Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

[MacAdder]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

At the time I thought the referee should have given a pelanty.

Having seen the replay, it should have been a pelanty.
The forward was clever, Allen was careless.

Could it be that the interpretation of the rule with the help of VAR varies across Europe?

Or possibly Sky's coverage and the constant dialogue with questioning the decision that goes on for days after such an incident (invariably involving MU, MC, Scousers, Arse and Chelsea).

Wales have been on the wrong end of more than our fair share of this type of decision, it was our time to get one.

[Kind of Blue]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

It’s one of those ones where I think in the English game (or as VAR is now used in the premiership) it’s a pen. It’s a harsh one, one of those ones where I think it probably gets given anywhere else on the pitch but given it wasn’t an egregious kick, the attacking player was moving away from goal and arguably wasn’t in control of the ball himself, the fact it was in the penalty box, would probably have had to send the defender off as a result, in such a game… I can see why it wasn’t given too on the field. It’s a big call VAR or otherwise.

I’m fairly so-so about VAR overall but what it highlights for me is that refereeing is about interpretation and VAR is no different really. We’re seeing just as un-uniform interpretations in the same way we always had with different referees, in different countries, etc. In a way I feel like we’ve sort of ended up in the same place with its introduction.

I’d be disappointed if the boot was on the other foot, no doubt, but I’d also begrudgingly understand and stomach it in the same way as had we played that pre-VAR. Basically, the ref didn’t see enough in it to give it.

The refereeing had good moments, let the game flow and helped make it less bitty than it could have been given the occasion and conditions, although there were some moments where it felt like fouls were being given that I felt should have gone to the other side (both us and Ukraine). After the first couple cards early doors (not helped by James being a hot head), overall think the refereeing was fine.

[Hilts]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

While I think it was a penalty I dont think thats a 2nd yellow.

[Rjk]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

it's the kind of decision I don't think SHOULD be a penalty, but are usually given.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

Leicester playoff 2nd leg. We're 3-1 down. Through ball for Chopra is poor but there's hesitancy in the Leicester defence, Chopra manages to nip in and he's caught, lightly, but there is contact. There was no doubts he was looking for a penalty.

This wasn't too dissimilar a moment in that Allen was hesitant and had the ball pinched off him.

If that had been on Kieffer Moore at the other end we'd have been demanding a penalty.

[WJ99mobile]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

So what is the actual rule?

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

It’s one of those ones where I think in the English game (or as VAR is now used in the premiership) it’s a pen. It’s a harsh one, one of those ones where I think it probably gets given anywhere else on the pitch but given it wasn’t an egregious kick, the attacking player was moving away from goal and arguably wasn’t in control of the ball himself, the fact it was in the penalty box, would probably have had to send the defender off as a result, in such a game… I can see why it wasn’t given too on the field. It’s a big call VAR or otherwise.

I’m fairly so-so about VAR overall but what it highlights for me is that refereeing is about interpretation and VAR is no different really. We’re seeing just as un-uniform interpretations in the same way we always had with different referees, in different countries, etc. In a way I feel like we’ve sort of ended up in the same place with its introduction.

I’d be disappointed if the boot was on the other foot, no doubt, but I’d also begrudgingly understand and stomach it in the same way as had we played that pre-VAR. Basically, the ref didn’t see enough in it to give it.

The refereeing had good moments, let the game flow and helped make it less bitty than it could have been given the occasion and conditions, although there were some moments where it felt like fouls were being given that I felt should have gone to the other side (both us and Ukraine). After the first couple cards early doors (not helped by James being a hot head), overall think the refereeing was fine.

Nathan Blake said during commentary something along the lines of "he's one of those refs, it's more about him than the actual game".

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

So what is the actual rule?

I don't know but perhaps the TV audience should vote on it instead of VAR. 20 seconds to vote 'yes' or 'no'. One lucky voter gets a £10 note sent by drone.

[Kind of Blue]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

Leicester playoff 2nd leg. We're 3-1 down. Through ball for Chopra is poor but there's hesitancy in the Leicester defence, Chopra manages to nip in and he's caught, lightly, but there is contact. There was no doubts he was looking for a penalty.

This wasn't too dissimilar a moment in that Allen was hesitant and had the ball pinched off him.

If that had been on Kieffer Moore at the other end we'd have been demanding a penalty.

Agree we’d be demanding a pen if it was at the other end of the pitch, no question. But I think had it been more like that Chopra incident - with momentum attacking towards goal and more of a challenge than Allen’s was - I think that definitely gets given by the ref on Sunday.

[Kind of Blue]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

Another thing I remember thinking at the time, unless I perhaps missed it or the replays were taking up screen time, I don’t recall Yarmolenko or the Ukrainians massively challenging it on the field, swamping the ref, etc. Which made me feel a little like they perhaps knew themselves it was “one of those ones”. I don’t know. Perhaps given the obvious situation in their country such histrionics may not come as easy.

[Rjk]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

the more I think about it the more I'm convinced it was the correct decision, even if it's the kind of challenge that you will often see given.

if a goalkeeper was going for a punch clearance and an opposition player sneaks in from behind him unseen and sticks his head in the way of the punch as it is about to connect with the ball then it would be really harsh to send the keeper off and award a penalty.

[xsnaggle]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

Eh?
You're saying it was a pen based on an incident in one game TWENTY YEARS AGO!
Apart from this being totally illogical, how many rule changes have there been in the interim.

I remember a similar incident in the Cup Final when Fred Keenor kicked Tunstall in exactly the same way and no pen was given. This proves the Joe Allen incident def wasn't a pen. And VAR didn't over-rule the ref then either.

That was definitely a penalty. Keenor did it deliberately. I saw him wink at the camera when the ref waived play on.

[Tuerto]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

I can't believe people think that was a penalty. What does the ref give if there's a clash of heads in the penalty box between opposition players.one defending, one attacking. The defender, with his eye on the ball totals the attacker. Never meant, no mallice or intent, both players have their eye on the ball. That's a penalty then? What Allen did was exactly the same, but with his foot.

[Bobby Dandruff]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

It would have been harsh as Allen didn't know that the ukrainian was behind him, there was absolutely no intent to make contact with the player who was kicked because Allen didn't know that he actually existed at the point of contact. No penalty.

I agree, and I didn't think that it was a penalty in real time although one of my sons did straight away, but I have seen those exact incidents given as penalties in the Premier League.

[Undercoverinwurzelland]

Re: Did anyone else think that was a penalty...

Was expecting it to be given, regardless of whether it should have been or not.