Riot in Ely

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Originally Posted by BlueArmy 86

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-65687785

CCTV shows police following bike..

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The police may have been following to ensure safety but they could be seen as chasing ?

Wtf are the police doing denying they were involved in this matter before the death of these kids ?

They look very bad now this footage has come to light

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

That van was quite close, and looked like a chase to me, why were they chasing/following them?

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Wether it was an authorised chase or not that will appear as the police on the heels of those two kids

And when they have earlier said they were not involved in the chase and only attended after the crash you can't blame people for being very angry

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Wether it was an authorised chase or not that will appear as the police on the heels of those two kids

And when they have earlier said they were not involved in the chase and only attended after the crash you can't blame people for being very angry

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Yes, it is starting to unfold, those types of electric bikes with a throttle are illegal, I think the police have the power to confiscate and crush them.

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Originally Posted by BlueArmy 86

It was a sur-ron e bike not a scooter, they're dangerously fast and you see a lot of them around Ely.

A lot of Ely residents saying it was a police chase, so who knows. Surprised so many people actually trust south wales police with their track record. They're notoriously the most corrupt force in the UK? I've had a terrible experience with them about 10 years ago, with false statements produced. So I'm not automatically believing there wasn't a chase, My mate who lives in Ely told me about the incident, and the rumour about the police chase/bus involved, a while before the riots broke out. I'll wait for the truth to come out.

The riots are a disgrace by the way, causing more bother for neighbours than the police.

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It always surprises me how quick people are to believe what the police say after an incident, especially considering their track record. Natural reaction to authority figures perhaps?

I've never understood smashing up your own community, the destruction last night was disgusting.

I nearly knocked down a kid on a
electric scooter..
Thety are a fuvking nuisance.
No road tax, no insurance, why is it the fault of the police?
That's their job to keep the likes of these idiots off the roads.
Very sad though for the loss of life, for the parents and for the police who had to scrap the bodies off the floor.

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Originally Posted by dandywarhol

I nearly knocked down a kid on a
electric scooter..
Thety are a fuvking nuisance.
No road tax, no insurance, why is it the fault of the police?
That's their job to keep the likes of these idiots off the roads.
Very sad though for the loss of life, for the parents and for the police who had to scrap the bodies off the floor.

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It's not the fault of the police but it is the job of the police to admit if they were following a vehicle

And they denied that initially

But now they seem to have been caught with their pants down

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Originally Posted by dandywarhol

I nearly knocked down a kid on a
electric scooter..
Thety are a fuvking nuisance.
No road tax, no insurance, why is it the fault of the police?
That's their job to keep the likes of these idiots off the roads.
Very sad though for the loss of life, for the parents and for the police who had to scrap the bodies off the floor.

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It was a matter of time before there was a serious incident with an illegal electric bike/scooter, they have been an accident waiting to happen. I expect there will e a big clampdown on them and illegal unlicensed trial bikes and quad bikes.

The people of Ely have always been revolting

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

It's not the fault of the police but it is the job of the police to admit if they were following a vehicle

And they denied that initially

But now they seem to have been caught with their pants down

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Their statements both this morning and this evening have been carefully worded. For example they have stated they didn't have vehicles on Snowdon road at the time of the crash which could end up meaning they were just in a side street about to turn into Snowdon Road.

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Originally Posted by HiVis

The people of Ely have always been revolting

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Nice line but a bit disparaging. My experience both growing up and later is that some of the best and worst of humanity live cheek by jowl with each other in some of these areas. It's a constant battle for those fantastic people who give a feck about their community to win over those that don't and convert a few along the way.

When my daughter was at Swansea University she had a year in Port Tennant. I remember passing one terraced house where there was a discarded settee in an overgrown front garden. Next door a woman was polishing the front window stones of her spotlessly clean home.

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Originally Posted by PontBlue

Their statements both this morning and this evening have been carefully worded. For example they have stated they didn't have vehicles on Snowdon road at the time of the crash which could end up meaning they were just in a side street about to turn into Snowdon Road.

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they claimed the police car was on grand avenue

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

The police may have been following to ensure safety but they could be seen as chasing ?

Wtf are the police doing denying they were involved in this matter before the death of these kids ?

They look very bad now this footage has come to light

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If we can’t trust the police to tell the truth about the most basic of things, then what hope have we got.

This was a calculated lie. There’s no mistake or rubbish about the police being in a different road. They thought they could get away with it so gave it a go.

To then say they can’t answer questions because the press office closed at 5pm…wow

What happened after is completely separate.

Many people don’t trust politicians, police, health leaders, what’s left?

Some of my best mates from following cardiff city are from Ely (Millbank) they are the some of the kindest and most loyal friends I’ve ever met.

Not sure why hivis would post such a moronic thing

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Originally Posted by EastbourneBlue

If we can’t trust the police to tell the truth about the most basic of things, then what hope have we got.

This was a calculated lie. There’s no mistake or rubbish about the police being in a different road. They thought they could get away with it so gave it a go.

To then say they can’t answer questions because the press office closed at 5pm…wow

What happened after is completely separate.

Many people don’t trust politicians, police, health leaders, what’s left?

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Well said.

Plenty of good people in Ely, I'm there most days working, lots of unseen good work going on in the community. I'd prefer to concentrate on those people, although in defence of Hivis's poor attempt at humour, I do think that he was joking, a play on words, I'm sure it's feedy, and I don't think that he's like that.

There's been a suggestion that they were hit by a bus.
Only seen an early tweet, can't imagine it being true and the bus co (prob Cardiff Bus) not saying something.
And don't all busses have dashcams these days?

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

It's not the fault of the police but it is the job of the police to admit if they were following a vehicle

And they denied that initially

But now they seem to have been caught with their pants down

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Following a vehicle and chasing a vehicle are two completely different things though aren't they?

I've not been following this too much, but how long before they crashed was the cctv footage showing a police van behind them?

Also, the sooner there's a total ban on electric/motorised scooters and bikes(or at least massive fines for people riding them like massive *****) the better for everyone.

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Originally Posted by nomad blue

Following a vehicle and chasing a vehicle are two completely different things though aren't they?

I've not been following this too much, but how long before they crashed was the cctv footage showing a police van behind them?

Also, the sooner there's a total ban on electric/motorised scooters and bikes(or at least massive fines for people riding them like massive *****) the better for everyone.

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supposedly the video clip that has been shared was taken at 5:59 and the crash occurred at 6pm about 100 metres from the position of the camera

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Originally Posted by Rjk

supposedly the video clip that has been shared was taken at 5:59 and the crash occurred at 6pm about 100 metres from the position of the camera

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They were chasing them, absolutely crazy. These young lads had no protective gear on, and two of them on the bike. The police would have known who they were and could have caught up with them a bit later on quite easily. Some of these coppers are ****ing arseholes, on one for some reason, plenty of decent coppers as well. I had an experience a few weeks back in Ely with three armed police officers in balaclavas, not saying it wasn't merited, but they go in heavy up there, and often.

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Originally Posted by bobh

There's been a suggestion that they were hit by a bus.
Only seen an early tweet, can't imagine it being true and the bus co (prob Cardiff Bus) not saying something.
And don't all busses have dashcams these days?

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There was a (blurred out) still from a video apparently showing officers giving cpr to the boys. Next to them was a bus. I'd imagine anything recorded by the bus has been handed over.

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Originally Posted by EastbourneBlue

If we can’t trust the police to tell the truth about the most basic of things, then what hope have we got.

This was a calculated lie. There’s no mistake or rubbish about the police being in a different road. They thought they could get away with it so gave it a go.

To then say they can’t answer questions because the press office closed at 5pm…wow

What happened after is completely separate.

Many people don’t trust politicians, police, health leaders, what’s left?

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Alun Micheal was on the radio this morning saying there was no police chase .

Let's be fair here .....if a big cheese in the police is asked if police officers were chasing ....or following ...or whatever.... 2 youngsters who later died then if asked that question ......which the community were asking .....then surely you say the youngsters were being chased .....or the youngsters were being followed by officers ?

There's your chance

Not oh right well you didn't actually specifically ask us that !?

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Originally Posted by nomad blue

Following a vehicle and chasing a vehicle are two completely different things though aren't they?

I've not been following this too much, but how long before they crashed was the cctv footage showing a police van behind them?

Also, the sooner there's a total ban on electric/motorised scooters and bikes(or at least massive fines for people riding them like massive *****) the better for everyone.

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That's why the police should straight away have said .....the victims were being followed by officers in a van

But they came out with a load of cobblers and clearly people had seen the incident and saw the police behind the kids

Legally there is a difference between a police chase and a van keeping up to speed with two kids on a scooter but it seems the police havnt been straight here or some would call it lying

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

Yes, it is starting to unfold, those types of electric bikes with a throttle are illegal, I think the police have the power to confiscate and crush them.

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They’re not illegal and there are numerous agents selling them throughout the UK. If you have £5k spare you could buy one tomorrow . The standard version is restricted to 30mph (no license required) but a derestricted one is capable of 50mph, they’re basically treated as a moped or scooter, as regards to licensing requirements, therefore helmets are a legal requirement.

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Originally Posted by nomad blue

Also, the sooner there's a total ban on electric/motorised scooters and bikes(or at least massive fines for people riding them like massive *****) the better for everyone.

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They’re a mode of transport used by millions daily across Europe and now in major cities in the UK. I used one in Berlin a couple of weekends ago (there are 20+ on every corner) & Gdańsk last weekend. They’re here to stay and will become more prolific. Of course there are ****** users but that applies to every mode of transport.

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Originally Posted by Des Parrot

They’re not illegal and there are numerous agents selling them throughout the UK. If you have £5k spare you could buy one tomorrow . The standard version is restricted to 30mph (no license required) but a derestricted one is capable of 50mph, they’re basically treated as a moped or scooter, as regards to licensing requirements, therefore helmets are a legal requirement.

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And so are tax, insurance and a number plate. So are mostly ridden in an illegal manner.

So stupid for the police to lie about this. It was either a bare faced lie, or more likely a statement made when the person making it didn't have all information available. Instead of saying they don't know, they've blustered.

If the police were following them, it was probably justified. But that's all been lost behind the lie now.

Sheer incompetence by the police.

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Originally Posted by chrisp_1927

So stupid for the police to lie about this. It was either a bare faced lie, or more likely a statement made when the person making it didn't have all information available. Instead of saying they don't know, they've blustered.

If the police were following them, it was probably justified. But that's all been lost behind the lie now.

Sheer incompetence by the police.

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I don't know whether they were lying or not, but they've been extremely selective and careful with their wording.

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Originally Posted by The Bloop

I don't know whether they were lying or not, but they've been extremely selective and careful with their wording.

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extremely selective and careful with wording - to try to misrepresent what happened. in other words , lying

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Originally Posted by The Bloop

I don't know whether they were lying or not, but they've been extremely selective and careful with their wording.

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Very true. Seems like they are trying to be a bit clever, but don't realise that people can see right through them.

Makes me feel very sorry for the police officers who were in that van. They'll probably be hung out to dry when the senior officers try and cover themselves.

I wish people would stop calling it an e-scooter. These "kids" were riding a £4k electric bike. You know, one of those things everyone who lives in one of the most deprived parts of Wales has. :shrug:

Also a little ironic that this happened on Snowden considering why Snowdon road is walled off by the Wilson Road junction. Time is a flat circle.

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Originally Posted by Des Parrot

They’re not illegal and there are numerous agents selling them throughout the UK. If you have £5k spare you could buy one tomorrow . The standard version is restricted to 30mph (no license required) but a derestricted one is capable of 50mph, they’re basically treated as a moped or scooter, as regards to licensing requirements, therefore helmets are a legal requirement.

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UK laws do not allow any electric bike with twist-and-go throttle. A throttle assist allows users to thrust the bike forward using the turning motion on the handlebar.

The UK only permits electric bikes that have a pedal-assist motor.

https://eskute.co.uk/blogs/news/elec...assist%20motor.

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Originally Posted by Des Parrot

They’re not illegal and there are numerous agents selling them throughout the UK. If you have £5k spare you could buy one tomorrow . The standard version is restricted to 30mph (no license required) but a derestricted one is capable of 50mph, they’re basically treated as a moped or scooter, as regards to licensing requirements, therefore helmets are a legal requirement.

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UK laws do not allow any electric bike with twist-and-go throttle. A throttle assist allows users to thrust the bike forward using the turning motion on the handlebar.

The UK only permits electric bikes that have a pedal-assist motor.

https://eskute.co.uk/blogs/news/elec...assist%20motor.

Pedal assist is legal until you chip them or move the magnet to derestrict them, although harder to spot because they look more like a normal bike and you still have to pedal.

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Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays

Nice line but a bit disparaging. My experience both growing up and later is that some of the best and worst of humanity live cheek by jowl with each other in some of these areas. It's a constant battle for those fantastic people who give a feck about their community to win over those that don't and convert a few along the way.

When my daughter was at Swansea University she had a year in Port Tennant. I remember passing one terraced house where there was a discarded settee in an overgrown front garden. Next door a woman was polishing the front window stones of her spotlessly clean home.

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It was only a little word play.

And I did part of my growing up in Ely, Highbury Road and pethybridge Road.

And I agree about the community spirit, the Ely festival was slways something we looked forward to as kids

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

Alun Micheal was on the radio this morning saying there was no police chase .

Let's be fair here .....if a big cheese in the police is asked if police officers were chasing ....or following ...or whatever.... 2 youngsters who later died then if asked that question ......which the community were asking .....then surely you say the youngsters were being chased .....or the youngsters were being followed by officers ?

There's your chance

Not oh right well you didn't actually specifically ask us that !?

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He's a Labour politician, surely he couldn't have been telling lies?

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

He's a Labour politician, surely he couldn't have been telling lies?

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All politicians are capable of fibbing

Especially the Tories you vote for

This morning he's said that this footage was taken 5 minutes before the crash ?

It's 1 minute before the crash

So up to one minute before the fatality the youngsters were being tailed by the police

If the police had said from the start officers in a van were following 2 youths on a scooter in Ely until 1 minute before the crash .....to which police officers attended ...

What's difficult about that ?

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

UK laws do not allow any electric bike with twist-and-go throttle. A throttle assist allows users to thrust the bike forward using the turning motion on the handlebar.

The UK only permits electric bikes that have a pedal-assist motor.

https://eskute.co.uk/blogs/news/elec...assist%20motor.

Pedal assist is legal until you chip them or move the magnet to derestrict them, although harder to spot because they look more like a normal bike and you still have to pedal.

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This says legal as a motorbike with all the rules that go with that- https://www.ginebikes.com/post/are-t...k#viewer-fd25t

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Originally Posted by SLUDGE FACTORY

All politicians are capable of fibbing

Especially the Tories you vote for

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What you think he lied about something as important as that, shocking if you are right.

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Originally Posted by North Cardiff Blue

What you think he lied about something as important as that, shocking if you are right.

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Well it's at best misinformation

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Originally Posted by Des Parrot

They’re a mode of transport used by millions daily across Europe and now in major cities in the UK. I used one in Berlin a couple of weekends ago (there are 20+ on every corner) & Gdańsk last weekend. They’re here to stay and will become more prolific. Of course there are ****** users but that applies to every mode of transport.

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Been a feature in Spain for a few years. After 1 lady was killed in Madrid, within days local councils were given powers to create laws for their cities.
In Barcelona they are only allowed in the cycle lane, no pavement (bikes are allowed on pavements wider than 3.5 meters for example), absolutely no roads, 1 person per scooter, and a helmet is needed. Still loads of c0cks wizzing around but i know so many people with 200 euro fines for no helmet and a few 400/500 euro fines for riding in the bus lane. They are not allowed on any other forms of public transport (Tram, Metro, Train etc)

They make perfect sense in Barcelona as the city has the infrastructure and weather for it, plus an increasing need to reduce traffic and pollution.