didn't bother going back further.

Any thoughts on that?

It's hardly my fault if your actions don't show you in a positive light! You've spend the past two years passing off gossip and inuendo as fact, even though I highlighted your errors every step of the way. And all I got in return was character assassination and ridicule, as you tried to undermine me and discredit everything that I said. And now you come across as being a very sore loser, and it's about time you started to show some humility!

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I know the "investigative reporter" John Solomon gets a bad press for bias whenever his "exclusives" are posted on here.

I was as shocked as anyone to find out that he shared a proposed Ukraine story with a close colleague of Rudy Guiliani by the name of Lev Parnas before it was published. Also the regular Fox appearing pair of married lawyers, Victoria Toesing and Joe DiGenova.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/biden-ukraine-dirt-file-has-private-email-between-john-solomon-and-rudy-allies

If Lev Parnas's name is familiar it may be because he and an associate were arrested by Federal agents on Wednesday at Washington airport for breaking campaign (guess which one) finance laws by disguising donations from foreign entities. They had one way tickets to Vienna. In a bizarre coincidence, Rudy Giuliani was due to fly there the next day as well.

Even more coincidentally, Solomon's last "scoop" was a deposition to a court from the "disgraced" (some would say) prosecutor, Victor Shokin. He was dismissed after pressure from the US (Biden) and EU for failing to clamp down on corruption. The whole dirt digging from private US citizen Giuliani is that this pressure was to take the heat off Biden's son who worked for a company where an investigation file had been opened.

Shokin's court deposition was in support of a Ukrainian oligarch called Dmitri Firtash, who is seeking to avoid US extradition charges for corruption. Coincidentally, the case is being heard in a court in Vienna. Even more coincidentally, lawyers representing Firtash include Victoria Toesing and Joe DiGenova. Even, even more coincidentally Toesing and DiGenova hired Parnas and his mate as "interpreters" for the case.

All this because Trump is scared of Biden.

Who says conspiracy theorists always have the most seductive tunes but at least Solomon escapes with his reputation for independent journalism recognised for what it is!

I don't believe it, you're going for Trump Russia Collusion, Act IV !! Will you also be dusting off your copy of the Steele dossier again?

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/10/11/rudy-giuliani-donald-trump-wont-say-if-ex-mayor-still-attorney/3945806002/

The 4d chess player seems a bit confused about who his personal lawyer is!

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Why blame Trump?

The UK funded and armed these very "mercenaries" under Cameron and May. These are the "FSA" you lot were counting on to liberate Syria. Think of the hundreds of thousands of Syrians they killed before this, while you cheered on "democrazy." https://t.co/Rvo56MgltM

— Sharmine Narwani (@snarwani) October 14, 2019

[jon1959]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Why blame Trump?

The UK funded and armed these very "mercenaries" under Cameron and May. These are the "FSA" you lot were counting on to liberate Syria. Think of the hundreds of thousands of Syrians they killed before this, while you cheered on "democrazy." https://t.co/Rvo56MgltM

— Sharmine Narwani (@snarwani) October 14, 2019

Seriously? 'Why blame Trump'? Your excuses for him this time will surpass all previous spin.

Who else do you suggest enabled and encouraged this latest round of killing and displacement (and then very half-heartedly pretended to be trying to put the genie back in the bottle once he realised that he had blundered into another massive and fatal cock-up)? He has finally managed to unite Democrats and Republicans, Europeans and Saudis in condemnation. Shot himself in the foot (and the Kurds in the head) and then doubled down on his stupidity in a week of tweets. MAGA my arse!

I doubt anyone on here will try to sanitise the background and history of the Free Syrian Army, but the reason they are running amok now as part of the Turkish assault is because Trump gave the green light.

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Seriously? 'Why blame Trump'? Your excuses for him this time will surpass all previous spin.

Who else do you suggest enabled and encouraged this latest round of killing and displacement (and then very half-heartedly pretended to be trying to put the genie back in the bottle once he realised that he had blundered into another massive and fatal cock-up)? He has finally managed to unite Democrats and Republicans, Europeans and Saudis in condemnation. Shot himself in the foot (and the Kurds in the head) and then doubled down on his stupidity in a week of tweets. MAGA my arse!

I doubt anyone on here will try to sanitise the background and history of the Free Syrian Army, but the reason they are running amok now as part of the Turkish assault is because Trump gave the green light.

Not any kind of nod and wink either. Immediately after another one of those "perfect calls" with foreign leaders only too happy to queue up to take advantage of the master negotiating the art of the deal!

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Seriously? 'Why blame Trump'? Your excuses for him this time will surpass all previous spin.

Who else do you suggest enabled and encouraged this latest round of killing and displacement (and then very half-heartedly pretended to be trying to put the genie back in the bottle once he realised that he had blundered into another massive and fatal cock-up)? He has finally managed to unite Democrats and Republicans, Europeans and Saudis in condemnation. Shot himself in the foot (and the Kurds in the head) and then doubled down on his stupidity in a week of tweets. MAGA my arse!

I doubt anyone on here will try to sanitise the background and history of the Free Syrian Army, but the reason they are running amok now as part of the Turkish assault is because Trump gave the green light.

Wait, we were told the FSA were the good guys, trained and armed by the West to oppose Assad, and now they are the bad guys and it's all Trump's fault? You need to give some more details here ...

[jon1959]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Wait, we were told the FSA were the good guys, trained and armed by the West to oppose Assad, and now they are the bad guys and it's all Trump's fault? You need to give some more details here ...

You dodge a straight question about Trump's responsibility for this political and humanitarian disaster - so far over 100 dead (including executions of prisoners), over 150,000 people fled from their homes, 750 ISIS affiliates escape from detention.... abandoned Kurds appealing to Assad for help.... all the result of Turkish air and ground attacks and the actions of their local clients and proxies.... and I need to give 'more details'?

Are you trying to claim that Trump had a reasonable expectation that the Turks and the FSA would occupy swathes of northern Syria under Kurdish control and would not commit atrocities? That ISIS prisoners would be kept secure? Turkey has been armed and trained by other NATO powers for almost 70 years but has not hidden its agenda in regard to the Kurds and Syria. The FSA (who have morphed all over the place in the past 8 years from anti-Assad military defectors through to Turkish client jihadists) are just an adjunct to the Turks.

Trump set this off through his deal with Erdogan when he had slipped his minders. He has never had the interest or the capacity or the attention span to understand complex geopolitical issues, and in this case he sold out the Kurds and threw a hand grenade into the Middle East for what the thought would be glowing domestic headlines (to distract from impeachment talk). He was wrong on that too.

It seems your best defence of him and answer to 'Why blame Trump?' is that he was too stupid to know better ('we were told the FSA were the good guys'....). He is to blame for this political chaos and humanitarian tragedy. Own it!

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Thanks for the explanation Jon, so if the FSA are now the baddies after we trained and armed them, then how about the White Helmets who were embedded alongside them? Am I correct in thinking that Trump has opened up a huge can of worms here, and what about the previous leaders who seem to have contributed greatly towards the current problem? I think the EU also need to take some of the blame, as besides most member countries failing to meet their NATO contributions, they also haven't intervened or sent any sent peacekeeping troops. I believe there were only 50 non-combatent US personnel in the buffer zone, so it wasn't difficult to replace them. Also how about Turkey themselves? They are a NATO member too, so they should be taking the most blame, and also facing sanctions and expulsion from NATO.

[life on mars]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Thanks for the explanation Jon, so if the FSA are now the baddies after we trained and armed them, then how about the White Helmets who were embedded alongside them? Am I correct in thinking that Trump has opened up a huge can of worms here, and what about the previous leaders who seem to have contributed greatly towards the current problem? I think the EU also need to take some of the blame, as besides most member countries failing to meet their NATO contributions, they also haven't intervened or sent any sent peacekeeping troops. I believe there were only 50 non-combatent US personnel in the buffer zone, so it wasn't difficult to replace them. Also how about Turkey themselves? They are a NATO member too, so they should be taking the most blame, and also facing sanctions and expulsion from NATO.

its interesting to read the Russian have taken up the residency in the vacated american bases promising to keep Syrian and Turkish fighters apart , I dont blame the USA pulling out , I'm sure the Israelis have eyes on it anyway ,

Anyway where's that European army when you need them ,Europe is full rhetoric about these war zones , and lacking purpose or real peaceful support in these areas .

[Wales-Bales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

its interesting to read the Russian have taken up the residency in the vacated american bases promising to keep Syrian and Turkish fighters apart , I dont blame the USA pulling out , I'm sure the Israelis have eyes on it anyway ,

Anyway where's that European army when you need them ,Europe is full rhetoric about these war zones , and lacking purpose or real peaceful support in these areas .

If Turkey get booted out of NATO they are in the crap. I don't think anybody comes out of this smelling of roses, as there has been a lot of meddling going on behind the scenes. If the US stayed, they would have to committ for at least the next 100 years.