Justin Welby

[goats]

Re: Justin Welby

Interesting piece. You should read it!

It rubbishes the idea that humanity began with two people: Adam and Eve.

It makes clear that modern humans' first ancestors were part of a wider evolved population pool of homo sapiens which is quite different from tracing a survivor lineage back to a single woman.

It plays around with 'spot the Eden' but makes clear this is not 'the cradle of humanity' but is the place where Neolithic farming first began - which fits with most other scholarship in paleoanthropology for well over 50 years. The 'birthplace of civilisation' is not the birthplace of humanity!

It also warns people with a literal belief in all the words of the Bible, that this story of human origin (genetic and cultural) is mainly incompatible with Biblical fundamentalism:

"However, making the Bible fit with modern science requires throwing out a lot of the traditional story.

"That could mean saying goodbye to the notion that God created Adam and Eve, or even questioning whether our biblical ancestors were Homo Sapiens."

Not enough there on Neanderthals or Homo Erectus, though. They really drive a cart and horses through the creation myths!

My gosh, the bible is nonsense, well I never……

[truthpaste]

Re: Justin Welby

My gosh, the bible is nonsense, well I never……

Wake up and smell the coffee occasionally!

When you read articles or scientific papers that include phrases like "that could mean...." or "scientists think that..." then have the wherewithall to realise that they are uncertain and don't really know. You don't actually need to get all gooey eyed and jump to the desired end of 'there you go, I can park the Bible back into my grandads archive box'.

“The best data we have are exactly what I would have predicted had I nothing to go on but the five books of Moses, the Psalms, the Bible as a whole, in that the universe appears to have order and purpose.” -
Arno Penzias, American physicist and Nobel Laureate for the discovery of the cosmic background radiation which substantiated Big Bang theory.

“In the last few years astronomy has come together so that we’re now able to tell a coherent story
[of how the universe began] …this story does not contradict God, but instead enlarges [the idea of] God.”
Joel Primack, Fellow of the American Physical Society, Professor of Physics at the University of California, Santa Cruz. He studies dark matter, particle astrophysics, cosmology and quantum field theory.

[stevo]

Re: Justin Welby

When you read articles or scientific papers that include phrases like "that could mean...." or "scientists think that..." then have the wherewithall to realise that they are uncertain and don't really know.

Just because a Christian says I know that God exists, doesn't mean to say they're right either.

“The best data we have are exactly what I would have predicted had I nothing to go on but the five books of Moses, the Psalms, the Bible as a whole, in that the universe appears to have order and purpose.” -
Arno Penzias, American physicist and Nobel Laureate for the discovery of the cosmic background radiation which substantiated Big Bang theory.

“In the last few years astronomy has come together so that we’re now able to tell a coherent story
[of how the universe began] …this story does not contradict God, but instead enlarges [the idea of] God.”
Joel Primack, Fellow of the American Physical Society, Professor of Physics at the University of California, Santa Cruz. He studies dark matter, particle astrophysics, cosmology and quantum field theory.

So, where does the firmament fit into all of this? Have scientists detected it?

[jon1959]

Re: Justin Welby

"Arno Penzias, American physicist and Nobel Laureate for the discovery of the cosmic background radiation which substantiated Big Bang theory."

How does the Big Bang theory fit with Genesis? Arno Penzias is no longer around to explain.

These attempts to reconcile faith with reason are so contrived it is painful.

It is either one or the other, although it is clearly possible for some people to compartmentalise and maintain a cultural attachment to their childhood indoctrination whilst doing some serious work in the real world. But faith and reason remain irreconcilable.

[truthpaste]

Re: Justin Welby

"Arno Penzias, American physicist and Nobel Laureate for the discovery of the cosmic background radiation which substantiated Big Bang theory."

How does the Big Bang theory fit with Genesis? Arno Penzias is no longer around to explain.

These attempts to reconcile faith with reason are so contrived it is painful.

It is either one or the other, although it is clearly possible for some people to compartmentalise and maintain a cultural attachment to their childhood indoctrination whilst doing some serious work in the real world. But faith and reason remain irreconcilable.

The issue isn't faith, because you also have faith, in a selection of scientists that have given you a pathway to dismiss God's Account.
Like so many others, you don't wish to examine that 'pathway' or answer questions on it (like Christians are asked to do) because it is 'solid state' and you don't wish to remove the 'sticker' which says 'no need to examine the contents, you can trust us'.

So we are talking verified evidence here, not faith, got it now??

[jon1959]

Re: Justin Welby

So we are talking verified evidence here, not faith, got it now??

You wish. But no you have not talked 'verified evidence' once. You have tied yourself in constant knots with contradictions, circular arguments and pseudo science and come back to asserting the creation myths of your fantasy world.

And you have swerved my question about the Big Bang and Genesis. Shame - that was one big laugh I was looking forward to.

[truthpaste]

Re: Justin Welby

You wish. But no you have not talked 'verified evidence' once. You have tied yourself in constant knots with contradictions, circular arguments and pseudo science and come back to asserting the creation myths of your fantasy world.

And you have swerved my question about the Big Bang and Genesis. Shame - that was one big laugh I was looking forward to.

Yes, the things that really matter are simply entertainment to you. Or so you think.
I'll get back to you re the big bang, so keep your popcorn dry.

[goats]

Re: Justin Welby

The issue isn't faith, because you also have faith, in a selection of scientists that have given you a pathway to dismiss God's Account.
Like so many others, you don't wish to examine that 'pathway' or answer questions on it (like Christians are asked to do) because it is 'solid state' and you don't wish to remove the 'sticker' which says 'no need to examine the contents, you can trust us'.

So we are talking verified evidence here, not faith, got it now??

Can you just bullet point the verified evidence for me, I must have missed it amongst the waffle? Just stick to facts not quotes from Christian scientists please…..

[goats]

Re: Justin Welby

God has definitely been busy……

Just how big is the universe? It takes our Sun 250 million years to orbit the Milky Way.

Ultimately, the Milky Way is about 100,000 light-years across and 1,000 light-years thick. Our solar system is located about 26,000 light-years away from the center of the galaxy.

If that's not impressive enough, our star is just 1 of the 200 billion stars in the Milky Way. As such, scientists estimate that there could be as many as 3.2 trillion planets in our galaxy.

And keep in mind, these are just the numbers for our own tiny galaxy. According to NASA, there are about 2 trillion galaxies in the observable universe.

Learn more: https://science.nasa.gov/universe/ex...-big-is-space/

We are not alone

[Gofer Blue]

Re: Justin Welby

Let's call a spade a spade shall we. At the end of the day, let's be honest and face it, both Christians and atheists actually have “a faith” as neither can PROVE that God exists or doesn't exist (yes I know, the burden of proof falls to Christians etc.....I await the inevitable scornful remarks from the atheist position!). It's all about the weight of evidence one way or the other so check it out for yourself and see if it fits the “beyond reasonable doubt” criteria which would apply in a court of law to discern a guilty or not-guilty verdict. I would like to think that none of us, if called to jury service, would decide the fate of the accused before listening to all the evidence. (Think “12 Angry Men”!!).

[goats]

Re: Justin Welby

Could this be the end for this thread…

[truthpaste]

Re: Justin Welby

Could this be the end for this thread…

You wish

[truthpaste]

Re: Justin Welby

God has definitely been busy……

Just how big is the universe? It takes our Sun 250 million years to orbit the Milky Way.

Ultimately, the Milky Way is about 100,000 light-years across and 1,000 light-years thick. Our solar system is located about 26,000 light-years away from the center of the galaxy.

If that's not impressive enough, our star is just 1 of the 200 billion stars in the Milky Way. As such, scientists estimate that there could be as many as 3.2 trillion planets in our galaxy.

And keep in mind, these are just the numbers for our own tiny galaxy. According to NASA, there are about 2 trillion galaxies in the observable universe.

Learn more: https://science.nasa.gov/universe/ex...-big-is-space/

We are not alone

What do you base that last statement on?

After all Canada is about 41 times bigger than United Kingdom but has around 20 million less people?