The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Is he the left back who replaced Cunningham in the game the other week (was it bristol?)
I thought he looked pretty good

Yes it was, shame he's another left back, we could do with someone like him playing right back at the moment.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

2-0, header by Isaak Davies from a cross by Keiron Evans.

[jon1959]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

FT 2 - 0.

I enjoyed that. The u23s played some good stuff at times.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Finished 2-0, pretty comfortable for City in the second half with only an excellent late George Ratcliffe save to suggest that Hull could get back into things. Benkovic had a good second half before going off towards the end and I was impressed by Denham alongside him. Dan Martin, not quite as impressive after the break as he was before it, but I'd still give him Man of the Match.

[City123]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Yes it was, shame he's another left back, we could do with someone like him playing right back at the moment.

Play him on the right and we'll get a series in the Athletic gushing over our inverted wing backs

[Former Labour leader]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Good to see u23s get off mark

[Loramski]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Yes it was, shame he's another left back, we could do with someone like him playing right back at the moment.

I was slightly surprised to see he was still here at the start of the season. 21 now and 4th choice at left back, he wouldn't even have been first choice at under-23 level, so I'm not sure what the plan was for him but he's suddenly found himself in a good position here and he didn't do himself any harm today either. It will be interesting to see what happens with Bagan and Martin in January if Bennett and Cunningham are both fit again.

[Rjk]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

I was slightly surprised to see he was still here at the start of the season. 21 now and 4th choice at left back, he wouldn't even have been first choice at under-23 level, so I'm not sure what the plan was for him but he's suddenly found himself in a good position here and he didn't do himself any harm today either. It will be interesting to see what happens with Bagan and Martin in January if Bennett and Cunningham are both fit again.

To me it would make sense to see where we are come January. If we have a realistic shout of the playoffs, and Bagan and/or Martin aren't showing enough consistency yet at left back then by all means bring Cunningham or Bennett back in.

If we are looking consigned to mid-table obscurity, then that would seem to be the ideal time to bring the youngsters through. They are both out of contract in the summer, and probably on large wages for us, both having been with us in the premier league.
If we could get one of them up to first team level and the other a capable understudy then that would be ideal as it's be a huge chunk off the wage bill, and one less position to have to address in the summer.

[Loramski]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

To me it would make sense to see where we are come January. If we have a realistic shout of the playoffs, and Bagan and/or Martin aren't showing enough consistency yet at left back then by all means bring Cunningham or Bennett back in.

If we are looking consigned to mid-table obscurity, then that would seem to be the ideal time to bring the youngsters through. They are both out of contract in the summer, and probably on large wages for us, both having been with us in the premier league.
If we could get one of them up to first team level and the other a capable understudy then that would be ideal as it's be a huge chunk off the wage bill, and one less position to have to address in the summer.

The thing about the Championship is that there is rarely a season with many 'dead' games. We've got a bit of time on our side with Bagan, he's just turned 19 so there's no rush to decide whether he's going to stay at left back or go back to centre-half, no big worry if he has a bad patch or picks up an injury. We should be able to bring him through at a pace that suits both him and the club.

Martin presents a different issue. 21 but still hasn't played above the 6th tier so we can't be sure where we are with him. His third season here so presumably the club see some potential but, as we found with Ajayi, it can be tricky to establish how good players are, and how long you wait to find out, when they're still waiting for any kind of breakthrough at that age and good players are standing in their way here.

Martin is an eye catching player, runs up and down his touchline all game but so did Declan John, David Tutonda and Cameron Coxe, among others, before him. Morison and Harris will have a good idea of his level but would surely want more proof of it before they throw him straight into a Championship game. They could be an injury to Bagan away from being forced to though.

[Rjk]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

The thing about the Championship is that there is rarely a season with many 'dead' games. We've got a bit of time on our side with Bagan, he's just turned 19 so there's no rush to decide whether he's going to stay at left back or go back to centre-half, no big worry if he has a bad patch or picks up an injury. We should be able to bring him through at a pace that suits both him and the club.

Martin presents a different issue. 21 but still hasn't played above the 6th tier so we can't be sure where we are with him. His third season here so presumably the club see some potential but, as we found with Ajayi, it can be tricky to establish how good players are, and how long you wait to find out, when they're still waiting for any kind of breakthrough at that age and good players are standing in their way here.

Martin is an eye catching player, runs up and down his touchline all game but so did Declan John, David Tutonda and Cameron Coxe, among others, before him. Morison and Harris will have a good idea of his level but would surely want more proof of it before they throw him straight into a Championship game. They could be an injury to Bagan away from being forced to though.

you've got to make time for bringing players through or otherwise it just doesn't happen.
if we aren't going to be brave and risk them now and again, and accept we will lose the odd game due to inexperience as they develop then we may as well get rid of the academy altogether.

Bagan has had these 2 games because we have 2 senior players injured at the same time. when they're fit we will see whether we genuinely have any appetite to bring through youth at this club.

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

you've got to make time for bringing players through or otherwise it just doesn't happen.
if we aren't going to be brave and risk them now and again, and accept we will lose the odd game due to inexperience as they develop then we may as well get rid of the academy altogether.

Bagan has had these 2 games because we have 2 senior players injured at the same time. when they're fit we will see whether we genuinely have any appetite to bring through youth at this club.

I'd say Bagan has had two seven out of ten games in the last week. Would a "senior" player hold on to their place if they had come in because of injuries and produced the exact same pair of performances that Bagan has? I suspect they would.

[Loramski]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

I'd say Bagan has had two seven out of ten games in the last week. Would a "senior" player hold on to their place if they had come in because of injuries and produced the exact same pair of performances that Bagan has? I suspect they would.

Agreed. How would you resolve the left back situation here in January assuming all of them are fit?

[the other bob wilson]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Agreed. How would you resolve the left back situation here in January assuming all of them are fit?

Not much to add to what you and Rjk said really. I'd say one at most out of Bennett and Cunningham will be here next season and it may be neither if they both continue to miss games with injury. What we've seen of Bagan in the first team so far suggests that it could be possible come January to look at him and say I want him to be our first choice left back from now on, but I think it's unlikely because, as you say, it is such a rarity to have time at the end of the season to "build for the future" and that time would certainly not start in January!

As for Martin, I think he could definitely be loaned out to a club in, say, League Two if he continues to perform like he did yesterday, but, despite the talk of our first team wanting to play differently, I don't see much evidence yet of us wanting to use Martin type players at full back - I was struck by how much Bacuna got into the Boro penalty area on Saturday after he came on and I think Osei-Tutu may become more attacking in his outlook once he's more settled here, but, for now, I'm not seeing too much difference in our full back play to recent seasons.

[Loramski]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

Not much to add to what you and Rjk said really. I'd say one at most out of Bennett and Cunningham will be here next season and it may be neither if they both continue to miss games with injury. What we've seen of Bagan in the first team so far suggests that it could be possible come January to look at him and say I want him to be our first choice left back from now on, but I think it's unlikely because, as you say, it is such a rarity to have time at the end of the season to "build for the future" and that time would certainly not start in January!

As for Martin, I think he could definitely be loaned out to a club in, say, League Two if he continues to perform like he did yesterday, but, despite the talk of our first team wanting to play differently, I don't see much evidence yet of us wanting to use Martin type players at full back - I was struck by how much Bacuna got into the Boro penalty area on Saturday after he came on and I think Osei-Tutu may become more attacking in his outlook once he's more settled here, but, for now, I'm not seeing too much difference in our full back play to recent seasons.

It was interesting to hear Mourinho after the Burnley game the other night. He said he wanted to push for the win and was thinking of bringing Reguilon on but was worried about losing the defensive qualities that Ben Davies brings. I guess that's the permanent dilemma that a manager faces and while Harris is talking about the idea of 'explosive' full backs he's still wary of committing to it for now.

[Rjk]

Re: The Bluebirds Academy and DVP thread...

The same applies to Mark Harris, it may be that they're both involved with the first team if, as often happens, they operate with a twenty man squad.

1-0 at half time, City the better side for most of the time, but they were hanging on a bit towards half time - Dan Martin the stand out player for me so far.

It's difficult to see a Route for Harris into the side at the moment, we play 1 up top most of the time. If Moore gets injured we'll play Glatzel - then at some point Vassell will be back as well (maybe).

For D'Almeida we've got 4 "central midfielders" in Vaulks, Pack, Ralls and Bacuna, and we have 2 or 3 of them on the pitch at the same time, so agin we are likely to be waiting for at least one probably 2 being out injured to even make a bench.

If we hadn't had 2 left backs and a right back out injured at the same time then Bagan would probably not had his chance. It shouldn't be any wonder that we never bring any players through if we rely on a freak injury crisis to be able to give them game time.