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What is the significance of that?Originally Posted by Gofer Blue
Your vote didn't make much difference because the UK vote was 51.8% in favour of leave and about 1 million more than remain. The split in your area is irrelevant.
this is another strange thing about the vote, who would have known, all it would take to bring peace and harmony to Ireland was the threat of leaving the EU ( i know we have had peace, well almost, but its never really been harmonious )
It's scary that even now some people don't even realise that every vote counted. Gofer Blue where the hell have you been?
I reckon more than 18M. Now that would be interesting.
This is an interesting comment from the Guardian's comment section.
Worth a read.
Teebs 14h ago
Guardian Pick
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If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign.
Interesting article Charlie. Time will tell but Johnson has been very subdued.
Seems a lot of sense in there, but sadly sense seems in short supply.
I have had a feeling all day that actually leaving is a long way from actually happening. Hopefully someone will stand up soon and just say "NO!"
Agreed. I genuinely don't think Johnson has the first idea about what to do but he has made a lot of promises about extra funds to the NHS and ensuring regions like Wales receive funds to make up for the rebate shortfall. If the economists have this only half right he is going to face huge problems finding the money.
If you base a campaign on lies and more lies you face the consequences. He has a history of dishonesty and cheating in both his professional and private life. It will not end well for him. Not well at all.
If Boris is smart he will call a general election and purposely lose it.
Indeed: https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-gove-eu-liars
Petition to hold second EU referendum reaches 2m signatures
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...ommons-website
Do you think he would need to?
It's three million now. I think Cameron was clever in not implementing article 50 although perhaps should have resigned with immediate effect. That really would have spooked Johnson and Co. In the meantime Cameron' s allies are now going after Johnson.
Surely smarter to not become leader, wait til the tories lose a GE and then go for leader?
They can get 17m, and it won't be enough...
Given the "quality" of the opposition, that may be easier said than done
I think that the limitations of straightforward referendums where 50.000001% of the vote wins it for you have been exposed in the past couple of days, but that's the system we had and everyone knew it beforehand. So, for me at least, petitions for second referendums just come over as sour grapes - we've got a result after a turnout that was much bigger than in recent general elections and now we have to live with it's consequences.
A referendum or plebiscite used to require that the side wanting to change the status quo had to attract over 50.1% of the "Available" vote. A non-vote was deemed to be a vote to maintain the status quo. If that were applied to this referendum it would require a 'Leave' of about 24,500,000 plus.
Add to that the fact that Farage and Co stated during the campaign that if the 'Remain' side won by a percentage of 52/48 or there abouts, then the decision would be so close that a rerun would be demanded. It seems that because the won by that margin this no longer applies.
Given the "quality" of the opposition, that may be easier said than done
thing is though Nigel Farage is a plank and doesn't know what he's talking about there wouldn't be a 2nd Referendum if Remain won it's not how democracy works . I voted Leave by doing my own research and not listening to Nigel , and I'm still happy with my vote and think alot of my fellow "thickos" are
My understanding of what Farage said was that with a 52-48 defeat it wouldn't be over. Not that they would demand a second referendum immediately but that the campaign would continue.
However it is exactly the kind of feed the ducks thing that he would say.
This is a valid point. The EU has gone too far in expanding the countries becoming new members.
I wasn't stating he was correct or that I agree with him, I was just commenting on what he said. You don't know, I may be one of your fellow 'thickos'.
I wasn't stating he was correct or that I agree with him, I was just commenting on what he said. You don't know, I may be one of your fellow 'thickos'.
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