Quote Originally Posted by JamesWales View Post
Well that's mental, sorry.

You can completely agree that Israels response was disproportionate, horrific, obscene, genocidal or anything else, whilst also recognising that Hamas very much started it and very much could have ended it sooner by releasing hostages.

I see some videos on twitter and the like where Israelis try to clear Netanyahu of responsibility by claiming every death is the fault of Hamas due to Oct 7th.. I think thats proposterous, but so to do I think it's proposterous to not see Hamas' responsibility. They, just like Israel, could have made decision that would have saved tens of thousands of innocent lives. It's crazy as hell not to see that.
Hamas are guilty of atrocities on and after 7 October - of killing about 1200 and abducting 250 - mostly civilians and probably also guilty of rapes and other sickening acts.

The IDF killed between 70 and 200 Israeli civilians that day too - following the Hannibal Directive!

Israeli hostages have been mistreated by Hamas and Islamic Jihad; Palestinian prisoners and detainees (hostages!) have also been mistreated by Israel (allegations of torture and murder on both sides).

But Israel has committed genocide and war crimes on an industrial scale - that cannot be blamed on Hamas whatever their own crimes.

But the 'Trump Peace Plan' that he is backing in is almost identical (at least in the slightly more detailed sketch for Phase 1) to the one that was on the table in June/July 2024. Hamas agreed to that plan; Israel did not.

Joe Biden backed Israel and Trump was going even further from the sidelines to torpedo the talks!

'Tens of thousands of innocent lives' were lost (blown apart, crushed, burnt) in the 15 months after that wasted opportunity. That is on Israel and their chief cheerleaders in the USA!