No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

[lardy]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Wales in effect played two host nations in their 4 games.

Agree, but I would say three host nations - Turkey, Italy and Denmark fans were all in the huge majority in our matches. I bet this will be the only time it happens to any country in our lifetimes.

We were unlucky with the draw, or hugely disadvantaged by the system. It depends how generous you want to be with UEFA.

For me, I'm pretty pissed off about it.

[MacAdder]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

How often, in previous World Cups and Euros, has the media made a big deal about where England are staying for the tournament? They give a run down of the base, the facilities, all sorts. We saw the same with the details of the Wales base in France 2016. Preparation is key, the media coverage of preparation details confirm that. How can Turkey, Switzerland and Wales prepare in the same way that England, Italy and Denmark were able to prepare?

Every tournament has one team that has the advantage of being a host. That's a given. Sometimes it is 2. In 2026 it will be 3. But, this tournament? The following teams had home advantage for all three group games.

Group A - Italy played 3 games in Rome
Group B - Denmark played 3 games in Copenhagen. Russia played 2 in St Petersburg
Group C - The Netherlands played 3 games in Amsterdam.
Group D - Scotland played 2 games in Glasgow. England played 3 in London. The Czechs and the Croatians benefitted from having two venues relatively close together
Group E - Spain played 3 games in Sevilla
Group F - Hungary played 2 games in Budapest. Germany played 3 games in Munich.

I am sure the English FA, players, coaches and media would have happily accepted seeing their team have to travel 5000 miles in a little over a week. I am not using it as an excuse, by the way, but I am pointing out that, unlike other tournaments with 1 host nation, Wales in effect played two host nations in their 4 games. I thought we looked tired mentally. Don't forget that there is a 2 hour time difference between Baku and Rome, and a three hour time difference between Baku and Cardiff. It's not THE reason we went out with a whimper, but it's showing the tournament has lost some integrity as the venues (far from benefitting smaller nations) have been benefitting the major nations.

Why couldn't venues be assigned to groups before the groups were drawn (as used to happen in world cups like 1990) ? Group A is London and Glasgow. Group B is Amsterdam and Munich. Group C is Rome and Sevilla. Group D is Copenhagen and St Petersburg. Group E is Bucharest and Budapest. Group F is Baku and St Petersburg.

Well done Germany, you are in group B, as number 1 seeds all three games are in Munich. Hard luck Italy, you are in group A, you won't be in Rome but will be in London and Glasgow and as number 1 seeds, all your games are in Wembley.

Pretty much in a nutshell :thumbup:

[Mr Soul '68]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

To be fair to Page, he wasn’t employed to be manager. The so called manager has let the country down….again.

I think Giggs would have been found out at the Euros too. Just my own thoughts and opinion ....

[Cleve van Leef]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

How often, in previous World Cups and Euros, has the media made a big deal about where England are staying for the tournament? They give a run down of the base, the facilities, all sorts. We saw the same with the details of the Wales base in France 2016. Preparation is key, the media coverage of preparation details confirm that. How can Turkey, Switzerland and Wales prepare in the same way that England, Italy and Denmark were able to prepare?

Every tournament has one team that has the advantage of being a host. That's a given. Sometimes it is 2. In 2026 it will be 3. But, this tournament? The following teams had home advantage for all three group games.

Group A - Italy played 3 games in Rome
Group B - Denmark played 3 games in Copenhagen. Russia played 2 in St Petersburg
Group C - The Netherlands played 3 games in Amsterdam.
Group D - Scotland played 2 games in Glasgow. England played 3 in London. The Czechs and the Croatians benefitted from having two venues relatively close together
Group E - Spain played 3 games in Sevilla
Group F - Hungary played 2 games in Budapest. Germany played 3 games in Munich.

I am sure the English FA, players, coaches and media would have happily accepted seeing their team have to travel 5000 miles in a little over a week. I am not using it as an excuse, by the way, but I am pointing out that, unlike other tournaments with 1 host nation, Wales in effect played two host nations in their 4 games. I thought we looked tired mentally. Don't forget that there is a 2 hour time difference between Baku and Rome, and a three hour time difference between Baku and Cardiff. It's not THE reason we went out with a whimper, but it's showing the tournament has lost some integrity as the venues (far from benefitting smaller nations) have been benefitting the major nations.

Why couldn't venues be assigned to groups before the groups were drawn (as used to happen in world cups like 1990) ? Group A is London and Glasgow. Group B is Amsterdam and Munich. Group C is Rome and Sevilla. Group D is Copenhagen and St Petersburg. Group E is Bucharest and Budapest. Group F is Baku and St Petersburg.

Well done Germany, you are in group B, as number 1 seeds all three games are in Munich. Hard luck Italy, you are in group A, you won't be in Rome but will be in London and Glasgow and as number 1 seeds, all your games are in Wembley.

Excellent post :thumbup:

[surge]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

EURO 2020: How Denmark’s change of formation helped them cruise past Wales into the quarter-finals – tactical analysis

https://totalfootballanalysis.com/ma...alysis-tactics

Think it's fair to say we struggled after Denmark changed formation and didn't have enough of a Plan B. This might be where losing a senior coaching figure really punished us.

But these are the situations we want to be in (forcing an opposition to change tactics because of our bright start) and we need to learn from it.

[blue matt]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

How often, in previous World Cups and Euros, has the media made a big deal about where England are staying for the tournament? They give a run down of the base, the facilities, all sorts. We saw the same with the details of the Wales base in France 2016. Preparation is key, the media coverage of preparation details confirm that. How can Turkey, Switzerland and Wales prepare in the same way that England, Italy and Denmark were able to prepare?

Every tournament has one team that has the advantage of being a host. That's a given. Sometimes it is 2. In 2026 it will be 3. But, this tournament? The following teams had home advantage for all three group games.

Group A - Italy played 3 games in Rome
Group B - Denmark played 3 games in Copenhagen. Russia played 2 in St Petersburg
Group C - The Netherlands played 3 games in Amsterdam.
Group D - Scotland played 2 games in Glasgow. England played 3 in London. The Czechs and the Croatians benefitted from having two venues relatively close together
Group E - Spain played 3 games in Sevilla
Group F - Hungary played 2 games in Budapest. Germany played 3 games in Munich.

I am sure the English FA, players, coaches and media would have happily accepted seeing their team have to travel 5000 miles in a little over a week. I am not using it as an excuse, by the way, but I am pointing out that, unlike other tournaments with 1 host nation, Wales in effect played two host nations in their 4 games. I thought we looked tired mentally. Don't forget that there is a 2 hour time difference between Baku and Rome, and a three hour time difference between Baku and Cardiff. It's not THE reason we went out with a whimper, but it's showing the tournament has lost some integrity as the venues (far from benefitting smaller nations) have been benefitting the major nations.

Why couldn't venues be assigned to groups before the groups were drawn (as used to happen in world cups like 1990) ? Group A is London and Glasgow. Group B is Amsterdam and Munich. Group C is Rome and Sevilla. Group D is Copenhagen and St Petersburg. Group E is Bucharest and Budapest. Group F is Baku and St Petersburg.

Well done Germany, you are in group B, as number 1 seeds all three games are in Munich. Hard luck Italy, you are in group A, you won't be in Rome but will be in London and Glasgow and as number 1 seeds, all your games are in Wembley.

Switzerland did the same Miles as us, Baku twice and Rome, yet tonight they played a extra 30 mins and didnt look overly tired

While the moving about might not have helped us, Switzerland showed tonight it wasnt the greatest handicap either

[surge]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Switzerland did the same Miles as us, Baku twice and Rome, yet tonight they played a extra 30 mins and didnt look overly tired

While the moving about might not have helped us, Switzerland showed tonight it wasnt the greatest handicap either

Switzerland (seeded 2nd in the group, 13th in the world) were able to manage excessive travel better than Wales (seeded 4th, 17th in the world)? Switzerland did have more travel and worse schedule than us but have played two away games whereas we played three.

There were only three groups where the "host" nation didn't finish in top-spot and two of those were won by Fifa's 1st best and 2nd best in the world. Sweden have been the side to truly overcome the odds so far.

The organisation of this tournament has given massive advantage to some and disadvantage to others.

[Cleve van Leef]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

We can analyse everything until s**t turns to gold, at the end of the day we weren’t good enough to go any further in the tournament.

[splott parker]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Osian Roberts was a massive loss to our back room team.

[surge]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Switzerland (seeded 2nd in the group, 13th in the world) were able to manage excessive travel better than Wales (seeded 4th, 17th in the world)? Switzerland did have more travel and worse schedule than us but have played two away games whereas we played three.

There were only three groups where the "host" nation didn't finish in top-spot and two of those were won by Fifa's 1st best and 2nd best in the world. Sweden have been the side to truly overcome the odds so far.

The organisation of this tournament has given massive advantage to some and disadvantage to others.

It could also be said that Switzerland played 2 days later than us in the 16ths against opposition who finished their group stages (in the group of death) 3 days after Wales and Switzerland.

Sure, they handled it better but arguably disadvantage had become equal despite them having extra travel and potentially worst schedule of anyone so far.

[DubaiDai]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Where was this quality? It wasn’t on show today.

Players always tried hard, finally a little “leggy”, which is to be expected.
Tactically naieve, Moore up front on his own, even when we were 2-0 down.
Sorry but Page is out of his depth

[NottinghamBlue]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Nice to read some realism, we qualify for one tournament, do better than anyone could have expected and, based on some of the post match comments on here tonight, some acquire a sense of entitlement totally out of keeping with what being a Wales fan has been historically - the OPs just a wind up merchant mind.

+1, I agree entirely with you Paul.

[willo1927]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Switzerland did the same Miles as us, Baku twice and Rome, yet tonight they played a extra 30 mins and didnt look overly tired

While the moving about might not have helped us, Switzerland showed tonight it wasnt the greatest handicap either

They had a longer rest in-between games.
So not a fair comparison

[Allez Allez Allez]

Re: No Plan A No Plan B -nothing.

Switzerland did the same Miles as us, Baku twice and Rome, yet tonight they played a extra 30 mins and didnt look overly tired

While the moving about might not have helped us, Switzerland showed tonight it wasnt the greatest handicap either

Conveniently forgetting that Switzerland had an extra 48 hours between games. :hehe: