The Donald Trump thread

[Heathblue]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

If you're going to palm off someone else's quote as your own, at least make sure it's not one that he got widely ridiculed for

https://x.com/PeterTwinklage/status/1909272973875241466

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerro...what-happened/

Where you been mate I've missed you.

By the way, I saw it on the DC Draino feed 👍

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

"Mummy, mummy, please make the man with the truth go away. He's spoiling my playtime."

I don't think you like being told you're utterly wrong, know nothing of which you speak and are determinedly misleading people with agitprop posts.

Go ahead report me. I'm not sure what for exactly ... because I said if you believed the tripe you posted you're an idiot? You do know it's an internet message board and not the sand pit in the local park, right?

I will report you for each unrelated personal insults going forward. It's your modus operandi. Ignore questions and points made and follow back with nothing but insults.

It ruins internet forums the world over, and if you can't debate properly then don't join in

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

[QUOTE=Dorcus;5583047]

The Rotherham rioters were Right Wing malignant terrorists full stop. They put innocent people's lives in danger. We should wipe the floor with these evil misfits.

In which case you won't struggle to find a report on the events that paints it in such a way, will you?

[Dorcus]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

[QUOTE=JamesWales;5583109]

In which case you won't struggle to find a report on the events that paints it in such a way, will you?

Indeed not, you're right. The Truth has a way of revealing itself over time.

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I know you won't understand/listen/take your rightwing blinkers off ... whatever. We judge Brexit by the counterfactual of where Britain would have been had it not occurred. Everyone who has any expertise will tell you Britain is worse off. But apparently you know better. Cross sectional comparisons are not good guides.

Go on, complain that I've maligned you by failing to agree with your one-eyed bollocks.

I don't think suggesting comparisons between peer nations is right-wing blinkers. You just say that because you can't answer the question.

Thanks for confirming you base your strongly held belief entirely on predictions whilst ignoring actual data. If you deal in fantasy scenarios you can never be proved wrong I guess. If you deal in facts then you are wrong, however.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

[QUOTE=JamesWales;5583109]

In which case you won't struggle to find a report on the events that paints it in such a way, will you?

That's a post by dorcus , not me

That being said I totally agree with it , the rioters were racist filth and got everything they deserved and more

I have posted recently a film from a hidden camera in the middle of those racist scum attacking the hotel up at Rotherham

Racial insults and violent racist behaviour

Scroll back and take a look

That will show even an ostrich like you about the real reasons for the riots

I notice you ignored it last time so here's your chance

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

[QUOTE=SLUDGE FACTORY;5583115]

That's a post by dorcus , not me

That being said I totally agree with it , the rioters were racist filth and got everything they deserved and more

I have posted recently a film from a hidden camera in the middle of those racist scum attacking the hotel up at Rotherham

Racial insults and violent racist behaviour

Scroll back and take a look

That will show even an ostrich like you about the real reasons for the riots

I notice you ignored it last time so here's your chance

I know it was from Dorcus 🤷.

The point is the disgraceful riots were a complex and toxic mix of various issues, one of which and the motivation for many was indeed racial hatred. These things never have a single cause though. This is the case for nearly every riot going. There is a spark, but the causes, motivation and ingredients are never solely one thing. That's the case for every riot going, and is absolutely the same with the riots in 2011for example, the ones in Swansea a couple of years ago, the BLM ones in America, all of them. Not everyone involved in 2011 did so out of solidarity with Mark Duggan and not everyone involved last summer did so due to racial hatred. Huge factor? Yes. Biggest factor? Probably. Sole factor? Nope.
You must have seen some trouble at football before to know about group mentality?

If you can find a reputable source that says there is only one cause and all rioters and all those arrested shared the same views then please share it.

https://www.citystgeorges.ac.uk/news-and-events/news/2024/august/southport-tragedy-uk-riots

https://theloop.ecpr.eu/what-caused-the-riots-in-britain/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/sep/27/first-edition-summer-riots-young-people

[az city]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I will report you for each unrelated personal insults going forward. It's your modus operandi. Ignore questions and points made and follow back with nothing but insults.

It ruins internet forums the world over, and if you can't debate properly then don't join in

There is something wrong with someone who takes themself so seriously as you.

You ruin every thread by posting your ignorant contrarian agitprop tripe. Sludge is funny, you never are.

[az city]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I don't think suggesting comparisons between peer nations is right-wing blinkers. You just say that because you can't answer the question.

Thanks for confirming you base your strongly held belief entirely on predictions whilst ignoring actual data. If you deal in fantasy scenarios you can never be proved wrong I guess. If you deal in facts then you are wrong, however.

Absolute rubbish as normal. Once again you are claiming some kind of expertise that you don't possess. You don't know what you're talking about.

Here's a very simple question for you: what qualifications and experience do you have to claim expertise in debating Economics?

Answer:
1. GCSE/O Level
2. A Level
3. S Level
4. 1 or 2 college classes for non-Economics majors
5. BS/BA/BSc
6. MA/MS/MSc
7. PhD

Just reply with the relevant options in the answer listed.

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

There is something wrong with someone who takes themself so seriously as you.

You ruin every thread by posting your ignorant contrarian agitprop tripe. Sludge is funny, you never are.

No one is appointing you as a judge in the humour stakes.

[Eric Cartman]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

The EU contains a large number of eastern European countries still typically growing faster as they develop post communism - obviously lessening as time passes.

Compare the UK with western European peers - France, Italy, Germany, Austria, Netherlands and the like. And pick a metric. The difference is marginal on every level. An unmitigated disaster it is not. Nor is it a wild success story. The truth is pretty anodyne.

Whether we are doing better or worse than a certain country or the entire block on any given metric isn't really the central point anyway. The almost inevitable result of increasing barriers to trade is that both parties are worse off. Brexiteers have created this false narrative that as long as the UK trudges along broadly in line with France/Germany that Brexit wasn't a failure, exports of goods are down, businesses have made it pretty clear that it's harder to sell into the single market now. This was all inevitable, the measure of whether Brexit was a success or failure can only really be 'where would we (and the EU) have been without it' and you can think that is crystal ball economics if you want but goods exports to the EU were growing pre-brexit and have fallen since it, so it feels pretty safe to me, it's also worth noting that far from replacing these markets and trading with the rest of the world instead, our goods exports are down with the rest of the world as well, which was mind numbingly predictable and obvious to everyone except those running the leave campaign.

Well, in fairness I guess there is another way to measure the success of Brexit, has anything that brexiteers said during the campaign come true? How does the vision of Brexit, these automatic benefits that would just appear, measure up to the realities.

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Absolute rubbish as normal. Once again you are claiming some kind of expertise that you don't possess. You don't know what you're talking about.

Here's a very simple question for you: what qualifications and experience do you have to claim expertise in debating Economics?

Answer:
1. GCSE/O Level
2. A Level
3. S Level
4. 1 or 2 college classes for non-Economics majors
5. BS/BA/BSc
6. MA/MS/MSc
7. PhD

Just reply with the relevant options in the answer listed.

I can read facts and place a greater importance on them rather than theoretical models.

You can say "Brexit is an unmitigated disaster" and produce only a model.

But if you look at facts, of the economy as a whole, the evidence absolutely does not back up your very hyperbolic statement. It just doesn't.

An expert in football will have an opinion on the outcome of the afternoons games. It doesn't counter the actual results come 5pm though. That's the problem (aside from the general anger and insults) with what you are saying. Your summary is only valid by completely ignoring real data on GDP, unemployment, markets, wages, inflation, all the usual key metrics.

I have taken the time to post this on numerous occasions but you just don't respond to it and if you do it's an angry insult.

[az city]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

I can read facts and place a greater importance on them rather than theoretical models.

You can say "Brexit is an unmitigated disaster" and produce only a model.

But if you look at facts, of the economy as a whole, the evidence absolutely does not back up your very hyperbolic statement. It just doesn't.

An expert in football will have an opinion on the outcome of the afternoons games. It doesn't counter the actual results come 5pm though. That's the problem (aside from the general anger and insults) with what you are saying. Your summary is only valid by completely ignoring real data on GDP, unemployment, markets, wages, inflation, all the usual key metrics.

I have taken the time to post this on numerous occasions but you just don't respond to it and if you do it's an angry insult.

So the answer is you have NO qualifications.

I'm not angry with you I actually pity you.

[JamesWales]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Whether we are doing better or worse than a certain country or the entire block on any given metric isn't really the central point anyway. The almost inevitable result of increasing barriers to trade is that both parties are worse off. Brexiteers have created this false narrative that as long as the UK trudges along broadly in line with France/Germany that Brexit wasn't a failure, exports of goods are down, businesses have made it pretty clear that it's harder to sell into the single market now. This was all inevitable, the measure of whether Brexit was a success or failure can only really be 'where would we (and the EU) have been without it' and you can think that is crystal ball economics if you want but goods exports to the EU were growing pre-brexit and have fallen since it, so it feels pretty safe to me, it's also worth noting that far from replacing these markets and trading with the rest of the world instead, our goods exports are down with the rest of the world as well, which was mind numbingly predictable and obvious to everyone except those running the leave campaign.

Well, in fairness I guess there is another way to measure the success of Brexit, has anything that brexiteers said during the campaign come true? How does the vision of Brexit, these automatic benefits that would just appear, measure up to the realities.

In judging the success or otherwise of a huge political and economic event, why on earth would you only consider the export and import of goods?

I'm not saying it's not important, it is. But why would you only consider that?

If Scotland voted for independence, their trade with the UK may go down (for arguments sake) but if their GDP growth remained broadly the same, if their unemployment rate was slightly lower, if their inflation was broadly comparable, if their stock exchange performed slightly better etc, etc, would you consider that an unmitigated disaster?

The reality is mix of good and bad and the reality is that on some key metrics we have outperformed our peers, and on some we haven't.

Brexit is neither an "unmitigated disaster" nor a roaring success. If anything, it's meh.

[Dorcus]

Re: The Donald Trump thread

Whether we are doing better or worse than a certain country or the entire block on any given metric isn't really the central point anyway. The almost inevitable result of increasing barriers to trade is that both parties are worse off. Brexiteers have created this false narrative that as long as the UK trudges along broadly in line with France/Germany that Brexit wasn't a failure, exports of goods are down, businesses have made it pretty clear that it's harder to sell into the single market now. This was all inevitable, the measure of whether Brexit was a success or failure can only really be 'where would we (and the EU) have been without it' and you can think that is crystal ball economics if you want but goods exports to the EU were growing pre-brexit and have fallen since it, so it feels pretty safe to me, it's also worth noting that far from replacing these markets and trading with the rest of the world instead, our goods exports are down with the rest of the world as well, which was mind numbingly predictable and obvious to everyone except those running the leave campaign.

Well, in fairness I guess there is another way to measure the success of Brexit, has anything that brexiteers said during the campaign come true? How does the vision of Brexit, these automatic benefits that would just appear, measure up to the realities.

Apart from the immense Economic miscalculation the political fallout is catastrophic. With a rogue USA reneging on democracy the World needs a powerful counter weight in the West. That can only be a united and strong Europe. The UK is an irreplaceable factor in that context and Brexit has shattered the model into tiny pieces. Incidentally that was always the aim of bad actors around the World such as Putin and Trump and a large number of other rich and influential right wing interests.