If someone had told me

[AdrianAlston]

Re: If someone had told me

When i was a young innocent 14/15 yr old regularly going down the City and watching old division 4 dross, that I’d go on to see my team play 5 times at Wembley, including 2 cup finals, I’d have laughed in their face.
Same must apply to Man City fans who were there when they were in the 3rd tier, being told they’d be 2 games from being League, FA cup and European champions.

Well said! The free fall from 2nd Division to 4th during the 80's were bereft of hope. The mid 90's under Kumar/Hibbitt after the short term high of the Rick Wright years were depressing. The Graham Williams relegation season after 5 years of promise and great football was another low. Most of which was witnessed by crowds of circa £3k

A real difference now is the extreme and imbalanced commentary you get on social media.

I'd be happy with lower/mid-table mediocrity this coming season, if we play attractive football and some of the local kids get a chance.

[Father Dougal]

Re: If someone had told me

Nah I disagree with this.

What defines enjoyment and even success in football isn't what level you are at. Eg last season we came much higher in the pyramid than 1993, yet should we be celebrating and praising more so than in 1993? Of course not.

Everton fans should be amongst the happiest around being in the Premier league for so long. Are they? Wrexham should be miserable they are still only league 2.

For me success and enjoyment is pretty much the same at any level. Eg you use man City as an example but their 3rd tier play off final win v Gillingham was probably more exciting and tense than when they win the champions league in a few weeks.

[BLUETIT]

Re: If someone had told me

Imagine being a Tottenham fan 15 years ago being told you would play at Wembley 20 odd times.

Exactly !!!!!

[William Treseder]

Re: If someone had told me

Exactly !!!!!

So many Bellends on here 😁

[William Treseder]

Re: If someone had told me

Man City are 3 games away from the 3 trophies not 2

Aww, you thought the Blackpool game was a cup final. Bless you.

[Carl Dale's Mole]

Re: If someone had told me

I don't see it as 'we were very bad and now we're better".

I see it as "with our population and potential catchment area, we should be nowhere near League One".

That's my belief regardless of how we're doing.

[insider]

Re: If someone had told me

Aww, you thought the Blackpool game was a cup final. Bless you.

No I didn't and you thought Man City were 2 games away from securing 3 trophies.
Bless your cotton socks.

[William Treseder]

Re: If someone had told me

No I didn't and you thought Man City were 2 games away from securing 3 trophies.
Bless your cotton socks.

They are. I know it you know it. The whole footballing world know it 👍

[Feedback]

Re: If someone had told me

Imagine being a Tottenham fan 15 years ago being told you would play at Wembley 20 odd times.

with only one trophy to show for it

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: If someone had told me

The Graham Williams relegation season after 5 years of promise and great football was another low.

Are you sure about this?

I was 4 when Williams was sacked so I know virtually nothing about those times. However, in the 5 seasons before the relegation season of 1982, our two highest finishes were 9th and 15th, having also finished 18th, 19th twice and then 20th to suffer relegation.

In fact, since the 3rd placed finish in 1971 until 1982 we finished in the top half of Division 2 only once more, suffered one relegation in 1975 and finished 17th or lower in Division 2 on 8 occasions. On the face of the stats alone they don't appear to show much promise, so I'm interested to learn more about the club at the time.

Just by way of comparison, between 2006 and 2021 we managed 13 top half finishes in the Championship in 14 seasons. We've never had it so good in this division. In fact, I think 4 bottom half finishes in the last 18 Championship seasons is pretty good going.

[Father Dougal]

Re: If someone had told me

Are you sure about this?

I was 4 when Williams was sacked so I know virtually nothing about those times. However, in the 5 seasons before the relegation season of 1982, our two highest finishes were 9th and 15th, having also finished 18th, 19th twice and then 20th to suffer relegation.

In fact, since the 3rd placed finish in 1971 until 1982 we finished in the top half of Division 2 only once more, suffered one relegation in 1975 and finished 17th or lower in Division 2 on 8 occasions. On the face of the stats alone they don't appear to show much promise, so I'm interested to learn more about the club at the time.

Just by way of comparison, between 2006 and 2021 we managed 13 top half finishes in the Championship in 14 seasons. We've never had it so good in this division. In fact, I think 4 bottom half finishes in the last 18 Championship seasons is pretty good going.

And the only we missed was 2006/07. We came 13th and were about 10 points clear in october. Hardly an awful season.

And yes the years 2001-2021 were a brilliant 20 years really. I know about the 1920s but apart from that have we had a better 20 years?

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: If someone had told me

And the only we missed was 2006/07. We came 13th and were about 10 points clear in october. Hardly an awful season.

And yes the years 2001-2021 were a brilliant 20 years really. I know about the 1920s but apart from that have we had a better 20 years?

I can answer that statistically....

It's easy enough to create a rolling average of our league position for a 20 year period.

For every league position outside the top flight, add the number of teams in the divisions above, so 1st in the Championship would be 21st in the league, 20th in League 1 would be 64th etc. Use those figures then to create an average.

That might not be well explained, but for the seasons 2003/04 to 2022/23, our average league position is 28.5, or 8.5th in the Championship. I think that is mighty impressive for a side that has only spent 2 seasons in the top division. Over the last 20 seasons our average position is actually ranked 25th.

Our highest average position over 20 seasons was from 1947/48 to 1966/67, which was 26.5. We spent 7 seasons out of 10 in the top flight between those seasons but, after relegation in 1962, our Division 2 performances weren't great. In fact, the last 20 seasons and those seasons from the 40s to the end of the 60s have been the best 20 year spells in our history.

Over the last 20 seasons, here's the top 40 teams in terms of rank of average position. I think it puts to bed any notion that we're not currently a big club.

1 Manchester United
2 Chelsea
3 Arsenal
4 Liverpool
5 Manchester City
6 Tottenham Hotspur
7 Everton
8 Newcastle United
9 West Ham United
10 Aston Villa
11 Fulham
12 West Bromwich Albion
13 Southampton
14 Leicester City
15 Stoke City
16 Crystal Palace
17 Wolverhampton Wanderers
18 Middlesbrough
19 Burnley
20 Blackburn Rovers
21 Watford
22 Sunderland
23 Norwich City
24 Birmingham City
25 Cardiff City
26 Reading
27 Wigan Athletic
28 Swansea City
29 Leeds United
30 Bolton Wanderers
31 Queens Park Rangers
32 Derby County
33 Sheffield United
34 Hull City
35 Brighton & Hove Albion
36 Nottingham Forest
37 Ipswich Town
38 Preston North End
39 Charlton Athletic
40 Bristol City

[AdrianAlston]

Re: If someone had told me

Are you sure about this?

I was 4 when Williams was sacked so I know virtually nothing about those times. However, in the 5 seasons before the relegation season of 1982, our two highest finishes were 9th and 15th, having also finished 18th, 19th twice and then 20th to suffer relegation.

In fact, since the 3rd placed finish in 1971 until 1982 we finished in the top half of Division 2 only once more, suffered one relegation in 1975 and finished 17th or lower in Division 2 on 8 occasions. On the face of the stats alone they don't appear to show much promise, so I'm interested to learn more about the club at the time.

Just by way of comparison, between 2006 and 2021 we managed 13 top half finishes in the Championship in 14 seasons. We've never had it so good in this division. In fact, I think 4 bottom half finishes in the last 18 Championship seasons is pretty good going.

I appreciate how it looks statistically, but we played good football under Andrews and Morgan and we made some big signings; Robson, Moore, Kitchen, Robson, Burns, Roberts, Bennett etc. We had some really promising kids; Sayer, Giles, Pontin, Jones, Mickalef, Maddy, Davies and Dibble and we started every season with optimism.

And we had the greatest kit in the history of football kits.

Maybe it was the blind passion of youth (I was 15 when Williams was sacked) but looking back through nostalgic rose tinted spectacles they seemed exciting halcyon days.

There was a strong local influence in the team; the 75-76 promotion winning squad had Dwyer, Showers, Pontin, Attley, Sayer, Giles and Morgan all who had come through the apprentice system as well as Villars and Reece both local lads. We also had the Welsh Captain, Mike England. If you haven't read Paul's excellent book on that year, you should.

[lincoln blue]

Re: If someone had told me

So many Bellends on here 😁

I'll second that!

[A Quiet Monkfish]

Re: If someone had told me

And the only we missed was 2006/07. We came 13th and were about 10 points clear in october. Hardly an awful season.

And yes the years 2001-2021 were a brilliant 20 years really. I know about the 1920s but apart from that have we had a better 20 years?

No. Watching City in front of 1500 I'd accepted that was the way it was always going to be. Rick Wright ignited a momentary spark, but it was Sam Hammam - sorry folks - who started the rollercoaster 2 decades. Promotions, play-offs, cup runs, cup finals, top flight football, some really, really decent players. It's been great. I just hope the club doesn't start slipping back, because that's exactly what it feels like at the moment.