The New Iron Lady

[az city]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Mega rich and the Wannabees

Careful, I could point out they all also voted for Brexit.

[Dorcus]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Careful, I could point out they all also voted for Brexit.

👍

[SLUDGE FACTORY]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Are this 21% thick as pig shit or something?

They are tory filth

Hard core

Most of the wet Tories have jumped ship

[lardy]

Re: The New Iron Lady

General Elections very rarely turn out according to mid term polls.

We've been here before with Millinand. There's a long way to go

We definitely weren't "here" with milliband.

[HyperboreanCCFC]

Re: The New Iron Lady

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a UK poll lead that big. As Dorcus says, a lot can change in two years, but, with Labour having enjoyed an almost uniquely stress free conference while the new PM is making Johnson look like a political genius, this is beginning to have the look of another 1997.

Absolutely no chance of it being another 1997 in my view. Conservative have a massive majority that would be hard to overturn in one GE.

[life on mars]

Re: The New Iron Lady

In a basic reply to Truss being a new Iron Lady we will find out soon she needs to prove she ain't for turning , I note the glee from Labour about the chaos ..

Pity the BOE was so late to the party of rate rises and wrongely assuming inflation was temporary , that mistake was seen accross many other European banks . ..

My gut feeling this chaos was planned .. it's happened before .

I remember intrest rares at 9% .

With multiple strikes taking place its good to see they can afford lesser pay.

[lardy]

Re: The New Iron Lady

In a basic reply to Truss being a new Iron Lady we will find out soon she needs to prove she ain't for turning , I note the glee from Labour about the chaos ..

Pity the BOE was so late to the party of rate rises and wrongely assuming inflation was temporary , that mistake was seen accross many other European banks . ..

My gut feeling this chaos was planned .. it's happened before .

I remember intrest rares at 9% .

With multiple strikes taking place its good to see they can afford lesser pay.

This is a real "where do you start with this?" post.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The New Iron Lady

In a basic reply to Truss being a new Iron Lady we will find out soon she needs to prove she ain't for turning , I note the glee from Labour about the chaos ..

Pity the BOE was so late to the party of rate rises and wrongely assuming inflation was temporary , that mistake was seen accross many other European banks . ..

My gut feeling this chaos was planned .. it's happened before .

I remember intrest rares at 9% .

With multiple strikes taking place its good to see they can afford lesser pay.

I'm not biting, just telling you for your own good that you're trying too hard now and making yourself look a berk in the process.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Absolutely no chance of it being another 1997 in my view. Conservative have a massive majority that would be hard to overturn in one GE.

I agree it will be very hard for Labour to overturn such a big majority, but, having never had a poll deficit level of a third of what this one is which I can remember under Johnson's leadership despite all of the scandals, cock ups and dodgy dealings, I keep thinking about a quote I've heard a few times this week about it taking years to build up a reputation for competence and a minute to lose it.

Truss has none of Johnson's, alleged, charisma and I don't think your average voter likes her. She would have to be a pretty good Prime Minister to get people on her side I reckon and, at the moment, she's a laughing stock because of schoolgirl errors she's made which, increasingly I'm hearing have a lot to do with arrogance on her and Kwateng's part. Although the polls are certain to close and she could yet win in 2024, I don't see this week being forgotten by a significant number of people who voted Tory in 2019, it does all feel like the same sort of impact as Black Wednesday in 1992.

[superfeathers]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Absolutely no chance of it being another 1997 in my view. Conservative have a massive majority that would be hard to overturn in one GE.

I'd have agreed with your 2019 sentiment back then. An awful lot has changed since then and a lot of this dirt has stuck.
I genuinely couldn't write a list because it would be too long.
The interesting thing is that they have introduced the drop in the lower rate of income tax a year early. It was pretty clear that they were hoping to use this to win back voters prior to the GE.
Not sure what they'll use now. Not Liz Truss` personality in the Boris way, that's for sure.

[JamesWales]

Re: The New Iron Lady

I think the 33% lead is probably an outlier - two more since put it at 21% and 20%; still massive, well above the 6-10% lead of the week before and well above the lead in the last months of Johnsons reign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_United_Kingdom_general_election

The last week will go down as how not to manage a budget that contained in all honestly only moderately controversial issues - the market was (is) properly spooked. Strikes me the absence of OBR involvement and going well beyond what they promised, alongside a general feeling of rushing and of course more borrowing created the big issue. The interviews yesterday were also a textbook mistake. There may be a benefit in talking to 'local markets' on the radio but yesterday wasn't it. In doing several 5 minute interviews she set herself up for a fall. One longer one would have made more sense. There was good economic data this morning (GDP in Q2 revised up, current account not as bad as expected, business investment up more than expected) and the market is already returning to some normality - what happens in the longer term remains to be seen.

Labour had a good conference. Really, they just need to keep their nose clean and they will probably win the next general election even if it isn't for another two years or more. If there was an election tomorrow I would vote Labour. But there isn't one tomorrow..

There is every chance that the policies announced will work economically and Labour will need to consider that. It is also a fact, whether you guys like it or not, that every western (especially European) country really is going through very severe economic issues, sometimes slightly different to our own, sometimes the same..sometimes slightly worse, sometimes slightly better. Until Ukraine is sorted, nothing is sorted.

We are in very choppy waters and that undoubtedly benefits the opposition, just as it benefits pretty much every opposition party in the world. Combine that with a detoxified Labour Party, who are now seen as more economically competent and with a likeable leader and you have all the hallmarks of Labour retaining their lead.

That said, I reiterate, IMO there is every chance these economic changes work and I do think this 33% poll is a low point, not the norm.

[superfeathers]

Re: The New Iron Lady

I think the 33% lead is probably an outlier - two more since put it at 21% and 20%; still massive, well above the 6-10% lead of the week before and well above the lead in the last months of Johnsons reign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_United_Kingdom_general_election

The last week will go down as how not to manage a budget that contained in all honestly only moderately controversial issues - the market was (is) properly spooked. Strikes me the absence of OBR involvement and going well beyond what they promised, alongside a general feeling of rushing and of course more borrowing created the big issue. The interviews yesterday were also a textbook mistake. There may be a benefit in talking to 'local markets' on the radio but yesterday wasn't it. In doing several 5 minute interviews she set herself up for a fall. One longer one would have made more sense. There was good economic data this morning (GDP in Q2 revised up, current account not as bad as expected, business investment up more than expected) and the market is already returning to some normality - what happens in the longer term remains to be seen.

Labour had a good conference. Really, they just need to keep their nose clean and they will probably win the next general election even if it isn't for another two years or more. If there was an election tomorrow I would vote Labour. But there isn't one tomorrow..

There is every chance that the policies announced will work economically and Labour will need to consider that. It is also a fact, whether you guys like it or not, that every western (especially European) country really is going through very severe economic issues, sometimes slightly different to our own, sometimes the same..sometimes slightly worse, sometimes slightly better. Until Ukraine is sorted, nothing is sorted.

We are in very choppy waters and that undoubtedly benefits the opposition, just as it benefits pretty much every opposition party in the world. Combine that with a detoxified Labour Party, who are now seen as more economically competent and with a likeable leader and you have all the hallmarks of Labour retaining their lead.

That said, I reiterate, IMO there is every chance these economic changes work and I do think this 33% poll is a low point, not the norm.

Good balanced view. Except where you go down the Truss route that every European country is in financial crisis. They're all struggling no doubt, but none have tanked like the UK has over the last week.
You're right in that these measures may work, my opinion is that they might but to nowhere near the extent that they hope. The biggest issue that the Tories face is that they've shown their hand in such a big way and shown who they are on the side of, i.e. the wealthy. People won't forget that. And on the other side you've got the middle classes questioning whether they can be trusted with managing the finances, which is the one thing they could supposedly be trusted with.

You said that at the moment, you'd vote labour, as would I.
I was previously a slightly left leaning, fairly centre voter. So my mind could have been changed.
I can hand on heart say that there's not a single thing that this government could possibly come up with, that would make me vote for them.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The New Iron Lady

I think the 33% lead is probably an outlier - two more since put it at 21% and 20%; still massive, well above the 6-10% lead of the week before and well above the lead in the last months of Johnsons reign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_United_Kingdom_general_election

The last week will go down as how not to manage a budget that contained in all honestly only moderately controversial issues - the market was (is) properly spooked. Strikes me the absence of OBR involvement and going well beyond what they promised, alongside a general feeling of rushing and of course more borrowing created the big issue. The interviews yesterday were also a textbook mistake. There may be a benefit in talking to 'local markets' on the radio but yesterday wasn't it. In doing several 5 minute interviews she set herself up for a fall. One longer one would have made more sense. There was good economic data this morning (GDP in Q2 revised up, current account not as bad as expected, business investment up more than expected) and the market is already returning to some normality - what happens in the longer term remains to be seen.

Labour had a good conference. Really, they just need to keep their nose clean and they will probably win the next general election even if it isn't for another two years or more. If there was an election tomorrow I would vote Labour. But there isn't one tomorrow..

There is every chance that the policies announced will work economically and Labour will need to consider that. It is also a fact, whether you guys like it or not, that every western (especially European) country really is going through very severe economic issues, sometimes slightly different to our own, sometimes the same..sometimes slightly worse, sometimes slightly better. Until Ukraine is sorted, nothing is sorted.

We are in very choppy waters and that undoubtedly benefits the opposition, just as it benefits pretty much every opposition party in the world. Combine that with a detoxified Labour Party, who are now seen as more economically competent and with a likeable leader and you have all the hallmarks of Labour retaining their lead.

That said, I reiterate, IMO there is every chance these economic changes work and I do think this 33% poll is a low point, not the norm.

Tell me James, how many other countries have been given detention and lines by the IMF this week and how many other countries Governments have had their central bank bail them out because there was going to be a run on pension funds? We've seen all sorts of ridiculous excuses for the complete fiasco which took place seven days ago ranging from it being the Labour party's fault to Remainer traders being behind it all (I notice this morning, Life on Mars, bless him, is trying to blame Trade Unions it would appear).

The fact is that, after sacking a possible calming influence and turning down the OBR's offer of the usual budget analysis, the two most powerful members of the Government have made themselves look like, at worst, total idiots who have made enemies out of people who vote Tory normally or, at best, a pair of arrogant zealots who took a huge gamble with the nation's finances and got lucky - after the Bank of England stepped in to save their skins of course.

[JamesWales]

Re: The New Iron Lady

Tell me James, how many other countries have been given detention and lines by the IMF this week and how many other countries Governments have had their central bank bail them out because there was going to be a run on pension funds? We've seen all sorts of ridiculous excuses for the complete fiasco which took place seven days ago ranging from it being the Labour party's fault to Remainer traders being behind it all (I notice this morning, Life on Mars, bless him, is trying to blame Trade Unions it would appear).

The fact is that, after sacking a possible calming influence and turning down the OBR's offer of the usual budget analysis, the two most powerful members of the Government have made themselves look like, at worst, total idiots who have made enemies out of people who vote Tory normally or, at best, a pair of arrogant zealots who took a huge gamble with the nation's finances and got lucky - after the Bank of England stepped in to save their skins of course.

No one is questioning the mistakes of the last week - indeed, I have reiterated them myself.

What I'm saying is that within a few days normality could be entirely returned (or not) and then we are back in the realistic scenario where many of the economic indicators are worse over the channel than they are here.

This thread seems to be about the next general election, for that is what the poll refers to...the last week has proven to be a shitshow. The next week may not. The next month, year, may be very different, and that's what I'm saying.

[lardy]

Re: The New Iron Lady

No one is questioning the mistakes of the last week - indeed, I have reiterated them myself.

What I'm saying is that within a few days normality could be entirely returned (or not) and then we are back in the realistic scenario where many of the economic indicators are worse over the channel than they are here.

This thread seems to be about the next general election, for that is what the poll refers to...the last week has proven to be a shitshow. The next week may not. The next month, year, may be very different, and that's what I'm saying.

When the Prime Minister does a media morning and shows she absolutely does not understand what she was talking about, I'm not confident that next week will be much of an improvement.