Peterborough United and Solihull Moors, but not Cardiff City it seems.

Ironically, Peterborough were pretty negative in their Play Off Semi Final first leg at Oxford on Friday, but something the commentator said during the game resonated with me when looked at through a Cardiff City context. It seems Peterborough have six players who are in double figures for goals scored this season. I finally got around to checking it this morning and it's correct.

https://www.sportsmole.co.uk/footbal...p-scorers.html

Okay, it's for goals in all competitions and Peterborough have played an awful lot of cup games this season, but they had four who got to ten and more in their forty six league games - have we had four who have scored ten plus in a league season in the last decade?

Peterborough have been a free scoring team for ages, but they also seem to have a permanently dodgy defence. Going back to our Championship winning 12/13 season, Peterborough did the double over us and got relegated, but that team had really good attacking players in Lee Tomlin, Dwight Gayle and George Boyd - you go back over the past fifteen years or so and Peterborough have had a lot of strikers who were signed by other club s after they'd scored stack of goals for them.

I sometimes say it's in City's DNA that they have to play with a big, target man striker and you look at a club like Peterborough and think it's in their DNA to be high scoring - that match we were 4-0 up at half time and ended up drawing was so typically Peterborough.

Similarly, I was struck by the sort of football played by fifth tier Solihull Moors yesterday in such a high pressure game at Wembley - they passed the ball really well and, having seen them play a couple of times before that this season, I can confirm that's how they always set out to play.

My point is that if Solihull and Peterborough can do what they do, why have Cardiff found it virtually impossible to make the transition to being a proper passing side rather than the unconvincing imitators we always are and why do we find it so hard to, first, score goals and, second, sign strikers capable of scoring them in decent numbers?

Would the likes of Gayle, Mackail-Smith, Assombolonga etc have been able to score goals for Cardiff at the rate they did for Peterborough? I think the answer is no because, somehow, we're not that kind of club and, for some reason, we seem to have a problem adopting to the way the game is played by most teams these days as well.

As to why that should be, I don't see that you can blame managers because we've had so many of them in recent years and, apart from Neil Harris with Kieffer Moore, we've not been able to find a consistent goalscorer. I refuse to believe that every striker, apart from Moore, we've signed in the last seven or eight years is crap - there's definitely something about Cardiff City that makes it a more challenging place to play striker than many other clubs.

How on earth can a side have six players who score ten plus in a season, pluck players out of non league on a regular basis who don't have a problem finding the back of the net in the EFL and we can't come up with more than one every five years or so?

I feel your pain Bob. When you think of some of the prolific strikers we’ve had, and not in the too distant past, it seems a million miles away from what we’ve had to put up with recently.
Can it be put down to Tan simply losing all interest in us ? Are there really no footballing people at the helm of our club? Is our scouting system not up to much? I watch other teams in the championship, and lower down the pyramid, and many whilst not being very successful, can play or at least they try to play an expansive game, and seem to have a game plan.
That saying, I watched the Oxford/ Peterborough game on Saturday, and whilst Oxford started off right on the front foot, they just seemed to run out of ideas and energy in the 2nd half. I still expect them to start the away game on the front foot though.
Talking about prolific City strikers, when I was a kid, I lived 3 doors down to the one and only Stanley Verdun Richards.
He held the goal scoring record in one season for us, right up till Earnie beat it in 2003.

Moore's the only player to get into double figures for us in the last 6 seasons.

Aside from us, Huddersfield, Millwall, QPR, Rotherham, Wednesday, Stoke and the Jacks finished with a top scorer in single figures.

No sure either is a good example, both those teams lost the games you referred to!

I was discussing this very topic with a friend a couple of weeks ago. If you google the list of strikers that Peterborough have brought in, and then sold on, over the years - it's pretty incredible.

I can't stand Barry Fry, but he has clearly established a great set of contacts in non-league, and also with Man Utd and some London clubs who would direct players his way.

This is the sort of thing you get with an experienced director of football who has made, and kept, influential friends across the UK football network.

Don't worry, we have Dalman working feverishly to get the right people in....

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Originally Posted by Crisp White Lines

I was discussing this very topic with a friend a couple of weeks ago. If you google the list of strikers that Peterborough have brought in, and then sold on, over the years - it's pretty incredible.

I can't stand Barry Fry, but he has clearly established a great set of contacts in non-league, and also with Man Utd and some London clubs who would direct players his way.

This is the sort of thing you get with an experienced director of football who has made, and kept, influential friends across the UK football network.

Don't worry, we have Dalman working feverishly to get the right people in....

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Barry Fry like Warnock - if he is your manager / DoF you love him if not you hate him.
Fact of the matter is - he is a character, loves football, talks a lot of sh1t, has a proven successful record in finding players etc. The game needs more like him not less of them

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Originally Posted by Don Corleone

No sure either is a good example, both those teams lost the games you referred to!

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Well, my reply to that would be that it’s only half time in the Pererborough tie really and Solihull only lost on penalties. I started the thread to ask a question as to why Peterborough clearly place a lot of emphasis on attacking play, to the detriment of their team you could say, and why Solihull seem to place such an emphasis on a passing game at a level where the temptation must be to be physical and lump it forewarn like we did for much of the last decade?

This time last year, Peterborough were 4-0 up after the first leg of their Play Off Semi Final, yet still lost. I can remember thinking that the tie was not quite over because Peterborough are the sort of team they are - on the other hand, despite what happened at Peterborough all those years ago, I’d always back City to see out a two leg tie where they were four goals up from the first leg - our problem of course is that we’d never get four goals clear in the first place!

Whereas a Peterborough, and plenty of other teams in the 92, would go looking for third, a fourth or a fifth goal when they went 2-0 up, City are far more concerned with holding on to what they have - in fact, our attitude changes markedly when we go one up, why should this be?

Eric produced an incredible stat a while back about us only having scored five goals or more in a league game once in the last decade (ironically against a Rotherham team on their way to relegation). Do we struggle to sign quality strikers because we don’t do enough attacking and we place more emphasis on work rate and tracking back or do we, in fact, sign good strikers, but we’re set up in a way that makes it a lot harder for them to prosper?

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Originally Posted by Crisp White Lines

I was discussing this very topic with a friend a couple of weeks ago. If you google the list of strikers that Peterborough have brought in, and then sold on, over the years - it's pretty incredible.

I can't stand Barry Fry, but he has clearly established a great set of contacts in non-league, and also with Man Utd and some London clubs who would direct players his way.

This is the sort of thing you get with an experienced director of football who has made, and kept, influential friends across the UK football network.

Don't worry, we have Dalman working feverishly to get the right people in....

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I think you’re right about Barry Fry - in my first post I said Peterborough have had a very attacking mentality for fifteen years, it’s probably longer than that actually, and the one constant at the club during that time has been Barry Fry.

Regarding Mehmet Dalman, I can remember him saying when we appointed Erol Bulut that our new manager finds ways to win tight games. Having had a season of watching a Bulut team now, I can see exactly what Dalman meant and I’m not saying that it’s a bad thing (in fact, I dread to think where we’d be without it), but it’s also a typical Cardiff attitude since the departure of Dave Jones - sneaking single goal wins in games where we’ve not deserved the three points has almost become the only way we can win.

Even a half-decent forward would struggle at City - due to poor supply.
However, the posse of Meite, Etete, Diedhiou and, sadly, this season's version of Robinson wouldn't put fear into any defence.

At the moment, the midfield has no outlet forward. Not having an outlet forward doesn't just limit attacking options - it puts pressure on the midfield to hold on to the ball, it means we lose the ball easily when we do try to pass it forward, and it ends up leaving us open to counter-attacks, when our attack breaks down.
In fact, you could lay a lot of the blame for our awful style of football on the lack of decent forwards. We don't push midfielders forward, because we're afraid of losing the ball, whenever it's passed towards our teflon strikers. They hold on to it for ages, looking for a pass or cross that might actually stick. Even if we signed just two players this summer, and they were both decent strikers who could hold up the ball, then we'd probably have a pretty good side.

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Originally Posted by tforturton

Even if we signed just two players this summer, and they were both decent strikers who could hold up the ball, then we'd probably have a pretty good side.

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Probably not. The defence would still be porous and the midfield would still be dire. And both would still be slow. Those are not the ingredients of a pretty good side at this level.

I’m not convinced by this keeper either, but that’s another story.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Crisp White Lines

I was discussing this very topic with a friend a couple of weeks ago. If you google the list of strikers that Peterborough have brought in, and then sold on, over the years - it's pretty incredible.

I can't stand Barry Fry, but he has clearly established a great set of contacts in non-league, and also with Man Utd and some London clubs who would direct players his way.

This is the sort of thing you get with an experienced director of football who has made, and kept, influential friends across the UK football network.

Don't worry, we have Dalman working feverishly to get the right people in....

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Mainly into his car sales show room in London

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Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

Probably not. The defence would still be porous and the midfield would still be dire. And both would still be slow. Those are not the ingredients of a pretty good side at this level.

I’m not convinced by this keeper either, but that’s another story.

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I'm not convinced by Horvath. I don't know if this is correct but it seems like the defence got worse once Alnwick got injured.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

why have Cardiff found it virtually impossible to make the transition to being a proper passing side rather than the unconvincing imitators we always are

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It'll be unpopular but I don't want us to become a proper passing side in the ilk of Swansealona.

Just listened to the Monday night podcast where it was said Blackburn had “developed” Sammy Szmodics. In fact, Szmodics started at Colchester, went to the wurzels where he played a grand total of three league matches before signing for, wait for it, Peterborough United , who sold him for a seven figure fee to Blackburn. There are several times through Szmodic’s career when we could have signed him because the fees he’s gone for have not been huge, but we don’t tend to make signings like that from the lower divisions, yet on the rare occasions when we did, we’ve ended with Ng, Wintle and Adams, three players who I’ve heard it said we’re going to cash in on to raise cash for new players during the summer.

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Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman

It'll be unpopular but I don't want us to become a proper passing side in the ilk of Swansealona.

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Neither do I, it’s not as if the choice is play hoofball or like Swansea did under Russell Martin, there’s a huge grey area in between those two extremes.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Neither do I, it’s not as if the choice is play hoofball or like Swansea did under Russell Martin, there’s a huge grey area in between those two extremes.

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442

Fast full backs
Beasts at CH
One dog in the middle
One playmaker
Speedsters on the wing
Big man little man combo up top.

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Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman

442

Fast full backs
Beasts at CH
One dog in the middle
One playmaker
Speedsters on the wing
Big man little man combo up top.

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I'll always say it, the first year of Neil Warnock's time with us was a very pleasant surprise to me.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I'll always say it, the first year of Neil Warnock's time with us was a very pleasant surprise to me.

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There were some great displays, destroyed ‘name’ teams with some outstanding football, then Warnock realised ‘F*ck me, we got a chance of going up here’. It became a bit more pragmatic & safety first then.

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Originally Posted by Harry Paget Flashman

442

Fast full backs
Beasts at CH
One dog in the middle
One playmaker
Speedsters on the wing
Big man little man combo up top.

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so Dave Jones style?

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Originally Posted by Rjk

so Dave Jones style?

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Saw the best football in my lifetime, and some of the best players we’ve had with Jones at the helm. I still say if we’d have beaten Blackpool that day, there would have been no rebrand and we may have had a good few seasons in the sun.
A real pity as he’d managed to get promotions for both Wolves and Sheff Weds.

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Originally Posted by Rjk

so Dave Jones style?

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100%.

It’s now ingrained into coaches taking their badges. I’ve observed Paul Michael, now manager at Merthyr. His mantra during training is very clear and simple. I watch City pre-match warm up sessions and the emphasis is totally different,casual, low key & individual focussed, very similar to the 90 minutes that follows.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

Just listened to the Monday night podcast where it was said Blackburn had “developed” Sammy Szmodics. In fact, Szmodics started at Colchester, went to the wurzels where he played a grand total of three league matches before signing for, wait for it, Peterborough United , who sold him for a seven figure fee to Blackburn. There are several times through Szmodic’s career when we could have signed him because the fees he’s gone for have not been huge, but we don’t tend to make signings like that from the lower divisions, yet on the rare occasions when we did, we’ve ended with Ng, Wintle and Adams, three players who I’ve heard it said we’re going to cash in on to raise cash for new players during the summer.

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"cash in" on Wintle ?

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Originally Posted by A Quiet Monkfish

"cash in" on Wintle ?

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I rate Wintle more highly than many on here do and I’d say there are Championship sides who were willing to pay a decent fee. He was, rightly, nominated man of the match in our win over Ipswich which has to be a candidate for our best win of the season - it’s not his fault that the current manager thinks he can be a number 10 at this level and we keep on signing players who don’t give us a balanced midfield.

I was repeating what I heard others saying, but the truth is, I agree with them.

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Originally Posted by the other bob wilson

I think you’re right about Barry Fry - in my first post I said Peterborough have had a very attacking mentality for fifteen years, it’s probably longer than that actually, and the one constant at the club during that time has been Barry Fry.

Regarding Mehmet Dalman, I can remember him saying when we appointed Erol Bulut that our new manager finds ways to win tight games. Having had a season of watching a Bulut team now, I can see exactly what Dalman meant and I’m not saying that it’s a bad thing (in fact, I dread to think where we’d be without it), but it’s also a typical Cardiff attitude since the departure of Dave Jones - sneaking single goal wins in games where we’ve not deserved the three points has almost become the only way we can win.

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More often than not he brings on attacking players as substitutes, and tries to win tight games rather than bring on defenders to draw, 70 mins on are usually the best part of our games, but probably not great if you like to leave on 85 minutes, like quite a few seem to do.

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Originally Posted by William Treseder

Saw the best football in my lifetime, and some of the best players we’ve had with Jones at the helm. I still say if we’d have beaten Blackpool that day, there would have been no rebrand and we may have had a good few seasons in the sun.
A real pity as he’d managed to get promotions for both Wolves and Sheff Weds.

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Bothroyd injury cost us that final.

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Originally Posted by A Quiet Monkfish

"cash in" on Wintle ?

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Now is the Wintle of our discontent?

Peterborough’s “ attacking intent” wasn’t very much evident in last nights game, though they came close to an equaliser when they threw on a big man and started lumping the ball into the box in injury time!