Labour really are proving that fighting internal battles is more important for them than Governing the country.
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Labour really are proving that fighting internal battles is more important for them than Governing the country.
Promoted to envoy for regions and nations.
Nothing is ever black or white 😂Quote:
Originally Posted by the other bob wilson
Something is up if she has left. I think a lot of Labour MPs are a little miffed that she was seemingly parachuted in and has a lot of power. I can see their point to an extent.
Either way she should be pleased with her service. Her report largely saw to the end of Boris Johnson and set the Tories in downfall. She then got the Labour gig (a total coincidence) and managed to get her son on the candidate list and he is now an elected MP! (another coincidence).
I think her report was probably fair tbh, but her going straight to Labour stank and her son becoming an MP seems a little bit of an example of nepotism to me.
I do love a good coincidence theory.Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
Ha, touche!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
Nothing like a bit of post-hoc coincidence revisionism.Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
It was no coincidence that Johnson's apalling behaviour came under increasing scrutiny, indeed he brought it all on his own head. I remember giving you a previous challenge on which bits of the Gray report were biased so we could discuss. Met with silence.
Johnson lost office because he was frivolous and uncaring about the laws he put in place. He lied about his behaviour to Parliament, stuck up for a Whip who was a drunken letch and lost the support of his Parliamentary Party and Ministers such that he resigned in ignomy.
Starmer's judgement in appointing Gray to his office shows serious errors of his own judgement but your join the dots bit suggests you are still in denial about Johnson's justifiable defenestration by his own party!
Have Labour lost 12 seats already since the election through various by elections or people standing down?
I can never understand why people don't google "Have Labour lost 12 seats already since the election through various by elections or people standing down?" and see whether they are right or wrong. Spoiler alert........wrong!Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
No but I think the Tories have lost any chance of getting back into power any time soon. Clouds and silver linings and all that.Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
Seems you missed the bit where I said her report was probably fair there and went into full on Cyril chatbot mode!Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
If only you had reached that conclusion at the time, eh!Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
When the facts change..Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
Irrespective, why don't you respond to the substance of what I said? It's grubby isn't it?
https://www.ccmb.co.uk/showthread.ph...=1#post5435068Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
I addressed Starmer's naivety in appointing Gray earlier. I don't understand why he thought she was a political fit as Chief of Staff. It looks like a mix of her own personality, Simon Case, (a toxic hangover from the Johnson era who Gray definitely hit in her report) and a feisty cabal of SPADs did for her.
Still as long as you continue to think her report was biased who are we to throw stones?
I quite literally said it was probably okay. But to be honest, if an independent judge then jumps ship to one side of the divide and it then turns out her son is so committed a Labour supporter that he then gets to stand as an MP, it does naturally raise questions.Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
It absolutely would for you if the situation were reversed.
Personally, I think it stinks that she joined Labour so quickly and it stinks even more that her son got to stand. Sorry!
At the time she jumped you quite literally said "The Sue Gray report probably suffered from some kind of bias." What changed your mind since?Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
You are very good, if a little creepy, at dragging these things up, but perhaps you can post the full quote so I can comment?Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
Either way, I've said the report is fine.
Since then she has joined a political party and has seen her son (who was previously head of a uni Labour society) stand for and be elected for Labour.
You know full well that isn't the height of independence, I don't know why you pretend otherwise?
Your views were in the embedded link earlier. When I said " I remember giving you a previous challenge on which bits of the Gray report were biased so we could discuss. Met with silence." that was later in the post.Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
What her son does is spurious. She surrendered her independence when she stopped being a civil servant and took Starmer's shilling. She is now a political appointee and got treated like one.
I can't recall suggesting that she was a paragon of independence. Just that the report she wrote lacked bias. A view you have latterly come around to it seems!
You should re-read what I first wrote on this thread Cyril. It seems quite understandable why she is divisive as our little exchange demonstrates.Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
Its entirely understandable why people would question her independence in light of what has happened since too.
I did.Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
It was this bit that stuck out and we seem to have come full circle,
Either way she should be pleased with her service. Her report largely saw to the end of Boris Johnson and set the Tories in downfall. She then got the Labour gig (a total coincidence) and managed to get her son on the candidate list and he is now an elected MP! (another coincidence).
Like I said in my reposte there are a couple of things going on with that statement. Bit of innuendo that the report and its outcome was a nudge nudge wink wink part of a get Boris plan (Touche etc) and your usual disclaimer that the report was fair. Which you obviously have reflected on since you first commented.
Theres no nudge nudge wink wink about it. Boris likely made mistakes over Covid and any reasonable minded independent person would probably find that.Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
In addition, any reasonably minded independent person probably doesn't jump ship to an extremely prominent position within one party soon after and their son probably wouldn't likely be put forward as as a candidate for said party.
Was the report fair? Probably.
Is she politically biased? Probably.
Either way, quite clear to see why she has upset people inside and outside of the party. She was a politically unwise appointment and I think I said that at the time.
You could easily turn the tables if you are so inclined, as there is a huge pile of steaming shyte just waiting to be rediscovered. Personally, I would recommend the easier option of putting the weirdos on ignore :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesWales
No - don’t say that. I’m sure James really enjoys your posts. He’d be bereft with you on ignore!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wales-Bales
I can never understand why people waste their lives getting involved with politics but hey ho….enjoy!Quote:
Originally Posted by cyril evans awaydays
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-s...uol65TipHoRXVQ
Quote:
Originally Posted by goats
You think losing 12 Council seats supports the point you were trying to make? Perhaps you should read below the headline!