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  • Great Documentary Loves His Footy

    Reasd and saw the documentraty on Channel 4 good read sad it happeneed at the football with his dad his book is brillant




    By Brendan O’Neill Spectator

    Baddielphobia and the ugly truth about anti-Semitism
    23 November, 2022, 6:54 AM

    David Baddiel could not have asked for better evidence for his thesis that ‘Jews don’t count’ than the online reaction to it.

    Channel 4 broadcast his intelligent and touching documentary this week with that very title – Jews Don’t Count – and instantly there was an explosion of Baddielphobia. It was almost as if people were determined to prove his point. There’s a blind spot among progressives when it comes to anti-Jewish hatred, said Baddiel. And – boom – there it was, right away, in hateful comment after hateful comment: the blind spot, clear as anything.

    Baddiel first made his case in his sharp polemical book Jews Don’t Count, published last year. He argued, convincingly, that there is a new leftish coalition that fancies itself as being ‘on the right side of history’ but which rarely takes up the cause of Jews.

    It’s not the left as we would have traditionally understood it, he says. It’s more cultural than economic, more into identity than class. But not all identities. There’s one identity group it cold-shoulders, whose experiences of racial hatred it tends to overlook. Jews, they’re just not that into you.

    Baddiel’s book gives numerous examples of prejudicial speech against Jews that just didn’t cause much stir among supposedly anti-racist progressives. Speech that would have had them glued to their computer keyboards, hollering for the evil speaker’s cancellation, had it been aimed at any other ethnic minority.

    None of the rules of identity politics seem to apply to Jews, says Baddiel. Especially the rule that says minorities must be allowed to define and speak about the racism they experience. Jews are excluded from the ‘sacred circle’ of progressive causes, he says.

    This is so obviously the case. I have been in media discussions about anti-Semitism where someone of a leftish persuasion will say, ‘And what about Islamophobia?’. Someone mentions anti-Semitism and they instinctively bark: ‘And black people? Do you care about them?’

    Whenever I write about anti-Semitism I’m inundated with hateful messages. ‘Zio-cuck’ was a recent one. When I wrote about Wiley’s anti-Jewish outbursts people even made the effort of finding my Instagram so that they could tell me what a racist I am. It’s racist to talk about anti-Jewish racism, you see. I can only imagine the bile Jews receive.

    Monday night’s TV version of Baddiel’s book was a great watch. He spoke to Howard Jacobson, David Schwimmer, Sarah Silverman, Miriam Margolyes. They talked about the racist tropes that say Jews run Hollywood and are greedy and deviant. They talked about the racist attacks Jews have been subjected to in recent years. This was important stuff.

    Well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him And the reaction from the right-side-of-history brigade? From those self-styled anti-racists? They mocked it. They ridiculed it. They branded Baddiel a hypocrite. They said that, if anything, Jews are privileged when it comes to discussions about racism. The racist far right talks about ‘Jewish privilege’, the racist radical left talks about the privileging of Jewish suffering. Two cheeks of the same you know what.

    Baddiel-bashing is everywhere right now. You just do not see this with other minority groups. If a black woman made a TV show about anti-black racism, or a young Muslim gave a speech about anti-Muslim bigotry, social media would not be aflame with insults and jibes against those people. But a Jew? Knock yourselves out.

    The weird left seems determined to derail every discussion about anti-Semitism. I cannot remember the last time a Jewish person got to speak about anti-Jewish racism without swarms of identitarians trying to shout them down. Margaret Hodge, Rachel Riley, Luciana Berger, and now Baddiel – all are heckled, all are demonised.

    It feels almost pathological at this stage. A Jew opens his mouth to talk about racism and instantly the Socialism of Fools manifests, with a thousand tweeters wondering out loud when this privileged, moany idiot is going to shut the hell up.

    Derailment has been the name of the game once again following the airing of Baddiel’s doc. The main way they try to derail Baddiel’s commentary on anti-Jewish hate is by reminding him that he used to black-up as footballer Jason Lee on Fantasy Football League 25 years ago.

    It doesn’t matter that Baddiel has apologised for doing this, on more than one occasion, including to Lee personally on Jews Don’t Count. It is still tirelessly raked up. It is played as a Baddiel-silencing trump card. ‘Ha, you’re the real racist’, they say.

    Clearly Baddiel isn’t racist. Clearly he feels no prejudice towards Lee or black people in general. I’m sure many of his detractors know this.

    No matter, for them the old blacking-up story has one aim and one aim only: to delegitimise Baddiel and derail his commentary on anti-Jewish hate. It’s a poisonous silencing tactic.

    So, well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him. Your fury at a Jew for saying Jews don’t count pretty much demonstrates that you think Jews don’t count. Anyone who thought that leftish animus towards the Jews would fade away with the decline of the Corbynista movement was clearly mistaken. That ‘blind spot’ Baddiel highlights is growing and getting nastier. It’s time more proper progressives took a stand against this new appearance of the oldest hatred.

  • #2
    Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

    Originally posted by life on mars View Post
    Reasd and saw the documentraty on Channel 4 good read sad it happeneed at the football with his dad his book is brillant




    By Brendan O’Neill Spectator

    Baddielphobia and the ugly truth about anti-Semitism
    23 November, 2022, 6:54 AM

    David Baddiel could not have asked for better evidence for his thesis that ‘Jews don’t count’ than the online reaction to it.

    Channel 4 broadcast his intelligent and touching documentary this week with that very title – Jews Don’t Count – and instantly there was an explosion of Baddielphobia. It was almost as if people were determined to prove his point. There’s a blind spot among progressives when it comes to anti-Jewish hatred, said Baddiel. And – boom – there it was, right away, in hateful comment after hateful comment: the blind spot, clear as anything.

    Baddiel first made his case in his sharp polemical book Jews Don’t Count, published last year. He argued, convincingly, that there is a new leftish coalition that fancies itself as being ‘on the right side of history’ but which rarely takes up the cause of Jews.

    It’s not the left as we would have traditionally understood it, he says. It’s more cultural than economic, more into identity than class. But not all identities. There’s one identity group it cold-shoulders, whose experiences of racial hatred it tends to overlook. Jews, they’re just not that into you.

    Baddiel’s book gives numerous examples of prejudicial speech against Jews that just didn’t cause much stir among supposedly anti-racist progressives. Speech that would have had them glued to their computer keyboards, hollering for the evil speaker’s cancellation, had it been aimed at any other ethnic minority.

    None of the rules of identity politics seem to apply to Jews, says Baddiel. Especially the rule that says minorities must be allowed to define and speak about the racism they experience. Jews are excluded from the ‘sacred circle’ of progressive causes, he says.

    This is so obviously the case. I have been in media discussions about anti-Semitism where someone of a leftish persuasion will say, ‘And what about Islamophobia?’. Someone mentions anti-Semitism and they instinctively bark: ‘And black people? Do you care about them?’

    Whenever I write about anti-Semitism I’m inundated with hateful messages. ‘Zio-cuck’ was a recent one. When I wrote about Wiley’s anti-Jewish outbursts people even made the effort of finding my Instagram so that they could tell me what a racist I am. It’s racist to talk about anti-Jewish racism, you see. I can only imagine the bile Jews receive.

    Monday night’s TV version of Baddiel’s book was a great watch. He spoke to Howard Jacobson, David Schwimmer, Sarah Silverman, Miriam Margolyes. They talked about the racist tropes that say Jews run Hollywood and are greedy and deviant. They talked about the racist attacks Jews have been subjected to in recent years. This was important stuff.

    Well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him And the reaction from the right-side-of-history brigade? From those self-styled anti-racists? They mocked it. They ridiculed it. They branded Baddiel a hypocrite. They said that, if anything, Jews are privileged when it comes to discussions about racism. The racist far right talks about ‘Jewish privilege’, the racist radical left talks about the privileging of Jewish suffering. Two cheeks of the same you know what.

    Baddiel-bashing is everywhere right now. You just do not see this with other minority groups. If a black woman made a TV show about anti-black racism, or a young Muslim gave a speech about anti-Muslim bigotry, social media would not be aflame with insults and jibes against those people. But a Jew? Knock yourselves out.

    The weird left seems determined to derail every discussion about anti-Semitism. I cannot remember the last time a Jewish person got to speak about anti-Jewish racism without swarms of identitarians trying to shout them down. Margaret Hodge, Rachel Riley, Luciana Berger, and now Baddiel – all are heckled, all are demonised.

    It feels almost pathological at this stage. A Jew opens his mouth to talk about racism and instantly the Socialism of Fools manifests, with a thousand tweeters wondering out loud when this privileged, moany idiot is going to shut the hell up.

    Derailment has been the name of the game once again following the airing of Baddiel’s doc. The main way they try to derail Baddiel’s commentary on anti-Jewish hate is by reminding him that he used to black-up as footballer Jason Lee on Fantasy Football League 25 years ago.

    It doesn’t matter that Baddiel has apologised for doing this, on more than one occasion, including to Lee personally on Jews Don’t Count. It is still tirelessly raked up. It is played as a Baddiel-silencing trump card. ‘Ha, you’re the real racist’, they say.

    Clearly Baddiel isn’t racist. Clearly he feels no prejudice towards Lee or black people in general. I’m sure many of his detractors know this.

    No matter, for them the old blacking-up story has one aim and one aim only: to delegitimise Baddiel and derail his commentary on anti-Jewish hate. It’s a poisonous silencing tactic.

    So, well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him. Your fury at a Jew for saying Jews don’t count pretty much demonstrates that you think Jews don’t count. Anyone who thought that leftish animus towards the Jews would fade away with the decline of the Corbynista movement was clearly mistaken. That ‘blind spot’ Baddiel highlights is growing and getting nastier. It’s time more proper progressives took a stand against this new appearance of the oldest hatred.
    Is it okay to say I never liked Saint David in his show with Frank Skinner? I’m not saying he isn’t right in his views about his religion, but I saw an interview with Jason Lee recently and he has certainly not forgotten, not sure he has forgiven either - Baddiel’s apology was an awful long time in coming as well apparently.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

      Originally posted by the other bob wilson View Post
      Is it okay to say I never liked Saint David in his show with Frank Skinner? I’m not saying he isn’t right in his views about his religion, but I saw an interview with Jason Lee recently and he has certainly not forgotten, not sure he has forgiven either - Baddiel’s apology was an awful long time in coming as well apparently.
      Lee said that he finally accepted the apology after Baddiel had come to him and spoken directly.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

        Originally posted by lardy View Post
        Lee said that he finally accepted the apology after Baddiel had come to him and spoken directly.
        Former Nottingham Forest striker was subjected to racist bullying on comedian’s Fantasy Football League TV show in the mid-90s


        “Long overdue,” Lee says of the apology. “I’ve had to wait a long time, I’ve always felt I was contactable and there was an opportunity. I thought it was a poor excuse to say he couldn’t get in touch with me. I think he admits embarrassment, shame and the longer it took, the harder it was to have that conversation.”

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

          Originally posted by life on mars View Post
          Reasd and saw the documentraty on Channel 4 good read sad it happeneed at the football with his dad his book is brillant




          By Brendan O’Neill Spectator

          Baddielphobia and the ugly truth about anti-Semitism
          23 November, 2022, 6:54 AM

          David Baddiel could not have asked for better evidence for his thesis that ‘Jews don’t count’ than the online reaction to it.

          Channel 4 broadcast his intelligent and touching documentary this week with that very title – Jews Don’t Count – and instantly there was an explosion of Baddielphobia. It was almost as if people were determined to prove his point. There’s a blind spot among progressives when it comes to anti-Jewish hatred, said Baddiel. And – boom – there it was, right away, in hateful comment after hateful comment: the blind spot, clear as anything.

          Baddiel first made his case in his sharp polemical book Jews Don’t Count, published last year. He argued, convincingly, that there is a new leftish coalition that fancies itself as being ‘on the right side of history’ but which rarely takes up the cause of Jews.

          It’s not the left as we would have traditionally understood it, he says. It’s more cultural than economic, more into identity than class. But not all identities. There’s one identity group it cold-shoulders, whose experiences of racial hatred it tends to overlook. Jews, they’re just not that into you.

          Baddiel’s book gives numerous examples of prejudicial speech against Jews that just didn’t cause much stir among supposedly anti-racist progressives. Speech that would have had them glued to their computer keyboards, hollering for the evil speaker’s cancellation, had it been aimed at any other ethnic minority.

          None of the rules of identity politics seem to apply to Jews, says Baddiel. Especially the rule that says minorities must be allowed to define and speak about the racism they experience. Jews are excluded from the ‘sacred circle’ of progressive causes, he says.

          This is so obviously the case. I have been in media discussions about anti-Semitism where someone of a leftish persuasion will say, ‘And what about Islamophobia?’. Someone mentions anti-Semitism and they instinctively bark: ‘And black people? Do you care about them?’

          Whenever I write about anti-Semitism I’m inundated with hateful messages. ‘Zio-cuck’ was a recent one. When I wrote about Wiley’s anti-Jewish outbursts people even made the effort of finding my Instagram so that they could tell me what a racist I am. It’s racist to talk about anti-Jewish racism, you see. I can only imagine the bile Jews receive.

          Monday night’s TV version of Baddiel’s book was a great watch. He spoke to Howard Jacobson, David Schwimmer, Sarah Silverman, Miriam Margolyes. They talked about the racist tropes that say Jews run Hollywood and are greedy and deviant. They talked about the racist attacks Jews have been subjected to in recent years. This was important stuff.

          Well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him And the reaction from the right-side-of-history brigade? From those self-styled anti-racists? They mocked it. They ridiculed it. They branded Baddiel a hypocrite. They said that, if anything, Jews are privileged when it comes to discussions about racism. The racist far right talks about ‘Jewish privilege’, the racist radical left talks about the privileging of Jewish suffering. Two cheeks of the same you know what.

          Baddiel-bashing is everywhere right now. You just do not see this with other minority groups. If a black woman made a TV show about anti-black racism, or a young Muslim gave a speech about anti-Muslim bigotry, social media would not be aflame with insults and jibes against those people. But a Jew? Knock yourselves out.

          The weird left seems determined to derail every discussion about anti-Semitism. I cannot remember the last time a Jewish person got to speak about anti-Jewish racism without swarms of identitarians trying to shout them down. Margaret Hodge, Rachel Riley, Luciana Berger, and now Baddiel – all are heckled, all are demonised.

          It feels almost pathological at this stage. A Jew opens his mouth to talk about racism and instantly the Socialism of Fools manifests, with a thousand tweeters wondering out loud when this privileged, moany idiot is going to shut the hell up.

          Derailment has been the name of the game once again following the airing of Baddiel’s doc. The main way they try to derail Baddiel’s commentary on anti-Jewish hate is by reminding him that he used to black-up as footballer Jason Lee on Fantasy Football League 25 years ago.

          It doesn’t matter that Baddiel has apologised for doing this, on more than one occasion, including to Lee personally on Jews Don’t Count. It is still tirelessly raked up. It is played as a Baddiel-silencing trump card. ‘Ha, you’re the real racist’, they say.

          Clearly Baddiel isn’t racist. Clearly he feels no prejudice towards Lee or black people in general. I’m sure many of his detractors know this.

          No matter, for them the old blacking-up story has one aim and one aim only: to delegitimise Baddiel and derail his commentary on anti-Jewish hate. It’s a poisonous silencing tactic.

          So, well done everyone for making Baddiel’s case for him. Your fury at a Jew for saying Jews don’t count pretty much demonstrates that you think Jews don’t count. Anyone who thought that leftish animus towards the Jews would fade away with the decline of the Corbynista movement was clearly mistaken. That ‘blind spot’ Baddiel highlights is growing and getting nastier. It’s time more proper progressives took a stand against this new appearance of the oldest hatred.
          I saw the Baddiel documentary and I thought it interesting but not entirely convincing. However he did make some points which I considered to be true.

          However looking at the quote you've brought up I note it's written by Brendan O'Neill. He's never noted for his friendliness towards left wingers. Did he conveniently forget right wing Jewish hatred?

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

            The Spectator ?

            You have got to be kidding ? It's a right wing porn mag

            I don't dislike Baddiel because he Jewish, I dislike him because he's a pretentious media luvvie

            Anyone who abuses him because his parents were Jewish are a waste of space

            If people criticise him because of the way he behaves or what he does then that's fair enough if what he does is wrong

            If he knew Jason Lee was hurt and offended by baddiel blacking up he should have had a private conversation with Lee and apologised if they both felt that was right

            To leave it so long says more about baddiel than it does about Lee

            On the wider issue of criticising zionism which is still very prevalent today it can be done without going down the road of extremism

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

              He's right at least that the left that some of the older board members remember is pretty much gone. Class politics have been ditched in favour of identity politics. Labour is controlled by a metropolitan elite. I guess Corbyn spanned both sides but we saw what Labour did to him.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                Originally posted by Robin Friday's Ghost View Post
                He's right at least that the left that some of the older board members remember is pretty much gone. Class politics have been ditched in favour of identity politics. Labour is controlled by a metropolitan elite. I guess Corbyn spanned both sides but we saw what Labour did to him.
                I pretty much agree with this. There isn't any political party I can support anymore though.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                  Originally posted by Robin Friday's Ghost View Post
                  He's right at least that the left that some of the older board members remember is pretty much gone. Class politics have been ditched in favour of identity politics. Labour is controlled by a metropolitan elite. I guess Corbyn spanned both sides but we saw what Labour did to him.
                  Corbyn and his mates set back the labour party many years

                  The metropolitan elite that you refer to are not perfect but together with the big vote in Wales, Yorkshire etc are the only chance of getting the Tories out

                  Or we can sit on our hands and sit on the opposition benches

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                    Originally posted by Citizen's Nephew View Post
                    I pretty much agree with this. There isn't any political party I can support anymore though.
                    I have one

                    Whoever is standing against the Tories and is not right wing and their election will boot the tories out

                    THAT party gets my vote

                    Labour , Liberal , Independent , Plaid

                    Anyone but the conservatives

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                      Originally posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
                      Corbyn and his mates set back the labour party many years

                      The metropolitan elite that you refer to are not perfect but together with the big vote in Wales, Yorkshire etc are the only chance of getting the Tories out

                      Or we can sit on our hands and sit on the opposition benches
                      What happens after you get the Tories out? Not too bothered?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                        Just to say that a video of the meeting between Lee and Baddiel has been posted on You Tube this week - I’m watching it now and it’s not coming over as some staged event.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                          Originally posted by SLUDGE FACTORY View Post
                          I have one

                          Whoever is standing against the Tories and is not right wing and their election will boot the tories out

                          THAT party gets my vote

                          Labour , Liberal , Independent , Plaid

                          Anyone but the conservatives
                          Fair point Sludge. As Marx said: Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                            Originally posted by the other bob wilson View Post
                            Just to say that a video of the meeting between Lee and Baddiel has been posted on You Tube this week - I’m watching it now and it’s not coming over as some staged event.
                            Wouldn't the fact it's been videod suggest it wasn't totally spontaneous ?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Great Documentary Loves His Footy

                              Originally posted by A Quiet Monkfish View Post
                              Wouldn't the fact it's been videod suggest it wasn't totally spontaneous ?
                              Well, it was never going to be spontaneous. Lee does a podcast, so it was always likely to be videoed and although it all got a bit matey by the end, there was a lot of straight talking by Lee especially to begin with.

                              Comment

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