BreakTheLaw Boris

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

James didn't givd him a pass.

He said he should have resigned.

In fairness, James tempered his suggestion that Johnson should resign. He was equally comfortable with a fulsome apology as long as that apology covered making the lockdowns so long and so severe.

[Tito Fuente]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

James didn't givd him a pass.

He said he should have resigned.

He's said he should have resigned but in the same breath says what he did isn't worth the discussion as it was just tea and cake...

That's giving someone a pass in anyone's book, surely?

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

He's said he should have resigned but in the same breath says what he did isn't worth the discussion as it was just tea and cake...

That's giving someone a pass in anyone's book, surely?

I think what you are struggling with is that some people view things differently to how you view them. I agree, he shouldnt have broken his own rules, he was rightly fined, he has rightly apologised and he should have resigned.

But he hasn't. And frankly, I have bigger things to care about in my personal life and also in terms of any wider political thoughts. He hasn't resigned, he probably isn't going to. What's the point in going on and on about it?

I use the Brexit second referendum argument merely to illustrate my point - I suspect you thought that was a bit naughty to do that without implementing the first referendum. I suspect you may have thought deep down that it was a bit wrong. A bit unfair etc and likely to alienate millions. But I also doubt you were as angry about it or as exercised as me. I saw it as a total affront to democracy, the way you seem to view 'partygate'.

Thats how these things work, and so be it. The world would be dull if we all thought the same and like I said, I just think we all have bigger things to worry about. But I repeat, I think he should have resigned.

[Tito Fuente]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

I think what you are struggling with is that some people view things differently to how you view them. I agree, he shouldnt have broken his own rules, he was rightly fined, he has rightly apologised and he should have resigned.

But he hasn't. And frankly, I have bigger things to care about in my personal life and also in terms of any wider political thoughts. He hasn't resigned, he probably isn't going to. What's the point in going on and on about it?

I use the Brexit second referendum argument merely to illustrate my point - I suspect you thought that was a bit naughty to do that without implementing the first referendum. I suspect you may have thought deep down that it was a bit wrong. A bit unfair etc and likely to alienate millions. But I also doubt you were as angry about it or as exercised as me. I saw it as a total affront to democracy, the way you seem to view 'partygate'.

Thats how these things work, and so be it. The world would be dull if we all thought the same and like I said, I just think we all have bigger things to worry about. But I repeat, I think he should have resigned.

You've got more important things to worry about yet repeatedly tell us we shouldn't care about this. Why waste your time?

Nobody has said that you need to think differently. Ironically people are simply disagreeing with your take on this shambles because we think differently to you. "That's how these things work".

[Eric Cartman]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

But he hasn't. And frankly, I have bigger things to care about in my personal life and also in terms of any wider political thoughts. He hasn't resigned, he probably isn't going to. What's the point in going on and on about it?

So you decide what is important to people now?

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

I think what you are struggling with is that some people view things differently to how you view them. I agree, he shouldnt have broken his own rules, he was rightly fined, he has rightly apologised and he should have resigned.

But he hasn't. And frankly, I have bigger things to care about in my personal life and also in terms of any wider political thoughts. He hasn't resigned, he probably isn't going to. What's the point in going on and on about it?

I use the Brexit second referendum argument merely to illustrate my point - I suspect you thought that was a bit naughty to do that without implementing the first referendum. I suspect you may have thought deep down that it was a bit wrong. A bit unfair etc and likely to alienate millions. But I also doubt you were as angry about it or as exercised as me. I saw it as a total affront to democracy, the way you seem to view 'partygate'.

Thats how these things work, and so be it. The world would be dull if we all thought the same and like I said, I just think we all have bigger things to worry about. But I repeat, I think he should have resigned.

and I repeat, your previous thought on the subject was this equivocation.

He should resign, or offer the mother of apologies, including a strong apology for the extent of the lockdown.

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

So you decide what is important to people now?

F**k me, thats ur take from what I said?!

No, the exact opposite. You can have whatever opinions you like about it. And so too can anyone else. They can think he's done nothing wrong and shouldn't resign. They can thing he's made a minor mistake and apologise. They can think he's made a huge error and should resign, they can think he's committed the political crime of the century and should be in prison for it.

People will always interpret things differently depending on their priorities and strength of feeling for the topic. And that's fine, it's up to them. Like I said, there will be stuff you are probably okay with that I think are absolutely awful and take more seriously. Thats the way of it.

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

and I repeat, your previous thought on the subject was this equivocation.

He should resign, or offer the mother of apologies, including a strong apology for the extent of the lockdown.

I think this is what I said more recently. A month or two ago, when the photos first emerged, I said he should resign. But he didn't.

But yes, that is what I thought. I think the severity of lockdown (and perhaps it was necessary) caused enormous mental anguish for millions. I stand by that. I know what it was like for me and my family and that's why I care more about that than cake gate.

Johnsons social gatherings made me lose a lot of respect for him and exposed him as a liar. Lockdown and WFH made me question the benefits of being here - so thats why I get more exercised about the latter than the former.

[Eric Cartman]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

F**k me, thats ur take from what I said?!

No, the exact opposite. You can have whatever opinions you like about it. And so too can anyone else. They can think he's done nothing wrong and shouldn't resign. They can thing he's made a minor mistake and apologise. They can think he's made a huge error and should resign, they can think he's committed the political crime of the century and should be in prison for it.

People will always interpret things differently depending on their priorities and strength of feeling for the topic. And that's fine, it's up to them. Like I said, there will be stuff you are probably okay with that I think are absolutely awful and take more seriously. Thats the way of it.

It's more my take from the 'I am concentrating on the important stuff' vibe you are giving off. If there is a conversation about something you don't get care about, don't respond. I swerve the vast majority of the American politics threads on this board because I couldn't give a ****, I don't go in there telling them to get over it.

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

I think this is what I said more recently. A month or two ago, when the photos first emerged, I said he should resign. But he didn't.

But yes, that is what I thought. I think the severity of lockdown (and perhaps it was necessary) caused enormous mental anguish for millions. I stand by that. I know what it was like for me and my family and that's why I care more about that than cake gate.

Johnsons social gatherings made me lose a lot of respect for him and exposed him as a liar. Lockdown and WFH made me question the benefits of being here - so thats why I get more exercised about the latter than the former.

I sort of get your point that we all see the lockdown stuff from a personal perspective. Me, being denied access to my incapacitated Mum in a care home for a year and attending my father in law's funeral after his premature death with covid with 9 other people. You with your frank recognition of the impact it had on your mental health, others on the detrimental impact it had on their business.

We all, each in own way suffered. Running through this though is an unfit Prime Minister who's behaviour and hypocrisy laughed at us all until he was caught, then lied when caught because that's what he has seemingly done all his life.

I don't share the view that all Tories are scum that sometimes populates this Board. Personally if someone gave me a choice of a left leaning party losing the next election because the Tory Party came to its senses and ejected Johnson and his immoral cabal and coalesced around decent (there's that word again) people, I would take it every time.

Every day he stays in power demeans us all. No doubt if he does he will come up with ever more populist headline grabbing nonsense like the Rwandan stuff to turn the headlights on full beam into voters eyes.

I think you are a decent person who generally argues his corner well. It will be interesting to see how far you run with his hounds!

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

It's more my take from the 'I am concentrating on the important stuff' vibe you are giving off. If there is a conversation about something you don't get care about, don't respond. I swerve the vast majority of the American politics threads on this board because I couldn't give a ****, I don't go in there telling them to get over it.

I don't think I've told anyone to get over it. People are welcome to remain furious about it if they want. Others will be annoyed more concerned by other issues. Thats fine, I'm sure there is space and tolerance enough for all those views here.

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

I sort of get your point that we all see the lockdown stuff from a personal perspective. Me, being denied access to my incapacitated Mum in a care home for a year and attending my father in law's funeral after his premature death with covid with 9 other people. You with your frank recognition of the impact it had on your mental health, others on the detrimental impact it had on their business.

We all, each in own way suffered. Running through this though is an unfit Prime Minister who's behaviour and hypocrisy laughed at us all until he was caught, then lied when caught because that's what he has seemingly done all his life.

I don't share the view that all Tories are scum that sometimes populates this Board. Personally if someone gave me a choice of a left leaning party losing the next election because the Tory Party came to its senses and ejected Johnson and his immoral cabal and coalesced around decent (there's that word again) people, I would take it every time.

Every day he stays in power demeans us all. No doubt if he does he will come up with ever more populist headline grabbing nonsense like the Rwandan stuff to turn the headlights on full beam into voters eyes.

I think you are a decent person who generally argues his corner well. It will be interesting to see how far you run with his hounds!

Yeah, I really do understand your position. It must have been horrible experience with your parents.

My experience was different. My father is ill with a long term degenerative disease. He had endless appointments cancelled and friends stopped calling. My mother is well, but became a recluse. I had the worst mental health I have ever experienced by a country mile. Relationships became very strained. My kids missed lots of school, it felt they were raised by youtube.

That is why I am so proud that the vaccine was our road out of all that horror. We did lead the world on that, and that call was made by the PM. These are just facts.

To me the positives of getting that call right defeats the negative of his indiscretions and rule breaking by a huge margin. It's not that I defend it, I just place less of an emphasis on it than other things.

Other people will view things differently. I absolutely understand the position of people who didnt attend funerals etc and then realise he was having cake with colleagues etc. I get it, I really do.

Covid has just been an absolutely shit thing, it's f***d with us all. I just want to move on from it all if I am honest.

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

Yeah, I really do understand your position. It must have been horrible experience with your parents.

My experience was different. My father is ill with a long term degenerative disease. He had endless appointments cancelled and friends stopped calling. My mother is well, but became a recluse. I had the worst mental health I have ever experienced by a country mile. Relationships became very strained. My kids missed lots of school, it felt they were raised by youtube.

That is why I am so proud that the vaccine was our road out of all that horror. We did lead the world on that, and that call was made by the PM. These are just facts.

To me the positives of getting that call right defeats the negative of his indiscretions and rule breaking by a huge margin. It's not that I defend it, I just place less of an emphasis on it than other things.

Other people will view things differently. I absolutely understand the position of people who didnt attend funerals etc and then realise he was having cake with colleagues etc. I get it, I really do.

Covid has just been an absolutely shit thing, it's f***d with us all. I just want to move on from it all if I am honest.

Yes, but move on to what?

There probably isn't a person in this country of 70 or so million who hasn't been impacted by the way that covid was handled. They will all have their story to tell. Yet the thing that seems to get you proactive and responsive at the moment is dealing with asylum seekers. I can't ever recall meeting one or them having a profound effect positively or negatively on my life. Yet you consider it unbelievable and somewhat shameful that I don't get as worked up about the matter as you obviously do!

[JamesWales]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

Yes, but move on to what?

There probably isn't a person in this country of 70 or so million who hasn't been impacted by the way that covid was handled. They will all have their story to tell. Yet the thing that seems to get you proactive and responsive at the moment is dealing with asylum seekers. I can't ever recall meeting one or them having a profound effect positively or negatively on my life. Yet you consider it unbelievable and somewhat shameful that I don't get as worked up about the matter as you obviously do!

Move onto a world not dominated by covid politics.

In the real world, I havent said a word about it. However, I believe I said it unbelievable and somewhat shameful that people are happy to tolerate the current human trafficking gangs and wider criminal industry that we have effectively outsourced the process to. To which I think you replied that you did and offered an alternative idea (which i suspect wouldnt work). Apologies if I have got the order of that wrong.

There is a different thread for all that mind isn't there..

[cyril evans awaydays]

Re: BreakTheLaw Boris

Move onto a world not dominated by covid politics.

In the real world, I havent said a word about it. However, I believe I said it unbelievable and somewhat shameful that people are happy to tolerate the current human trafficking gangs and wider criminal industry that we have effectively outsourced the process to. To which I think you replied that you did and offered an alternative idea (which i suspect wouldnt work). Apologies if I have got the order of that wrong.

There is a different thread for all that mind isn't there..

Here's your quote

Honestly, its unbelievable and somewhat shameful how you are okay with the status quo.

You decide if it's general or personal!