Another Player Linked

[Keyser Soze]

Re: Another Player Linked

strange post. I'm not aware of any legitimate historians that attribute the fall of the greek or Roman empires to a shifting away from conservative values to liberalism, and certainly not linked to any changes in attitude towards homosexuality. is this some bizarre fantasy of your own making?

I can however think of some examples of empires whose cultural conservatism at least has certainly played a part in their own downfall.
take the great Qing for example . for most of recorded human history China has been the most powerful and technologically advanced advanced society at any given time. However the Qing were an extremely conservative Confucian society, that just became more and more obsessed with maintaining and repeating the old ways, be it art, poetry, or the way their society was run.
While they were looking to maintain their past, Europe was undergoing the industrial revolution. when reforms needed to be made in their society, they were usually blocked by conservative Confucian elders. their obsession with an idealised past ultimately brought about their downfall

No, not strange at all. It used to come out in debate in university and pub chat, and clearly linked to statements further up. Only “strange” if you are jumpy about the subject, or if you’re political.

Not a topic of mine as I have no interest. However I did just google it to see why a post made in jest and light hearted was one you jumped on and wanted to make a point-score over. Not knowing anything about it, but wondering what the fuss was about and why you appeared so sensitive about it, I did a quick Google by on “Acceptance of homosexuality in fall of Ancient Greece / Rome / Turkey” and it reveals several historians quoting about it. So clearly there is at least a debate about it, regardless of who is right or wrong. Naturally as ever, it turns into childish and emotional political factions, with “ LQTB pinkos”… versus “right wingers” accusations rather than historians calmly debating facts. That is universities today - turning everything into politics. I’ll be frank with you - I couldn’t give a f-uck. They are all emotional knobs.

You also used to statements that I did not:

1. “Prominent”. I did not say “prominent”. I said “many”. But even a basic google search showed many believe it.

2. “Directly caused fall on empires”. I did not say direct, I said “co-incided”. Co-incidence does not equal causation!

So as I said, this isn’t my subject and I did not particularly care about the politics of it all. It was casual conversation not a history / political academic debate amongst prissy political students. Whether gayness increaes or deceeased, whether it caused empires to fall or not - I couldn’t give a f-uck.

So if you’re looking for a political clash you are free to find one elsewhere, but I care as little for the subject as I do about Swansea City’s squad plans for nsxt season. Enjoy your debate - with someone who cares.