Climate fanatics - where are you

[Rjk]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I see that Sir Kier essentially threw his climate policy down the shitter, has he now joined the conspiracy brigade ?

I think it's more that the Tories have ****ed up just about every public service you can possibly imagine, whilst at the same time growing the national debt massively whilst imposing higher taxation and flatlining the economy, so Labour are going to have to be a bit more modest with their ambitions until we are a bit less of a dumpster fire

[jon1959]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I think it's more that the Tories have ****ed up just about every public service you can possibly imagine, whilst at the same time growing the national debt massively whilst imposing higher taxation and flatlining the economy, so Labour are going to have to be a bit more modest with their ambitions until we are a bit less of a dumpster fire

I think the first part is absolutely right - but rather that that requiring a sensible policy adjustment, it means there is a perfect excuse for a political coward and serial liar to carry out yet another pledge dump as the Blairite cabal whisper in his ear.

[Doucas]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

It's obvious that Starmer has sold out to corporate interests which is why he's U turned on basically every pledge he made.

He won't get my vote.

[JamesWales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I think the first part is absolutely right - but rather that that requiring a sensible policy adjustment, it means there is a perfect excuse for a political coward and serial liar to carry out yet another pledge dump as the Blairite cabal whisper in his ear.

Far too simple an explanation for me. The idea that societies, networks, ways of working, delivery, funding etc are wholly determined by who is in national govt is wrong. And because that's wrong it means it won't change with a new govt.

Of course it's a complimentary factor, a big one, but there is so much going on in the world of work and in society and it is waaaay overlooked as a factor by those seeking to make a political point of it.

The clearest demonstration of this is that different councils, hospitals etc perform differently. Birmingham Council for example spunked £80m on an IT project. That's nothing to do with central govt. Likewise, it it made much difference we would have much better services here in Wales, yet we don't.

Things like working from home, immigration, covid, society changing and becoming more digital are far bigger factors.

Very little will change under a Labour central government unless underlying issues and causes are addressed and I hold little hope of that.

We are an unhappy, paranoid, lazy, inefficient, short term thinking, increasingly isolated society. Tories did not make that better but they didn't cause it either

[Rjk]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

It's obvious that Starmer has sold out to corporate interests which is why he's U turned on basically every pledge he made.

He won't get my vote.

I'm no fan of Starmer, but I don't think he's sold out to corporate interests - he's basically just happy to do or say anything that he thinks will get him into power - this will have been a calculation that the flack that he will take from ditching it will be less damaging than the potential criticism of being financially reckless in a discourse in the general public that is usually skewed to the right of centre.
So partially beholden to corporate interests in the media at least, sure, but I think that more reflects the reality of the political system we have rather that selling out.

Someone like Corbyn would never play that game and would stick to their beliefs - I would love Corbyn to have been prime minister, but it is never going to happen in the current climate, he would have been torn to shreds by now, instead of sitting on a 25 point lead. Corbyn is just as much affected by the right wing media in trying not to play their game than Starmer is in playing it.

As for not voting for Labour because Starmer has sold out to corporate interests -in a 2 party first past the post system, that only benefits the Tories - who are basically only there to further corporate intetrests.

[Wales-Bales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

What on earth does that gibberish mean?

I thought this was your specialist subject? You are adept at copying & pasting the fear elements, but what about the solution, it's implementation, and the effect on peoples lives? Not everybody can depart life without a care in the world, as they have families, kids & grandchildren, and they want to know what kind of future they will be leaving behind.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I thought this was your specialist subject? You are adept at copying & pasting the fear elements, but what about the solution, it's implementation, and the effect on peoples lives? Not everybody can depart life without a care in the world, as they have families, kids & grandchildren, and they want to know what kind of future they will be leaving behind.

[Wales-Bales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

We need more meat on the bone, not just the scary panic bits. Tell us what the solution is, how it works, and how it will affect our lives. Cheers.

[Heathblue]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I think it's more that the Tories have ****ed up just about every public service you can possibly imagine, whilst at the same time growing the national debt massively whilst imposing higher taxation and flatlining the economy, so Labour are going to have to be a bit more modest with their ambitions until we are a bit less of a dumpster fire

Don't disagree with your public service bit, but the climate nutters have constantly told us that its an existential threat to humanity and the planet, shirley if this is the case, then money is irrelevant and should not be the decider, skimming 20 odd billion from the climate fantasy fund makes no difference to us all being dead in the next 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years, don't you see the grift yet ?

[Wales-Bales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

Don't disagree with your public service bit, but the climate nutters have constantly told us that its an existential threat to humanity and the planet, shirley if this is the case, then money is irrelevant and should not be the decider, skimming 20 odd billion from the climate fantasy fund makes no difference to us all being dead in the next 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years, don't you see the grift yet ?

What if the grift isn't the main event, and it's all about implementing some kind of digital control system? I've got Bob on the case, and hopefully he will report back soon.

[Rjk]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

Don't disagree with your public service bit, but the climate nutters have constantly told us that its an existential threat to humanity and the planet, shirley if this is the case, then money is irrelevant and should not be the decider, skimming 20 odd billion from the climate fantasy fund makes no difference to us all being dead in the next 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years, don't you see the grift yet ?

Nobody is saying that everyone is going to be dead in 10 or even 50 years.

Milllions dead sure, but not everyone

[Wales-Bales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

Nobody is saying that everyone is going to be dead in 10 or even 50 years.

Milllions dead sure, but not everyone

On behalf on those who will still be alive, how will they be forced to comply with the climate restrictions?

[Heathblue]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

Nobody is saying that everyone is going to be dead in 10 or even 50 years.

Milllions dead sure, but not everyone

I see it now, you have stolen my future is not applicable to everyone.


I must have dreamt the last 40 odd years of being told by Gore, Kerry and Co. that i only have 5 then 10 then another 10 etc. until the impending apocalypse.

[Wales-Bales]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

I see it now, you have stolen my future is not applicable to everyone.


I must have dreamt the last 40 odd years of being told by Gore, Kerry and Co. that i only have 5 then 10 then another 10 etc. until the impending apocalypse.

It's like shooting fish in a barrel.

Everybody cant wait to sign up for these new climate restrictions, yet they have absolutely no idea what it entails.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Climate fanatics - where are you

We need more meat on the bone, not just the scary panic bits. Tell us what the solution is, how it works, and how it will affect our lives. Cheers.

You seem confused.