Riot in Ely

[North Cardiff Blue]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...first-minister

UK government created conditions that led to Cardiff riots, says Mark Drakeford.

Wales problems, not his fault
His Son, not his fault
Deaths in his own constituency, not his fault
NHS backlogs not his fault
You can't drive into Wales without a queue, not his fault
Being overtaken on the roads by ten-year-old girls on roller skates, is not his fault
Cardiff City is in a mess, not his fault - OK I'll concede on that one.
What a waste of space Wales is washed up!

[North Cardiff Blue]

Get over it Maurice ffs

You’re like a big baby

“I had a post deleted” boo fecking hoo.

[North Cardiff Blue]

The first picture released did show the Police following two lads on an e bike even though they are not meant to be driven on the road or to carry passengers. They are off road bikes only. However, later pictures revealed the Police turning off onto another road and the accident happened when the Police were a long way away on another street. However, it's odd that the Police did turn off especially as the bike was carrying a passenger with the pillion dragging his feet along the ground. Nonetheless I can't see how the rioting was warranted.

When i heard that Drakeford was chairing a meeting of interested groups I thought that was a good thing - exactly the type of thing that the Welsh government should be doing but to turn the event into a political event by blaming the UK government for the rioting was crass and inappropriate. Incidentally I think Alun Michael is one of the good guys especially when he was an MP who left no stone unturned to get to the root of a problem. To condemn him this early is simply wrong. He will get to the bottom of this and, if the Police were in any way to blame, (which is doubtful on present evidence) I believe he will say so.

Turns out the police turned away because the kids were able to get through bollards at the end of a street and obviously the police van couldn't you can't believe a word they say.

[North Cardiff Blue]

With respect many commenting here clearly do not know the area. The police are using that to their advantage. It isn't strange the police turned the other way as there are bollards a bike can get through but not a car. Police had no choice but to turn the other way. There is no dispute now the boys were being actively pursued (although not chased with blue lights).

Also not seen it mentioned here but many think the boys were hit by a bus (as was widely reported) but cardiff bus issued a statement yesterday that none of their vehicles were involved.

The families have reported police were telling people at the scene no police were involved yet a video was being shown to people in the crowd at the scene of the chase (active pursuit) which is what sparked the trouble.

Sorry I hadn't seen this but exactly right.

The BBC are all over this now, the police tried to say they had it wrong, but they then found this out, probably much more to come out too.

[Father Dougal]

Sorry I hadn't seen this but exactly right.

The BBC are all over this now, the police tried to say they had it wrong, but they then found this out, probably much more to come out too.

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/23548176.ely-cardiff-mother-crash-victim-says-police-killed-son/

One of the victims mothers says the police killed her son and she can't say anything else.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/23548176.ely-cardiff-mother-crash-victim-says-police-killed-son/

One of the victims mothers says the police killed her son and she can't say anything else.

I think it's understandable why some people , especially those related to those boys , don't have faith or trust in some of those police statements

It's hardly something to emulate is it ?

[SOXY BOY]

I can understand why the parents are blaming the Police particularly the way the Police have handled this.Ultimately,the Police didn’t buy this e-bike/scooter and make the young guys ride it illegally. Can someone clear up, at what age, can somebody ride this bikes legally, because if it’s 17,why buy it for their son? Also, if they didn’t hit a bus, as seems to be the case, what did they hit?

[Father Dougal]

I can understand why the parents are blaming the Police particularly the way the Police have handled this.Ultimately,the Police didn’t buy this e-bike/scooter and make the young guys ride it illegally. Can someone clear up, at what age, can somebody ride this bikes legally, because if it’s 17,why buy it for their son? Also, if they didn’t hit a bus, as seems to be the case, what did they hit?

Not sure on the specific bike but you can ride an e bike on the road from the age of 14.

https://www.gov.uk/electric-bike-rul...20or%20insured.

[Tuerto]

With respect many commenting here clearly do not know the area. The police are using that to their advantage. It isn't strange the police turned the other way as there are bollards a bike can get through but not a car. Police had no choice but to turn the other way. There is no dispute now the boys were being actively pursued (although not chased with blue lights).

Also not seen it mentioned here but many think the boys were hit by a bus (as was widely reported) but cardiff bus issued a statement yesterday that none of their vehicles were involved.

The families have reported police were telling people at the scene no police were involved yet a video was being shown to people in the crowd at the scene of the chase (active pursuit) which is what sparked the trouble.

Exactly this. The boys were heading up Stanway rd after turning in to it from Archer rd. At the top end of Stanway rd (Snowden rd end) there are bollards, but enough space for a bike to get through, although with a bit of difficulty. The police would have known this so turned left down Howell rd which takes you onto Grand Avenue, turn right, and then 2nd right takes you onto Wilson rd, travel up wilson rd for 100 mts or so and you're at the bollard end of Stanway rd and the junction of Snowden rd.

[J R Hartley]

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/23548176.ely-cardiff-mother-crash-victim-says-police-killed-son/

One of the victims mothers says the police killed her son and she can't say anything else.

No they didn’t. This blame culture does my ****ing head in.

[Tuerto]

No they didn’t. This blame culture does my ****ing head in.

I don't want to get too deep into this, but in my opinion, The police were pursuing these lads, and i don't think that was a great idea with two of them on this machine with no safety gear on, especially helmets. I fully understand that it was the boys decision to go out on the bike with no gear on, and the parents or parents must've known this had been happening, but i can understand why people may be annoyed at why the police decided to pursue these boys. The biggest threat to these lads being caught was probably the bike being confiscated rather than any conviction. It's a shit show whichever way you look at it.

[Vindec]

Not sure on the specific bike but you can ride an e bike on the road from the age of 14.

https://www.gov.uk/electric-bike-rul...20or%20insured.

I don't think from the following link provided earlier that the bike met the criteria for riding on the road.
https://surron.co.uk/pages/surron-bike-availability

The bikes are marketed as off road bikes and do not have pedals as the law requires and from the look of it are not designed to carry passengers either.

Either way the death of these two boys is an absolute tragedy.

[the other bob wilson]

I don't want to get too deep into this, but in my opinion, The police were pursuing these lads, and i don't think that was a great idea with two of them on this machine with no safety gear on, especially helmets. I fully understand that it was the boys decision to go out on the bike with no gear on, and the parents or parents must've known this had been happening, but i can understand why people may be annoyed at why the police decided to pursue these boys. The biggest threat to these lads being caught was probably the bike being confiscated rather than any conviction. It's a shit show whichever way you look at it.

As I understand it, Cardiff buses are saying none of their vehicles were involved and the police are saying they weren’t at the scene of the accident, so until it’s established who hit the bike or whether one of the other two parties are lying, there doesn’t seem much pointin looking to blame anyone now apart from where events are clear. First the bike was being ridden without protective clothing being worn and that,after denying it at first,the police were following the bike - whether they were chasing it is open to argument.

I wouldn’t be surprised if you were right when you say it was fear regarding the bike being confiscated that was a leading factor in the tragedy.

[Tuerto]

As I understand it, Cardiff buses are saying none of their vehicles were involved and the police are saying they weren’t at the scene of the accident, so until it’s established who hit the bike or whether one of the other two parties are lying, there doesn’t seem much pointin looking to blame anyone now apart from where events are clear. First the bike was being ridden without protective clothing being worn and that,after denying it at first,the police were following the bike - whether they were chasing it is open to argument.

I wouldn’t be surprised if you were right when you say it was fear regarding the bike being confiscated that was a leading factor in the tragedy.

I'm in Ely most days Bob (working days) and these scooters are everywhere. The general consensus amongst those that ride them is that the police will impound them if they are caught or identified using them, that's why plenty of the people who use them wear face coverings so that they can't be identified. There's also the belief amongst the authorities that some youngsters using these scooters, bikes, are delivering drugs, popping about the estate so to speak. Not that i have any evidence to say that is happening.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

I think the issue boils down to why did the police play silly buggers with what happened ?

Saying nothing and arguing they are refusing to comment due to deaths or a possible review is fair enough

But after comments by Alun Micheal , that Superintendent that walked back in the building and the female assistant chief constable I thought it was a mixture of incompetence , passing the buck and denial

It was a comedy show and the subject matter was extremely worrying

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

No they didn’t. This blame culture does my ****ing head in.

It's unlikely to be true but it's understandable given the circumstances for a parent to make hysterical and emotional outbursts

[life on mars]

If they were nice lads why did they sped off in a dangerous way , glad a mother with a pram or an elderly person wasnt hurt by the scooter boys .

Done nothing wrong just stop, I'd put serous money on this being drug related , same as the St Mellons sad incident , police are too frightened to police , they have so many barriers to manage in frenzied incidents from diversity, racism, gender recognition, being sued, filmed on phones, social media hell , spat at, stoned by kids, Saturday night drunks , no respect, the manpower pull of demonstraters which stops real policing , dreadful job .

The only winner's these days are the unruly, don't care areshole , law breakers .

[Tuerto]

If they were nice lads why did they sped off in a dangerous way , glad a mother with a pram or an elderly person wasnt hurt by the scooter boys .

Done nothing wrong just stop, I'd put serous money on this being drug related , same as the St Mellons sad incident , police are too frightened to police , they have so many barriers to manage in frenzied incidents from diversity, racism, gender recognition, being sued, filmed on phones, social media hell , spat at, stoned by kids, Saturday night drunks , no respect, the manpower pull of demonstraters which stops real policing , dreadful job .

The only winner's these days are the unruly, don't care areshole , law breakers .

Your final line sums up the current Government Perfectly.

[North Cardiff Blue]

Your final line sums up the current Government Perfectly.

Agreed it's even in his constituency, we are in a mess but you can't stop him he does what he likes and these dopey clowns still keep voting for Drakeford?

[blue matt]

Agreed it's even in his constituency, we are in a mess but you can't stop him he does what he likes and these dopey clowns still keep voting for Drakeford?

Boooooom

[Dorcus]

Agreed it's even in his constituency, we are in a mess but you can't stop him he does what he likes and these dopey clowns still keep voting for Drakeford?

I think he meant the National government.

[Loramski]

I'm in Ely most days Bob (working days) and these scooters are everywhere. The general consensus amongst those that ride them is that the police will impound them if they are caught or identified using them, that's why plenty of the people who use them wear face coverings so that they can't be identified. There's also the belief amongst the authorities that some youngsters using these scooters, bikes, are delivering drugs, popping about the estate so to speak. Not that i have any evidence to say that is happening.

Just out of interest, how are you finding the mood up there? I think I'm surprised at how quickly things seemed to have calmed down. A couple of residents I spoke to were expecting more flashpoints but they haven't come (as of yet). Is any anger directed more towards the rioters or the police or are people just trying to put it all behind them now and move on?

[Tuerto]

Just out of interest, how are you finding the mood up there? I think I'm surprised at how quickly things seemed to have calmed down. A couple of residents I spoke to were expecting more flashpoints but they haven't come (as of yet). Is any anger directed more towards the rioters or the police or are people just trying to put it all behind them now and move on?

It's a bit subdued, and the tragedy is the main topic of conversation, although there doesn't seem to be any sort of sinister edge in the air, it's quieter, not so much activity near the shops on Wilson rd, or what's left of them. A bit subdued is how i would describe the atmosphere, a bit of a shock to the community.

[Alan Lung]

I think he meant the National government.

Drakeford runs the national government.

[Loramski]

It's a bit subdued, and the tragedy is the main topic of conversation, although there doesn't seem to be any sort of sinister edge in the air, it's quieter, not so much activity near the shops on Wilson rd, or what's left of them. A bit subdued is how i would describe the atmosphere, a bit of a shock to the community.

Thanks, that's interesting. Perfectly understandable too. For some reason I started thinking about the boys' funerals earlier and wished I hadn't, what a devastating day that'll be.