Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Stripping away all the point scoring fundamental questions :
should folk get 11% ??

I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't ask for it within our economic model.

what happens when inflation falls to 2% do we apply wage cuts ??

Why would you cut wages when the value of them is still decreasing?

can UK afford it ??

The UK is a capitalist country, this isn't a relevant question unless you are going to apply it to every transaction that takes place.

should public sector get better rises than private ?

I don't think so, no. I would be very surprised if that has happened in the recent past, or will in the near future. Should you point score and play public vs private, I don't think so, no.

if private sector did get the same as public would business cost rise resulting in redundancies ?

Some might, It sounds like you think wages should be kept artificially low to keep failing businesses afloat?

should public sector pensions be eased for the taxpayer to fund wage increases , as this is a benefit the private sector doesn't get and not factored in very often ..

I don't think it is a good idea to ask somebody to pay into something based on a future promise and then renege on it

if something like 11% is issued guess costs to consumer go up , business go the wall and services become cut ??

Not too sure what you mean here

will more jobs go off shore especially those call centres type roles that can be done anywhere .?

Heaven forbid call centre jobs to go offshore, just imagine if that happened (it has already happened)

will pay rises bring about less full time workers

Yeah if I get the mythical 11%, I will probably cut back to 4-5 hours a week, why work?! I will be rolling in it.

I'm sure I've got it wrong but it all sniffs of opportunity country is coming out of Covid struggling to recover best to kick it now whilst its down rather than allow any sort of recovery classic union tactics ...

Stop talking the country down, I won't have it.

The part I struggle with is kids need to be in school after two years of pain and absence , hospital staff need to get into work on transport to save lives and get the lengthy waiting lists down rather than wait and see folk die ??

If the public transport system has this much influence over peoples lives then perhaps it shouldn't be run by a hundred different companies all primarily concerned by profit margin. Renationalising transport would allow for an integrated system based around what the country needs and a system by which the elected government can be held to account for its failings (i.e. they can't say 'sorry, nothing to do with us', as per this week).

We could have a much worse unemployment situation due to Covid thankfully we don't due to the excellent billions of pounds of Furlough / business support measures .

Sadly a lot of folk had to take a 20% cut in wages to survive in work , whilst the public sector had 100% payments and in some case not working , or working in a restricted manner , got a feeling RMT workers maybe have been on full pay ,no mention of that benefit though ??

I am missing the point here. They are considered a vital service so continued working during the pandemic, shouldn't they be praised for this?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Stripping away all the point scoring fundamental questions :
should folk get 11% ??

I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't ask for it within our economic model.

what happens when inflation falls to 2% do we apply wage cuts ??

Why would you cut wages when the value of them is still decreasing?

can UK afford it ??

The UK is a capitalist country, this isn't a relevant question unless you are going to apply it to every transaction that takes place.

should public sector get better rises than private ?

I don't think so, no. I would be very surprised if that has happened in the recent past, or will in the near future. Should you point score and play public vs private, I don't think so, no.

if private sector did get the same as public would business cost rise resulting in redundancies ?

Some might, It sounds like you think wages should be kept artificially low to keep failing businesses afloat?

should public sector pensions be eased for the taxpayer to fund wage increases , as this is a benefit the private sector doesn't get and not factored in very often ..

I don't think it is a good idea to ask somebody to pay into something based on a future promise and then renege on it

if something like 11% is issued guess costs to consumer go up , business go the wall and services become cut ??

Not too sure what you mean here

will more jobs go off shore especially those call centres type roles that can be done anywhere .?

Heaven forbid call centre jobs to go offshore, just imagine if that happened (it has already happened)

will pay rises bring about less full time workers

Yeah if I get the mythical 11%, I will probably cut back to 4-5 hours a week, why work?! I will be rolling in it.

I'm sure I've got it wrong but it all sniffs of opportunity country is coming out of Covid struggling to recover best to kick it now whilst its down rather than allow any sort of recovery classic union tactics ...

Stop talking the country down, I won't have it.

The part I struggle with is kids need to be in school after two years of pain and absence , hospital staff need to get into work on transport to save lives and get the lengthy waiting lists down rather than wait and see folk die ??

If the public transport system has this much influence over peoples lives then perhaps it shouldn't be run by a hundred different companies all primarily concerned by profit margin. Renationalising transport would allow for an integrated system based around what the country needs and a system by which the elected government can be held to account for its failings (i.e. they can't say 'sorry, nothing to do with us', as per this week).

We could have a much worse unemployment situation due to Covid thankfully we don't due to the excellent billions of pounds of Furlough / business support measures .

Sadly a lot of folk had to take a 20% cut in wages to survive in work , whilst the public sector had 100% payments and in some case not working , or working in a restricted manner , got a feeling RMT workers maybe have been on full pay ,no mention of that benefit though ??

I am missing the point here. They are considered a vital service so continued working during the pandemic, shouldn't they be praised for this?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

So good, I posted it twice.

[jon1959]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

So good, I posted it twice.

Quite right too.

[Doucas]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Yes, wage growth vs inflation is a completely useless statistic. Okay. Good one.

You are just annoyed that the narrative that the UK is the worst place in Europe is incorrect.

Did you even read what I said?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Have you ever heard a government minister say landlords should hold rent below inflation? Or told business owners they should hold down prices and take a hit on profits? Because we’re hearing a lot of them demand that of workers today!

— Michael Walker (@michaeljswalker) June 20, 2022

[JamesWales]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Did you even read what I said?

Of course I did. Amongst other things, such as presenting a different topic you said "the entire thread is pointless".

When it is official statistics taken on the comparison between wages and inflation, which is the prime statistic used in the analysis of cost of living.

You are just upset that the same situation (And worse) is occuring outside the UK and therefore your default and sole reasoning (its the Tories fault!) is thus clearly not the answer.

[Feedback]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Remarkably stable in the last 6 years

https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?f...o=EUR&view=10Y

I'm still not sure why you referenced the dollar, which is what I was really asking

[Doucas]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

Of course I did. Amongst other things, such as presenting a different topic you said "the entire thread is pointless".

When it is official statistics taken on the comparison between wages and inflation, which is the prime statistic used in the analysis of cost of living.

You are just upset that the same situation (And worse) is occuring outside the UK and therefore your default and sole reasoning (its the Tories fault!) is thus clearly not the answer.

I don't think you've understood what I've said otherwise you wouldn't have said that last paragraph.

The inflation rates you've posted mean nothing as they don't include house prices, rent, electric and gas and fuel. In France for example their bills have increased by what, 4%? Not sure what the average here is but mine have increased by about 50%. But you're here saying our wage to inflation ratio is better, you're lying through your teeth.

[JamesWales]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

I don't think you've understood what I've said otherwise you wouldn't have said that last paragraph.

The inflation rates you've posted mean nothing as they don't include house prices, rent, electric and gas and fuel. In France for example their bills have increased by what, 4%? Not sure what the average here is but mine have increased by about 50%. But you're here saying our wage to inflation ratio is better, you're lying through your teeth.

Inflation rarely includes house prices, unless I'm mistaken - and I agree, it makes a lot of inflation data less useful as a result.

Eurostat themselves say that energy costs are a key driver of inflation, so they are included and I'll take the EU's statistical bodies word on it over yours.

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/economy/eus-annual-inflation-hits-88-in-may/2616081

You just need to accept, this is a continent and world wide issue and thus the solutions lie there too. I'm not asking you to accept more than the truth. It shouldnt be this hard.

[MOZZER2]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

so JamesWales as your the font of knowledge regarding inflation I saw these figures this morning regarding price rises .UK price rises in the past 12 months

▪️Domestic gas 95%
▪️Domestic electricity 54%
▪️Pasta 48%
▪️Fuel 40%
▪️Used cars 30%
▪️Bread 16%
▪️Rice 15%

how come headline inflation is currently 9% ?

[JamesWales]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

so JamesWales as your the font of knowledge regarding inflation I saw these figures this morning regarding price rises .UK price rises in the past 12 months

▪️Domestic gas 95%
▪️Domestic electricity 54%
▪️Pasta 48%
▪️Fuel 40%
▪️Used cars 30%
▪️Bread 16%
▪️Rice 15%

how come headline inflation is currently 9% ?

I'm not the font of all knowledge, but off the top of my head;

1 - Thats only a small selection of goods
2 - Many of those costs may be what the products cost at source, but won't be passed onto retailers
3 - They may be temporary rises
4 - In some cases they only form a small part of the economy. For example, if I have £200 to spend a week and bread has gone from 65p to 75p that is a significant rise, but has no real impact on general inflation.

I don't work for national statistics though, all I'm saying is that as bad as things are, they are just as bad and in some cases worse elsewhere.

[life on mars]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

so JamesWales as your the font of knowledge regarding inflation I saw these figures this morning regarding price rises .UK price rises in the past 12 months

▪️Domestic gas 95%
▪️Domestic electricity 54%
▪️Pasta 48%
▪️Fuel 40%
▪️Used cars 30%
▪️Bread 16%
▪️Rice 15%

how come headline inflation is currently 9% ?

Need some clarity :

Will the world be now holding strike ballots , to teach Boris a lesson ??

Is inflation only happening here ??

If flour and jam go up we will not see any cake gate parties

[Doucas]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

I'm not the font of all knowledge, but off the top of my head;

1 - Thats only a small selection of goods
2 - Many of those costs may be what the products cost at source, but won't be passed onto retailers
3 - They may be temporary rises
4 - In some cases they only form a small part of the economy. For example, if I have £200 to spend a week and bread has gone from 65p to 75p that is a significant rise, but has no real impact on general inflation.

I don't work for national statistics though, all I'm saying is that as bad as things are, they are just as bad and in some cases worse elsewhere.

'Gas, electricity and fuel only a small selection of goods'

These are absolute essentials that people have to spend money on. Gas and electric bills are far cheaper in most other countries, why not here?

[JamesWales]

Re: Wages growth vs. Inflation; EU and UK

'Gas, electricity and fuel only a small selection of goods'

These are absolute essentials that people have to spend money on. Gas and electric bills are far cheaper in most other countries, why not here?

Of course they are essential, and that will feed into other costs, but gas going up by X% doesn't mean that everything else will go up by the same X%.

Are you sure bills are far cheaper in most other countries?

We've done this before but I see you keep repeating it.

This data is of course from pre-Ukraine. I think you seem to think that only the UK is impacted by things and that the UK makes uniquely awful decisions. Probably read it on twitter, but it isn't so.

https://www.saveonenergy.com/uk/how-much-do-electricity-bills-cost-across-europe/