When Will The Left ?

[the other bob wilson]

Re: When Will The Left ?

No thats what happens when you ignore issues Bob.

No, that’s what happen when immigration is treated in the manner the UK Government, certain newspapers and broadcast outlets treat it. Immigration only becomes an issue when right wing politicians and media people want it to be.

Once again, you just lazily equate anyone with a different opinion to yours on this subject with being in favour of an immigration freefor all. Also, before you ask, I don’t have an easy answer to the problem because there isn’t one, but what I do know is that expensive gimmicks like the Rwanda one are not the answer, they’re merely weapons in the culture war theGovernment wants to fight.

[JamesWales]

Re: When Will The Left ?

No, that’s what happen when immigration is treated in the manner the UK Government, certain newspapers and broadcast outlets treat it. Immigration only becomes an issue when right wing politicians and media people want it to be.

Once again, you just lazily equate anyone with a different opinion to yours on this subject with being in favour of an immigration freefor all. Also, before you ask, I don’t have an easy answer to the problem because there isn’t one, but what I do know is that expensive gimmicks like the Rwanda one are not the answer, they’re merely weapons in the culture war theGovernment wants to fight.

I'm not sure what you are saying?

You are implying that some terrorist acted because 'the right' made a 'culture war' of this. I would cast doubt on that. I'd say it happened because nothing has been done about what now seems to be a mass exploitation of the system.

What you are saying is no different to people who equated the murder of Davied Amess with Angela Rayner calling people 'Tory Scum' at the conference a short while before.

These things are far more complex as you know. You can't just label everything a 'culture war'. As I said before, if anyone is guilty of that, it's those that hide behind accusations of racism / xenophobia etc as a means to do nothing about it.

We've all known for months and months that something was going wrong. Was Rwanda an expensive gimmick? I dunno. Maybe it would have served as a real deterrent and not led to costs being as high as £7m a day. Who knows. That was it's intention - to smash the business model, not to send thousands to Rwanda, but to prevent there being thousands of dubious claims in the first place. What was she labelled for it? Evil bitch and the rest, with no alternatives given.

It's that policy vacuum that gives extremists (which DO exist unfortunately) the space to operate.

And immigration was an issue for years and years - again, people ignored it. Hoped it would go away, and then Brexit happened.

We cannot keep ignoring issues and hope they disappear. The current situation has been obvious since last summer at least.

[Citizen's Nephew]

Re: When Will The Left ?

No, that’s what happen when immigration is treated in the manner the UK Government, certain newspapers and broadcast outlets treat it. Immigration only becomes an issue when right wing politicians and media people want it to be.

Once again, you just lazily equate anyone with a different opinion to yours on this subject with being in favour of an immigration freefor all. Also, before you ask, I don’t have an easy answer to the problem because there isn’t one, but what I do know is that expensive gimmicks like the Rwanda one are not the answer, they’re merely weapons in the culture war theGovernment wants to fight.

Well said. I've said it before and I'll keep saying it, we had the same rhetoric from the right regarding the unemployed, disabled and vulnerable for years which caused untold damage to the lives of people within those demographics.

[Dorcus]

Re: When Will The Left ?

I'm not sure what you are saying?

You are implying that some terrorist acted because 'the right' made a 'culture war' of this. I would cast doubt on that. I'd say it happened because nothing has been done about what now seems to be a mass exploitation of the system.

What you are saying is no different to people who equated the murder of Davied Amess with Angela Rayner calling people 'Tory Scum' at the conference a short while before.

These things are far more complex as you know. You can't just label everything a 'culture war'. As I said before, if anyone is guilty of that, it's those that hide behind accusations of racism / xenophobia etc as a means to do nothing about it.

We've all known for months and months that something was going wrong. Was Rwanda an expensive gimmick? I dunno. Maybe it would have served as a real deterrent and not led to costs being as high as £7m a day. Who knows. That was it's intention - to smash the business model, not to send thousands to Rwanda, but to prevent there being thousands of dubious claims in the first place. What was she labelled for it? Evil bitch and the rest, with no alternatives given.

It's that policy vacuum that gives extremists (which DO exist unfortunately) the space to operate.

And immigration was an issue for years and years - again, people ignored it. Hoped it would go away, and then Brexit happened.

We cannot keep ignoring issues and hope they disappear. The current situation has been obvious since last summer at least.

I'd be interested to know why the influx of these foreign nationals troubles you so. How do you think it would affect you adversely?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: When Will The Left ?

I'm not sure what you are saying?

You are implying that some terrorist acted because 'the right' made a 'culture war' of this. I would cast doubt on that. I'd say it happened because nothing has been done about what now seems to be a mass exploitation of the system.

What you are saying is no different to people who equated the murder of Davied Amess with Angela Rayner calling people 'Tory Scum' at the conference a short while before.

Have you read some of the stuff the guy put online? It struck me that he was very poorly educated, likely had additional untreated needs, lonely (/living in his own world), he is absolutely the perfect target to be 'radicalised' and the right wing press have stepped over the line many times in that regard, stoking up hate around this issue over the years. He certainly wasn't somebody making an informed rational decision who decided one day 'not enough is being done to address this issue'.

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[Doucas]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Have you read some of the stuff the guy put online? It struck me that he was very poorly educated, likely had additional untreated needs, lonely (/living in his own world), he is absolutely the perfect target to be 'radicalised' and the right wing press have stepped over the line many times in that regard, stoking up hate around this issue over the years. He certainly wasn't somebody making an informed rational decision who decided one day 'not enough is being done to address this issue'.

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Why bother debating. This is the person who said gammon was a racist term, GB news isn't right wing and that nobody in the UK wants to stop all immigration.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Why bother debating. This is the person who said gammon was a racist term, GB news isn't right wing and that nobody in the UK wants to stop all immigration.

All of which highlights the position that he comes at these arguments from. He seems to think that you have to have people strutting about in uniforms with swastikas on them before they qualify as being far right.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: When Will The Left ?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/06/suella-braverman-was-warned-hate-speech-could-inspire-far-right

Bloody lefty lawyers.

[life on mars]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Asylum seekers or thier sons have bombed for decades ,the dead relatives of those atrocities will tell you that .. bugger all to do with government rhetoric its religious extremists same in France .

Thousands of Albanians have arrived (young nen ) they are known for drug and gang related offences in all the big cities.. some even traffic young children ..into dreadful conditions and use..

Why we should apologise to illegal folk arriving and not getting automatic hotel stays is maddness..

We should set up a support system and all those sympathetic on those board who have a spare room step forward instead of throwing out defence statements because they hate the Tories and think its a vote winner ..

Two things that should not be politised NHS and Immigration.

Bet Sir Bier enjoys this bashing over these issues as his end game is equally poor .. to use it as a tool .. asit is people's lives at risk.. and our country when the next attrocity happens.

[Claude Blue]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Asylum seekers or thier sons have bombed for decades ,the dead relatives of those atrocities will tell you that .. bugger all to do with government rhetoric its religious extremists same in France .

Thousands of Albanians have arrived (young nen ) they are known for drug and gang related offences in all the big cities.. some even traffic young children ..into dreadful conditions and use..

Why we should apologise to illegal folk arriving and not getting automatic hotel stays is maddness..

We should set up a support system and all those sympathetic on those board who have a spare room step forward instead of throwing out defence statements because they hate the Tories and think its a vote winner ..

Two things that should not be politised NHS and Immigration.

Bet Sir Bier enjoys this bashing over these issues as his end game is equally poor .. to use it as a tool .. asit is people's lives at risk.. and our country when the next attrocity happens.

Can anyone translate into English?

[lardy]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Can anyone translate into English?

Something about it being Labour's fault.

[Dorcus]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Something about it being Labour's fault.

Perhaps he should stick to copying and pasting.

[life on mars]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Denmark keen on Rwanda soultion ,perhaps Labour should back government on this idea ..

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/denmark-rwanda-sign-declaration-on-possible-transfer-of-asylum-seekers/

[the other bob wilson]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Denmark keen on Rwanda soultion ,perhaps Labour should back government on this idea ..

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/new...sylum-seekers/

Or perhaps they shouldn’t.

[Eric Cartman]

Re: When Will The Left ?

Denmark keen on Rwanda soultion ,perhaps Labour should back government on this idea ..

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/new...sylum-seekers/

I know nuance isn't your cup of tea but there is a big difference between our 'rwanda deal' and their proposed 'rwanda deal'

Theirs involves the transfer of illegal arrivals for processing, with the prospect of resettlement in Denmark if they meet the criteria for asylum.

Ours invalidates their right to settlement in the UK even if they fully meet the criteria for asylum BECAUSE they entered illegally.

I don't think either plan is particularly moral or practical but theirs at least complies with international law.