"Science is not perfect but it trumps faith and belief all the time" - true or false?

[truthpaste]

No need for a ‘why’.

Your ‘why’ question is just to enable a feedback loop to your invented supernatural and needy world view.

Disingenuous and dishonest.

Yes, I too have family damage from religion, and there is a solution. However it can't be denied that everyone has a world view, even if they don't recognise it as such; as for trying to stop people asking the 'why?' questions - don't hold your breath!

Furthermore, multiple rants can't ever refute a robust world view, they are simply waste of energy.

[az city]

Yes, I too have family damage from religion, and there is a solution. However it can't be denied that everyone has a world view, even if they don't recognise it as such; as for trying to stop people asking the 'why?' questions - don't hold your breath!

Furthermore, multiple rants can't ever refute a robust world view, they are simply waste of energy.

Time to quit the feeble evangelizing - I think it's time for you to meander off into your magic book twilight zone again.

While you're away you may want to ponder all the horrific events that have taken place in the name of your "god". I'm firmly opposed to religion - it's the primary source of bigotry on Earth - all you lot do is attempt to do is hubristically "other" people creating barriers that needn't exist.

(P.S. Don't come back until you've done some reading on Physics, Evolution and Scientific Method. When you demonstrate your ignorance, as you have several times in this thread, you come across as a moron.)

[jon1959]

Yes, I too have family damage from religion, and there is a solution. However it can't be denied that everyone has a world view, even if they don't recognise it as such; as for trying to stop people asking the 'why?' questions - don't hold your breath!

Furthermore, multiple rants can't ever refute a robust world view, they are simply waste of energy.

Why do you think I have ‘family damage’ from religion? That is not what I shared a week or so back. I explained that I had rejected religion and faith (aged 12) but was familiar with many of the arguments and had spent my life (not obsessively) thinking about them and debating them with my dad. Calling that ‘family damage’ is wrong and arrogant.

Of course everyone has a world view - however incomplete or contradictory. I was referring to your world view not world views in general. It is your world view that requires a ‘why’. As far as I am concerned there is no need to overlay a supernatural explanation for natural events and evolution. What is - is. There may be a cultural drive to invent stories to make things more understandable or comfortable, but that is a human spin by the confused and disturbed. I don’t expect you or others to stop asking ‘why’. I am just saying it is not needed. How is a good question. Why is redundant.

You are really accusing someone else of ‘multiple rants’? At least you have found a sense of humour!

[truthpaste]

Time to quit the feeble evangelizing - I think it's time for you to meander off into your magic book twilight zone again.

While you're away you may want to ponder all the horrific events that have taken place in the name of your "god". I'm firmly opposed to religion - it's the primary source of bigotry on Earth - all you lot do is attempt to do is hubristically "other" people creating barriers that needn't exist.

(P.S. Don't come back until you've done some reading on Physics, Evolution and Scientific Method. When you demonstrate your ignorance, as you have several times in this thread, you come across as a moron.)

If you'd read even 10% of my posts, you know that I was firmly opposed to religion.
And if you wish to come back with the idea of evolution, I'll be more than ready.

[truthpaste]

Why do you think I have ‘family damage’ from religion? That is not what I shared a week or so back. I explained that I had rejected religion and faith (aged 12) but was familiar with many of the arguments and had spent my life (not obsessively) thinking about them and debating them with my dad. Calling that ‘family damage’ is wrong and arrogant.

Of course everyone has a world view - however incomplete or contradictory. I was referring to your world view not world views in general. It is your world view that requires a ‘why’. As far as I am concerned there is no need to overlay a supernatural explanation for natural events and evolution. What is - is. There may be a cultural drive to invent stories to make things more understandable or comfortable, but that is a human spin by the confused and disturbed. I don’t expect you or others to stop asking ‘why’. I am just saying it is not needed. How is a good question. Why is redundant.

You are really accusing someone else of ‘multiple rants’? At least you have found a sense of humour!

It was very clear that your dad had been given religious ideas which in no way satisfied your enquiring mind; had he been given the facts that connect science and scripture, then no damage would have been done and your world view would be nothing like it is now.

You say, "There may be a cultural drive to invent stories to make things more understandable"

Why don't you pick one of these so called "stories" relating to our origin and let's pull it apart and see how it stacks up against the scientific answer.

[truthpaste]

Fair enough. Though unless you are an Aremaic, Hebrew or Latin scholar (spoiler alert...you're not) you must then have a go to text to overrule all those other versions. What is it?

I seemed to have missed this query, my apologies. I have several Bible Dictionaries including Vines, which over a period of 40 years have rarely left me with any grey areas of understanding from the original languages.
More recently there is a brilliant online resource called the Blue Letter Bible, which brings together 'Strongs' and a number of other Bible Word references - here is an example from one verse at the start of John's Gospel - John 1:1

Also, did you have any thoughts on the scientific content that writers over 2000 years ago could not possibly have known about from any human discovery of the day?

For example:

1. "The valleys of the sea were exposed and the foundations of the earth..." (2 Samuel 22:16): written 2,700 years ago.

2. You threw me into the ocean depths and I sank down to the heart of the sea......I sank down to the very roots of the mountains. (from Jonah 2:3,6) - Written around 2,400 years ago.

......which have not been seen (due to the incredible underwater pressure) or discovered by any humans until 110 years ago!?

* April 27, 1914 – First Acoustic Exploration of the Sea Floor - Canadian inventor Reginald Fessenden found a way to employ an oscillator to bounce sound waves between an iceberg and the sea floor. This technology lead to the development of we now know as sonar.

[jon1959]

It was very clear that your dad had been given religious ideas which in no way satisfied your enquiring mind; had he been given the facts that connect science and scripture, then no damage would have been done and your world view would be nothing like it is now.

You say, "There may be a cultural drive to invent stories to make things more understandable"

Why don't you pick one of these so called "stories" relating to our origin and let's pull it apart and see how it stacks up against the scientific answer.

No damage was done. In fact the opposite. But thank you for your misplaced and contrived concern.

[truthpaste]

No damage was done. In fact the opposite. But thank you for your misplaced and contrived concern.

Again, when you are challenged to substantiate your comments like "there may be a cultural drive to invent stories..." we discover that as usual it's all bluster. Will you ever have something more than froth?

[jon1959]

Again, when you are challenged to substantiate your comments like "there may be a cultural drive to invent stories..." we discover that as usual it's all bluster. Will you ever have something more than froth?

A not unexpected swerve from the comment to which I responded. You have previous of course.

As to ‘bluster’ or ‘froth’ I think you are thrashing around again. Maybe even ranting?

You are all the evidence that is needed to show that some people need to invent stories to satisfy their bewilderment and need for a supernatural comfort blanket. You offer no evidence of your beliefs - just circular and self-referential non-arguments. They are based on irrationality and snake oil pronouncements. All cultists do the same. Maybe time to chuck out a few more verses from your book to prove your point?

No damage done here by my failure to swallow your fairy stories. You however appear to be seriously damaged. Pray for truthpaste!!

[truthpaste]

A not unexpected swerve from the comment to which I responded. You have previous of course.

As to ‘bluster’ or ‘froth’ I think you are thrashing around again. Maybe even ranting?

You are all the evidence that is needed to show that some people need to invent stories to satisfy their bewilderment and need for a supernatural comfort blanket. You offer no evidence of your beliefs - just circular and self-referential non-arguments. They are based on irrationality and snake oil pronouncements. All cultists do the same. Maybe time to chuck out a few more verses from your book to prove your point?

No damage done here by my failure to swallow your fairy stories. You however appear to be seriously damaged. Pray for truthpaste!!

Prayers to your god would be rather pointless, he is as compromised as those who unwittingly serve him. As for me, I have never offered myself up as a beacon for hope; alone I am as hopeless, guilty and lost as you are.

People here already know that I point to the Word of God as containing the only message of hope for us all.
And in turn, the Bible points to the only One who can save to the uttermost, He is the Lord Jesus Christ.

Sludge and others have desperately tried to hold up science as some sort of valid alternative! But when asked to present their chosen 'god', they have like so many others, simply ranted without any substance or ran away.
Of course they are not scared of me, they are terrified of the consequences of facing the God of the Bible, for them it would be far better if that 'dreadful' Book were invalidated, then all their fears would just go away.

They are also miscalculating what their life would be like if they allowed God to be part of it.....
447306826_10162017441673083_6348859745119668200_n.jpg

[jon1959]

I would be very surprised if Sludge was terrified of your imaginary friend.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Prayers to your god would be rather pointless, he is as compromised as those who unwittingly serve him. As for me, I have never offered myself up as a beacon for hope; alone I am as hopeless, guilty and lost as you are.

People here already know that I point to the Word of God as containing the only message of hope for us all.
And in turn, the Bible points to the only One who can save to the uttermost, He is the Lord Jesus Christ.

Sludge and others have desperately tried to hold up science as some sort of valid alternative! But when asked to present their chosen 'god', they have like so many others, simply ranted without any substance or ran away.
Of course they are not scared of me, they are terrified of the consequences of facing the God of the Bible, for them it would be far better if that 'dreadful' Book were invalidated, then all their fears would just go away.

They are also miscalculating what their life would be like if they allowed God to be part of it.....
447306826_10162017441673083_6348859745119668200_n.jpg

Is that Victoria Beckham and her fella ?

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

I would be very surprised if Sludge was terrified of your imaginary friend.

I need to meet him before I can deduce if he's scary

Waiting for Mr Paste to find him

[jon1959]

I need to meet him before I can deduce if he's scary

Waiting for Mr Paste to find him

Long wait Sludge.

[jeepster]

Long wait Sludge.

It is quite strange that any one believes that.
I hope he is happy and care free but leave us alone.
You are not going to change us.
We have all had some involement with religion but have rejected it.
Hope he can see sense.

[truthpaste]

It is quite strange that any one believes that.
I hope he is happy and care free but leave us alone.
You are not going to change us.
We have all had some involement with religion but have rejected it.
Hope he can see sense.

The penny still refuses to drop when it comes to religion. NB: all religion has done is confuse people and offer them false hope.
Religion was an enemy to the Man who was crucified for you, as the religious people wanted Him dead.
All people who just follow religion are lost, they will perish, and for eternity.

Here's one example, do/ did you know any religious man with the title 'Father' (?)

Note the Words of Jesus on religious leaders in Matthew 23:-

They crush people with unbearable religious demands and never lift a finger to ease the burden.... “Everything they do is for show. On their arms they wear extra wide prayer boxes with Scripture verses inside, and they wear robes with extra long tassels.
And don’t address anyone here on earth as ‘Father,’ for only God in heaven is your Father. But those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are!

“Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools!

[truthpaste]

I would be very surprised if Sludge was terrified of your imaginary friend.

Spot on, currently like yourself he isn't.

Hence, 'the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom' (Proverbs 9:10)

[truthpaste]

DOES SCIENCE PROVE THAT GOD EXISTS?
Piers Morgan questions former geophysicist and college professor ~ Stephen C. Meyer
>> Piers Morgan - Uncensored

[Citizen's Nephew]

DOES SCIENCE PROVE THAT GOD EXISTS?
Piers Morgan questions former geophysicist and college professor ~ Stephen C. Meyer
>> Piers Morgan - Uncensored

Stop bumping your own thread...let it die....it's not cool.

[truthpaste]

Cool!! There's plenty of people who are not cool and won't be indefinitely, if the price of letting people see they are backing a dead horse (and heading for the same fate) is me being classed as uncool - then fine.

The case for science was not made, period.

Science WILL actually lead people to the truth, if they keep their eyes and their minds open.....

Faith.jpg

[Gofer Blue]

Stop bumping your own thread...let it die....it's not cool.

Somehow I suspect that TP cares not one iota that other people may regard him as "uncool". I watched the video in the link and found it interesting.

When I was a teenager and studying biology at A level, the work of Stanley Miller strongly influenced my thinking at the time and I fell hook, line and sinker for evolution as the answer to both the origin of life and its subsequent development. I thus rejected any notion of a creator, God or otherwise! The step from amino acid production from the early earth's atmospheric conditions to the first “simple” single celled organism seemed quite a plausible one and from there cells coming together to produce multicellular organisms over millions of years again seemed quite a straight forward process.

I think it is easy to follow this line of reasoning until you stop and actually think about the complexity of any living organism. IMO opinion the old adage of “familiarity breeds contempt” can be applied in this situation. We are so used to living in the natural world that we take it all for granted and never look beyond what we can see on the surface. We do not regard ourselves as anything special but in reality we are the most incredibly complicated biological machines, as indeed are the simplest living things.

I have referred to the first “simple” single celled organism which evolutionists would consider to be the basic building block from which more advanced organisms evolved. Simple in inverted commas because such organisms may be single celled but they are in no way simple! There are many links I could refer to about this but I won't list them as no one will be bothered to look at them anyway. Suffice perhaps just to mention just one on the subject of kinesin which is definitely worth a look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn6i91NRMu8

The same mechanism occurs in human cells as in “simple” bacterial cells. I don't care how many billions of years the evolutionary process has supposedly been taking place, there is no way that a biological process so complicated arose by chance from an amino acid soup. And all of this takes place within what is effectively a miniature ocean within a living cell with thousands of other reactions going on at the same time!

[Citizen's Nephew]

I really wouldn't give me that much of your energy or time. Pretty much 99% of what I post is frivolous twaddle and I'm onto the next thing. I'd respectfully suggest you just ignore me.

[truthpaste]

Somehow I suspect that TP cares not one iota that other people may regard him as "uncool". I watched the video in the link and found it interesting.

When I was a teenager and studying biology at A level, the work of Stanley Miller strongly influenced my thinking at the time and I fell hook, line and sinker for evolution as the answer to both the origin of life and its subsequent development. I thus rejected any notion of a creator, God or otherwise! The step from amino acid production from the early earth's atmospheric conditions to the first “simple” single celled organism seemed quite a plausible one and from there cells coming together to produce multicellular organisms over millions of years again seemed quite a straight forward process.

I think it is easy to follow this line of reasoning until you stop and actually think about the complexity of any living organism. IMO opinion the old adage of “familiarity breeds contempt” can be applied in this situation. We are so used to living in the natural world that we take it all for granted and never look beyond what we can see on the surface. We do not regard ourselves as anything special but in reality we are the most incredibly complicated biological machines, as indeed are the simplest living things.

I have referred to the first “simple” single celled organism which evolutionists would consider to be the basic building block from which more advanced organisms evolved. Simple in inverted commas because such organisms may be single celled but they are in no way simple! There are many links I could refer to about this but I won't list them as no one will be bothered to look at them anyway. Suffice perhaps just to mention just one on the subject of kinesin which is definitely worth a look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn6i91NRMu8

The same mechanism occurs in human cells as in “simple” bacterial cells. I don't care how many billions of years the evolutionary process has supposedly been taking place, there is no way that a biological process so complicated arose by chance from an amino acid soup. And all of this takes place within what is effectively a miniature ocean within a living cell with thousands of other reactions going on at the same time!

Spot on, and thanks for watching the CLIP
The understanding of DNA and the complexity of the single cell has destroyed the idea of evolution; the sooner people get to grips with this, the sooner they will discover what life is really all about.

[Gofer Blue]

Spot on, and thanks for watching the CLIP
The understanding of DNA and the complexity of the single cell has destroyed the idea of evolution; the sooner people get to grips with this, the sooner they will discover what life is really all about.

I don't think many, if any, of our fellow posters will bother to watch either video so I won't hold my breath! The discovery of kinesin and its mode of action is truly amazing. I had already come to realise that each single cell is an incredibly complicated system, let alone a multicellular being such as humans, but this new information puts it on a whole new and awesome level for me. The phrase "for I am wonderfully and fearfully made" immediately comes to mind!

[az city]

I don't think many, if any, of our fellow posters will bother to watch either video so I won't hold my breath! The discovery of kinesin and its mode of action is truly amazing. I had already come to realise that each single cell is an incredibly complicated system, let alone a multicellular being such as humans, but this new information puts it on a whole new and awesome level for me. The phrase "for I am wonderfully and fearfully made" immediately comes to mind!

And have either of you two ever read "The Blind Watchmaker"?