The state of Cardiff's housing market as prices grow twice as fast as wages

[LeningradCowboy]

Maybe the world has changed since I stopped working in public housing 7 years ago - but at that time developers were definitely land banking, and (along with their supporters in the Tory Party) blaming planning regs. No doubt planning systems and regs can be improved, but my experience was they were put up as an excuse for developers wanting greenfield sites not brownfield, and resisting requirements to include section 106 affordable housing in some developments. It was mostly a smokescreen to maximise profits.

Councils do not build council housing because they are unable to fund them (despite the self-financing Housing Revenue Acount reforms of a decade ago) and because they will still be subject to Right To Buy - meaning the public (councils and remaining tenants) will continue to subsidise a section of new owner occupiers. Mass social house building is needed now.

The other recent factor affecting housing costs and supply - and a reason for owner occupation in the UK dropping from over 70% in 2003 to under 65% now - is the 'buy to rent' phenomena. Vast numbers of homes - new build and ex RTB council in particular - have been hoovered up by the new breed of landlord who then push up rents and collect from the affluent who can afford them, or those on housing benefits (so the state, or taxpayers, have to afford them) for those that can't. People in the middle get squeezed.

This is what happens when housing is seen as an investment asset, for personal or company benefit, not as a home. That mindset is much more prevalent in the UK than most other parts of Europe as Sludge said - even Romania with its' 97% owner occupation rate!

Buy-to-let landlords are the worst in my experience. They spend the absolute bare minimum maintaining their properties because the rent goes straight towards paying their mortgage each month.

[Heathblue]

Agreed. The lack of supply (caused by an archaic and not fit for purpose planning system) is keeping prices artificially high.


Developers cannot build because they cannot get planning. Councils do not build because mass social house building is only required in extraordinary times.

I've been dealing with the local council this past two months regarding alterations to my house and to be fair to them they have been O.K, they didn't go the extra mile and make it clear what I need to do preferring to refer me to literature, fortunately I bumped into someone who works in the planning dept. who gave me an avenue to pursue which got me a quick decision and saved me a nice wedge.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Agreed. The lack of supply (caused by an archaic and not fit for purpose planning system) is keeping prices artificially high.


Developers cannot build because they cannot get planning. Councils do not build because mass social house building is only required in extraordinary times.

Like the last 30 years plus

[WJ99mobile]

Buy-to-let landlords are the worst in my experience. They spend the absolute bare minimum maintaining their properties because the rent goes straight towards paying their mortgage each month.

Thankfully (and surprisingly with a Tory Gov in charge) tax changes are slowly forcing out the small scale private landlords in favour of the big build to rent corporates that punt on long terms rather than pinching every penny.

Of course there are some good landlords but the future is with these big nationals such as L&G

[Canton Kev]

Of course there are some good landlords

That’s news to me

[goats]

That’s news to me

I know plenty and I’m one also……good and bad everyhere

[WJ99mobile]

No it isn't. Or at least, no it wasn't a few years ago.

The investment scams around land banking were fairly minor in scale, some described here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_banking

What I was talking about were housing developers who slow timed on developments because they were waiting for prices to rise or for local authorities to drop planning requirements in frustration at the lack of progress. I know it happened. I was working with a batch of house builders as part of my job (Decent Homes programme and new build feasibility schemes) who were doing exactly that. My direct experience was from 2006-14

Perhaps during the crash of 2007 where it wasn’t feasible to build but now the large scale developers are now building to capacity and it’s only labour and material shortages holding them back and it’s been like that for years.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

I don't understand why , if possible and unless they breed , people don't buy a house and stay there

The never ending search for better things affects everything , not just housing and its going to **** us all up

[The Bloop]

I don't understand why , if possible and unless they breed , people don't buy a house and stay there

The never ending search for better things affects everything , not just housing and its going to **** us all up

Reproduce? That's what people do isnt it?
So many new houses are so small that as soon as a little one appears theyve outgrown the property and it's time to move on. If they're fortunate enough to have room to expand their current house, its probably the best option.
Everyone is going to earning high wages and have highly skilled jobs soon, so itll all be ok in the end anyway (hope you can hear the hint of sarcasm)

[ToTaL ITK]

It's exactly the same in Sweden. It went from easy to find a dwelling to now being a huge pain in the ass and very expensive

[splott parker]

The Right To Buy eh! What a f*cking disaster.

[WJ99mobile]

The Right To Buy eh! What a f*cking disaster.

Could have been good if the rules were stuck to

Ie build new for every sold

[splott parker]

Could have been good if the rules were stuck to

Ie build new for every sold

Nah, was a shit concept, circulation of mass affordable rented properties was working well. All it’s done is create ghettoes of the parts that no bugger wanted to buy and a lot of the other parts of estates under private landlords. So the big plan for folk to own their own house has resulted in a lot of those houses now being rented with nowt going to the local authority in the way of rent.
The selling off of council stock was Thatcher’s way of capturing the working class, kidnap them with a mortgage around their necks, terrified to strike or complain about working conditions, that monthly bill had to be met. There was a safety net as a tenant, I’ll never be convinced about the right to buy.

[Feedback]

I've been dealing with the local council this past two months regarding alterations to my house and to be fair to them they have been O.K, they didn't go the extra mile and make it clear what I need to do preferring to refer me to literature, fortunately I bumped into someone who works in the planning dept. who gave me an avenue to pursue which got me a quick decision and saved me a nice wedge.

So if it wasn't for the planning process you could have shaved two months off the overall time of the alterations

[Heathblue]

So if it wasn't for the planning process you could have shaved two months off the overall time of the alterations

Not Really, I had the work started before i got the decision, didn't want to lose the builders slot having been put back for 10 months during the pandemic, was confident of what the decision outcome would be.

[Feedback]

Maybe the world has changed since I stopped working in public housing 7 years ago - but at that time developers were definitely land banking, and (along with their supporters in the Tory Party) blaming planning regs. No doubt planning systems and regs can be improved, but my experience was they were put up as an excuse for developers wanting greenfield sites not brownfield, and resisting requirements to include section 106 affordable housing in some developments. It was mostly a smokescreen to maximise profits.

Councils do not build council housing because they are unable to fund them (despite the self-financing Housing Revenue Acount reforms of a decade ago) and because they will still be subject to Right To Buy - meaning the public (councils and remaining tenants) will continue to subsidise a section of new owner occupiers. Mass social house building is needed now.

The other recent factor affecting housing costs and supply - and a reason for owner occupation in the UK dropping from over 70% in 2003 to under 65% now - is the 'buy to rent' phenomena. Vast numbers of homes - new build and ex RTB council in particular - have been hoovered up by the new breed of landlord who then push up rents and collect from the affluent who can afford them, or those on housing benefits (so the state, or taxpayers, have to afford them) for those that can't. People in the middle get squeezed.

This is what happens when housing is seen as an investment asset, for personal or company benefit, not as a home. That mindset is much more prevalent in the UK than most other parts of Europe as Sludge said - even Romania with its' 97% owner occupation rate!

Developers don't land bank. It would tie up too much cash to do so. Developers want to develop but also have to develop with the intention of turning a profit.

[Tuerto]

There are 14,500 council houses left in Cardiff. CCC are the 2nd most active council in the uk at buying back ex council houses. Selling them off was a disaster, massively boosted the private rental marketin which some landlords did exactly what they wanted.

[jon1959]

Developers don't land bank. It would tie up too much cash to do so. Developers want to develop but also have to develop with the intention of turning a profit.

And if they could turn a bigger profit by sitting on the sites, that is what they did.

If you are so insistent that land banking never happened tell me what Henry Boot, Keepmoat and Kier were doing with their development sites in South Yorkshire in the period I described. I was working with them, talking to them, talking to the planning and development officers in the council, reading the reports and even visited a few sites.

No doubt you know better - so just give me the headlines on the real story.

[jon1959]

Interesting scheme:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...ngham-58933011

A way into affordable rented homes with an incentive to stay for a long time!

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Could have been good if the rules were stuck to

Ie build new for every sold

Thatcher refused to let councils replace houses sold until they had used the money raised to pay off debts

She basically robbed them then kicked them in the bollocks as she went

[jon1959]

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-safety-crisis

Plans for thousands of affordable homes face being scrapped as billions of pounds are diverted to fixing the building safety crisis, builders have said.

[WJ99mobile]

And if they could turn a bigger profit by sitting on the sites, that is what they did.

If you are so insistent that land banking never happened tell me what Henry Boot, Keepmoat and Kier were doing with their development sites in South Yorkshire in the period I described. I was working with them, talking to them, talking to the planning and development officers in the council, reading the reports and even visited a few sites.

No doubt you know better - so just give me the headlines on the real story.

It’s not still a thing though.

It will be again one day sitting on granted planning permissions if we have another massive collapse, but what’s the point developing when they can’t sell them anyway because banks won’t be granting mortgages.

I reiterate, the mass housebuilders in the UK are not land banking currently .

[WJ99mobile]

Interesting scheme:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...ngham-58933011

A way into affordable rented homes with an incentive to stay for a long time!

Been done before. Liverpool last place I remember

Does work

[WJ99mobile]

I tell you what’s the best thing to do for everyone. Stop building social housing in high value areas and make travel free.

Works for all

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

My dream home is one that keeps a roof over my head

I don't even need it to be that warm

I just cover myself in extra blankets

I am a minimalist