Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

[Eric Cartman]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

I didn't say the southeast was connected, I said a purely economic analysis of the projects is what has led to greater investment in the southeast in recent years. Not just in terms of transport infrastructure, but that does trump expenditure elsewhere.

Fair enough, but what do you think levelling up means? For me it means taxpayer investment in infrastructure, leading to private sector investment and better paying jobs. You have to start at the end, what is need for investment to occur, not 'which potholes are annoying Mary the most?'

[JamesWales]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Fair enough, but what do you think levelling up means? For me it means taxpayer investment in infrastructure, leading to private sector investment and better paying jobs. You have to start at the end, what is need for investment to occur, not 'which potholes are annoying Mary the most?'

For me it absolutely is not best demonstrated by getting people between two cities quicker, esp when you can already get between Manchester and London in a little over two hours and can work on the train if needs be, and there will already be a first phase to come which will deliver some benefits.

Potholes is an extreme example but actually it is the local bus services, train services and road links that really do connect people with their cities and towns that matter more. It helps people socialise and get to jobs that are otherwise not open to them.

I think that's a much better use of money and I wish HS2 had been scrapped or scaled back years ago tbh.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Do you realise how unbelievably patronising you sound?

If the analysis hasn't been made (and I have no reason to believe you on that) then how are you in a position to judge either?

We all have opinions on govt expenditure and the best use of it. I would suggest that using all the funding on getting between two cities quicker is not the best use of that, and greater investment in connecting people to and within their own and neighbouring cities would produce better economic and social incomes.

The approach you suggest is what has led to more investment in the southeast in recent decades as it produces better economic outcomes..on paper at least.

He's got it bang on

You are defending the indefensible

So you need a good verbal slap

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Apparently the £36bn will be allocated across the nation. Let's hope Sunak's favourite area of deprivation gets levelled up as a result. Tunbridge Wells could do with a shiny new station and by-pass😂

Inner City Sevenoaks

Plagued by crime and deprivation

[life on mars]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

I can't see this playing out well for the government, they made a big fuss about the "northern powerhouse". This is an open goal for Labour surely?

Nah Sir Bier has said he won't oppose it there goes Blairs Labour initiated project of misery.

[PontBlue]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

The stupid expensive waste of money should never have been started in the first place.

Much more benefit can be achieved for far less by focusing on regional travel projects and fully electrifying all existing lines.

[Dorcus]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Nah Sir Bier has said he won't oppose it there goes Blairs Labour initiated project of misery.

Sir Kier Muppet!!!

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

For me it absolutely is not best demonstrated by getting people between two cities quicker, esp when you can already get between Manchester and London in a little over two hours and can work on the train if needs be, and there will already be a first phase to come which will deliver some benefits.

Potholes is an extreme example but actually it is the local bus services, train services and road links that really do connect people with their cities and towns that matter more. It helps people socialise and get to jobs that are otherwise not open to them.

I think that's a much better use of money and I wish HS2 had been scrapped or scaled back years ago tbh.

If potholes is an extreme example, why is 25% of the overall diverted money from the Birmingham to Manchester link being allocated across the country allegedly to fix them. I say allegedly as all this is about budgets from the 2029 financial year onwards. Apart from conference gesture politics where Sunak's Network North list is unravelling by the hour what level of confidence do you have that the guy that presented this unravelling wish list would have any say over delivering it?

[JamesWales]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

If potholes is an extreme example, why is 25% of the overall diverted money from the Birmingham to Manchester link being allocated across the country allegedly to fix them. I say allegedly as all this is about budgets from the 2029 financial year onwards. Apart from conference gesture politics where Sunak's Network North list is unravelling by the hour what level of confidence do you have that the guy that presented this unravelling wish list would have any say over delivering it?

Potholes are an extreme example from the list of projects; ie, they are the smallest intervention. But they still impact millions of people who probably get pissed off that their street isn't fixed when we are spending billions on getting people to London half an hour quicker.

The reality is that far more projects can bee funded now and yeah I think that's a good thing. Don't you?

There's no guarantee any of it will be built. That's how politics work. Labour could cancel them all or redirect funding. Some may end up not happening for one reason or another. Drakeford cancelled the M4 relief road that Carwyn Jones wanted for example..that's what happens

It doesn't mean you don't identify and fund anything to move them forward though or else absolutely nothing ever would be built because nothing would get off the drawing board.

Do you not see the value in any of the many projects that they have said will now be funded with the money saved?

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Potholes are an extreme example from the list of projects; ie, they are the smallest intervention. But they still impact millions of people who probably get pissed off that their street isn't fixed when we are spending billions on getting people to London half an hour quicker.

The reality is that far more projects can bee funded now and yeah I think that's a good thing. Don't you?

Why do you think diverting 25% of the supposed budget to potholes and mostly away from the branded Network North is an extreme example?

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/nearly-quarter-saved-hs2-money-27843415

[JamesWales]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

Why do you think diverting 25% of the supposed budget to potholes and mostly away from the branded Network North is an extreme example?

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co...money-27843415

I've said. From the range of projects that will receive funding, from electrification to new roads to trams etc, potholes is an extreme example - the smallest of all those schemes. They still matter to a lot of people though, even if they don't to you.

Again, do you not support any of the projects that will now receive funding previously tied to HS2 then?

Or do you think we can have it all?

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

I've said. From the range of projects that will receive funding, from electrification to new roads to trams etc, potholes is an extreme example - the smallest of all those schemes. They still matter to a lot of people though, even if they don't to you.

Again, do you not support any of the projects that will now receive funding previously tied to HS2 then?

Or do you think we can have it all?

How do you conclude a quarter of this magic fund is extreme? You seem to major on other people's naivety when it comes to politics. Yet you blindly accept Sunak's "reallocation" of a budget starting in 2029 that he will never be in power to spend that suggests a sprinkling of "new" projects from Plymouth to Sunderland via Dover via most marginal constituencies in between, none of which will get started before next year's election like it came down on tablets of stone from Mount Sinai.

To answer your question, who doesn't like an infrastructure proposal? I guess except those who prefer infrastructure implementations!

[JamesWales]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

How do you conclude a quarter of this magic fund is extreme? You seem to major on other people's naivety when it comes to politics. Yet you blindly accept Sunak's "reallocation" of a budget starting in 2029 that he will never be in power to spend that suggests a sprinkling of "new" projects from Plymouth to Sunderland via Dover via most marginal constituencies in between, none of which will get started before next year's election like it came down on tablets of stone from Mount Sinai.

To answer your question, who doesn't like an infrastructure proposal? I guess except those who prefer infrastructure implementations!

I'll say for a third time - potholes are extreme examples of the improvements because they are of a tiny scale compared to rail electrification, trams, road dualling etc. That's why I said that.

I don't blindly accept anything. I do accept reality though. And moaning on here purely because of who made the announcement is futile. And yeah I do also support focusing on a greater number of smaller projects rather than one large one.

Good to see you seem to support the projects that now will receive funding. It goes without saying that in an ideal world everything gets funded, but we don't live in that world.

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: Revised HS2 Is the government right or wrong?

I'll say for a third time - potholes are extreme examples of the improvements because they are of a tiny scale compared to rail electrification, trams, road dualling etc. That's why I said that.

I don't blindly accept anything. I do accept reality though. And moaning on here purely because of who made the announcement is futile. And yeah I do also support focusing on a greater number of smaller projects rather than one large one.

Good to see you seem to support the projects that now will receive funding. It goes without saying that in an ideal world everything gets funded, but we don't live in that world.

I tell you what's futile

You , giving it the nuanced nonsense when yet again today you have spent your time on here defending sunak and his party and followers ....that's you .....going back on what they said they would do

It's their fault and it's your fault because you prop them up

Day in day out your suck up to them , it's cringeworthy nonsense wrapped up in clever dick talk

Maybe one day you will come on here and say christ lads question time was shocking the tory mp was battered and looked totally isolated , the conference was crap , ss braverman is going down a nasty right wing path .....etc etc

A bit of honesty really and acceptance instead of this feathered ego political debating cobblers , you are only fooling yourself

But you havnt got the balls