Government Minister Resignation

[Dorcus]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

I was listening to a podcast at the weekend where a pollster was saying Labour have lost three times as many supporters to the Lib Dems and Greens (and Independents) as they have to Reform - even though the Labour drop matches the Reform rise it has not in the main been a direct switch.

That trend will get bigger after the latest 'Welfare Reform' fiasco and the pledge to support the arms industry at a level not seen for three generations!

Agree and the probable outcome would be some kind of "rainbow coalition from hell" with strange bedfellows. We have a very divided country (World even?)

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

I was listening to a podcast at the weekend where a pollster was saying Labour have lost three times as many supporters to the Lib Dems and Greens (and Independents) as they have to Reform - even though the Labour drop matches the Reform rise it has not in the main been a direct switch.

That trend will get bigger after the latest 'Welfare Reform' fiasco and the pledge to support the arms industry at a level not seen for three generations!

I listened to it as well. It all sounded bleeding obvious to me, but Starmer’s Labour don’t seem to understand that and are fixated by Reform - if there were an election today, I’d vote Green, Plaid or, possibly, Lib Dem and Labour should be far more worried about losing life time supporters like me than they are.

[jon1959]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

John McDonnell's analysis of Labour's lack of leadership, vision, principle and basic competence is (I think) interesting.

His description of the way the Labour Party has been hijacked and gutted is one I recognise. He also thinks there is a high chance of a palace coup against Starmer sooner rather than later.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jul/02/labour-government-welfare-bill-democracy-party-election-john-mcdonnell

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

I was listening to a podcast at the weekend where a pollster was saying Labour have lost three times as many supporters to the Lib Dems and Greens (and Independents) as they have to Reform - even though the Labour drop matches the Reform rise it has not in the main been a direct switch.

That trend will get bigger after the latest 'Welfare Reform' fiasco and the pledge to support the arms industry at a level not seen for three generations!

https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/blogs/ec_rrose_20250630.html

At best a minority government or coalition

I think thats wildly optimistic

Unless starmer is kicked out , Dracula in a pink suit will be prime minister

[JamesWales]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

John McDonnell's analysis of Labour's lack of leadership, vision, principle and basic competence is (I think) interesting.

His description of the way the Labour Party has been hijacked and gutted is one I recognise. He also thinks there is a high chance of a palace coup against Starmer sooner rather than later.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...john-mcdonnell

I quite like John McDonnell on a personal level, but Im not sure he's the best person to advise on hijacking parties and unity etc..or maybe he is?!

Do you think there's any chance of a split? Starting to feel like there is a growing body of MPs on the left of the party who are happy to rebel. A good example of some parties having too large a majority to govern effectively really.

I can't see any formal split but it's starting to feel like a party within a party

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

I was listening to a podcast at the weekend where a pollster was saying Labour have lost three times as many supporters to the Lib Dems and Greens (and Independents) as they have to Reform - even though the Labour drop matches the Reform rise it has not in the main been a direct switch.

That trend will get bigger after the latest 'Welfare Reform' fiasco and the pledge to support the arms industry at a level not seen for three generations!

https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/blogs/ec_rrose_20250630.html

At best a minority government or coalition

I think thats wildly optimistic

Unless starmer is kicked out , Dracula in a pink suit will be prime minister

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

I quite like John McDonnell on a personal level, but Im not sure he's the best person to advise on hijacking parties and unity etc..or maybe he is?!

Do you think there's any chance of a split? Starting to feel like there is a growing body of MPs on the left of the party who are happy to rebel. A good example of some parties having too large a majority to govern effectively really.

I can't see any formal split but it's starting to feel like a party within a party

Leadership challenge first , see some teeth

Then a split if nothing comes of it

[JamesWales]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Leadership challenge first , see some teeth

Then a split if nothing comes of it

Who would you want to challenge him?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

55 percent of welfare budget is on pensioners

165 billion compared to the 5 billion savings they tried to scrounge off people in wheelchairs .....outrageous double standards from all of them


The triple lock is a disaster ..get rid of it or make it a double lock

Lots of room to save billions and billions there

The simple fact is a lot of people on welfare and disability are marginalised and dont have the power of the pensioners lobby ......its not only pensioners who have paid taxes and saved....the discrimination and finger pointing is hypocritical

Welfare payments being generally means tested might bean option with a far better grading .....

If someone is disabled but wealthy its just as stupid to award them 5k a year for taxis as it is to give a wealthy pensioner 200 quid towards an electricity bill which ends up being used for chocolates and sweets for the grandchildren

You aren't going to find me disagreeing with much of that. Double lock might make next to no difference unless you strip out the right markers.

But the real point is that no government can do it. You saw what happened when they tried to do anything to the pensioner cohort, useful idiots working minwage jobs backed them up, people just don't understand how much the wealth of different demographics have shifted since triple lock was introduced.

The only lever the government has is fiscal drag on income tax because most people don't see it happening.

If pip is a payment to support additional spending due to a health condition then it needs to be woven into the NHS (with adequate information and resources). They can then make an assessment as to whether to issue treatment or a payment, it will force the NHS to evolve to a society where mental health is prevalent and provides a trusted layer.

The reality is that the majority of people on pip aren't working, whether they could be is obviously an individual thing but at a basic level, it has become an additional payment to people on uc predominantly and I don't think that was the intention.

And to answer your earlier point re: gdp, this bill was always about pre-empting and mitigating spending increases. I have no issue with people calling it a shambles but from a process perspective governments should be working with the future in mind and we rarely see it.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Who would you want to challenge him?

Stella Creasey, Peter Lamb , Meg Hillier

I wouldn't want any of the old school corbyn wing but I think they are so important for attacking the right and tory lite creeps currently ruling the roost

The people who have switched to liberal and green are not going to be won back by any starmer clones

Lisa Nandy is a real let down , I had high hopes for her several years ago

[JamesWales]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Stella Creasey, Peter Lamb , Meg Hillier

I wouldn't want any of the old school corbyn wing but I think they are so important for attacking the right and tory lite creeps currently ruling the roost

The people who have switched to liberal and green are not going to be won back by any starmer clones

Lisa Nandy is a real let down , I had high hopes for her several years ago

Interesting. I've never even heard of the bloke there. Stella Creasy seems alright but no PM.

I think they would all let you down. Thats the reality of government.

The money saved yesterday will now be found elsewhere. Probably from council tax. That means less money in people's pockets, less growth etc. There's no easy solutions and we are in such a mess, as it should be said, are many Western nations.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Who would you want to challenge him?

Stella Creasey, Peter Lamb , Meg Hillier

I wouldn't want any of the old school corbyn wing but I think they are so important for attacking the right and tory lite creeps currently ruling the roost

The people who have switched to liberal and green are not going to be won back by any starmer clones

Lisa Nandy is a real let down , I had high hopes for her several years ago

[JamesWales]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Stella Creasey, Peter Lamb , Meg Hillier

I wouldn't want any of the old school corbyn wing but I think they are so important for attacking the right and tory lite creeps currently ruling the roost

The people who have switched to liberal and green are not going to be won back by any starmer clones

Lisa Nandy is a real let down , I had high hopes for her several years ago

Yeah you told us this earlier 😂😉

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Interesting. I've never even heard of the bloke there. Stella Creasy seems alright but no PM.

I think they would all let you down. Thats the reality of government.

The money saved yesterday will now be found elsewhere. Probably from council tax. That means less money in people's pockets, less growth etc. There's no easy solutions and we are in such a mess, as it should be said, are many Western nations.

Meg Hillier would also be better

A tin of beans

Anything would be better than starmer

[the other bob wilson]

Re: Government Minister Resignation

Starmer throws his Chancellor under the bus, but, incredibly for a PM with such a big majority, I’m beginning to think he could be gone by the next election.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/jul/02/starmer-tearful-chancellor-rachel-reeves-pmqs