127 is the answer

[The Bloop]

Doesn't matter how many temporary visas the government make available for EU nationals if only a fraction of them are taken up.

[JumpersforGoalposts]

Re: 127 is the answer

Doesn't matter how many temporary visas the government make available for EU nationals if only a fraction of them are taken up.

I think Mick is more likely to go with 721 as his next bit of tactical genius.

[Bobby Dandruff]

Re: 127 is the answer

Doesn't matter how many temporary visas the government make available for EU nationals if only a fraction of them are taken up.

Isn’t it only 27 btw?

[Former Labour leader]

Re: 127 is the answer

Isn’t it only 27 btw?

127 HGV drivers

Who in their right mind thought the scheme would work?

[Bobby Dandruff]

Re: 127 is the answer

127 HGV drivers

Who in their right mind thought the scheme would work?

Ah. The Times is reporting ‘Visas attract just 27 fuel drivers from the EU’

Thank goodness for Brexit, heh? :-/

[The Bloop]

Re: 127 is the answer

Ah. The Times is reporting ‘Visas attract just 27 fuel drivers from the EU’

Thank goodness for Brexit, heh? :-/

Boris said it was 127 on TV this morning. Surely he didn't get that incorrect?

[JamesWales]

Re: 127 is the answer

Looks like we will have to raise pay, conditions, increase training, maybe create some apprenticeships and create a sustainable economy around the delivery of vital produce that doesn't rely on labour coming in from abroad. No bad thing in the long run, as long as the immigration system is flexible enough to deal with these issues when things have settled down more.

Probably never been a better time in 50 years for people in Britain looking to move into traditional working class jobs.

[lardy]

Re: 127 is the answer

Looks like we will have to raise pay, conditions, increase training, maybe create some apprenticeships and create a sustainable economy around the delivery of vital produce that doesn't rely on labour coming in from abroad. No bad thing in the long run, as long as the immigration system is flexible enough to deal with these issues when things have settled down more.

Probably never been a better time in 50 years for people in Britain looking to move into traditional working class jobs.

Yay! Everything's brilliant!

[JamesWales]

Re: 127 is the answer

Yay! Everything's brilliant!

It's not a case of everything being brilliant, but it's a case of recognising reality, seeing where the economy is going and extracting positives.

It's a sad reality that income inequality has massively grown in this country in the last 40-50 years, and traditional working class jobs in many (not all) cases have born the brunt of that, even though they are often the jobs that the country relies upon to keep going.

We have seen this month how important lorry drivers are. It's time that was recognised and the rates of pay and conditions were increased.

Personally, I view that as a long term positive and greater self sufficiency is more economically and environmentally sustainable in the long run.

[Feedback]

Re: 127 is the answer

It's not a case of everything being brilliant, but it's a case of recognising reality, seeing where the economy is going and extracting positives.

It's a sad reality that income inequality has massively grown in this country in the last 40-50 years, and traditional working class jobs in many (not all) cases have born the brunt of that, even though they are often the jobs that the country relies upon to keep going.

We have seen this month how important lorry drivers are. It's time that was recognised and the rates of pay and conditions were increased.

Personally, I view that as a long term positive and greater self sufficiency is more economically and environmentally sustainable in the long run.

The only political state that aims for autarky is North Korea. Self sustainment isn't all you wish it to be.

I also wonder if these higher wages were at the forefront of yours and every other pro-Brexit supporters thinking 12 months ago? for me its all about changing the narrative now the impact of Brexit is being felt. No-one gave a **** about the lorry drivers back in 2000 when we last had a strike, but now all of a sudden its only right they have a pay rise. utter bollocks.

[JamesWales]

Re: 127 is the answer

The only political state that aims for autarky is North Korea. Self sustainment isn't all you wish it to be.

I also wonder if these higher wages were at the forefront of yours and every other pro-Brexit supporters thinking 12 months ago? for me its all about changing the narrative now the impact of Brexit is being felt. No-one gave a **** about the lorry drivers back in 2000 when we last had a strike, but now all of a sudden its only right they have a pay rise. utter bollocks.

Firstly, yes, improving wages and living standards for poorer communities generally was a part of my reasoning for voting leave. Not the biggest reason, but a part. Although I should add, if i had 100 votes, 45 of them would have been for Remain, so it's a balanced argument. But yes, it was. I don't agree in a totally laissez faire, deregulated economic model such as the single market.

Secondly, I don't think arguing for investment in training, apprenticeships, increases in wages or conditions makes someone an advocate for North Korea. No one advocates 'total self sufficiency' it's about 'greater self sufficiency' and that, I would argue is a good thing. It certainly is rarely a bad thing especially when we have a crisis of disaffected youth, communities and training. It makes sense to try and fill some of these gaps closer to home really.

Thirdly, I didn't pay any attention to the 2000 lorry strike as I would have been getting pissed in the student union and chatting up girls but I probably would have had sympathy for their concerns if not all of their actions.

The point is, what is your answer? Rewind history? Open up visas? We've just done that, there is a shortage in the EU too, and a global pandemic on.

The long term sustainable route to this is to make critical jobs like HGV drivers valued, trained and respected properly and make it a viable line of work for people.

Hopefully that happens and I don't see why anyone would oppose that ambition.

[lardy]

Re: 127 is the answer

Firstly, yes, improving wages and living standards for poorer communities generally was a part of my reasoning for voting leave. Not the biggest reason, but a part. Although I should add, if i had 100 votes, 45 of them would have been for Remain, so it's a balanced argument. But yes, it was. I don't agree in a totally laissez faire, deregulated economic model such as the single market.

Secondly, I don't think arguing for investment in training, apprenticeships, increases in wages or conditions makes someone an advocate for North Korea. No one advocates 'total self sufficiency' it's about 'greater self sufficiency' and that, I would argue is a good thing. It certainly is rarely a bad thing especially when we have a crisis of disaffected youth, communities and training. It makes sense to try and fill some of these gaps closer to home really.

Thirdly, I didn't pay any attention to the 2000 lorry strike as I would have been getting pissed in the student union and chatting up girls but I probably would have had sympathy for their concerns if not all of their actions.

The point is, what is your answer? Rewind history? Open up visas? We've just done that, there is a shortage in the EU too, and a global pandemic on.

The long term sustainable route to this is to make critical jobs like HGV drivers valued, trained and respected properly and make it a viable line of work for people.

Hopefully that happens and I don't see why anyone would oppose that ambition.

A couple of weeks ago, I guessed your age as 40-43. Looks like I was pretty much spot on!

[JamesWales]

Re: 127 is the answer

A couple of weeks ago, I guessed your age as 40-43. Looks like I was pretty much spot on!

:ayatollah:

[Feedback]

Re: 127 is the answer

Firstly, yes, improving wages and living standards for poorer communities generally was a part of my reasoning for voting leave. Not the biggest reason, but a part. Although I should add, if i had 100 votes, 45 of them would have been for Remain, so it's a balanced argument. But yes, it was. I don't agree in a totally laissez faire, deregulated economic model such as the single market.

time will tell but I think leaving the worlds largest free market so we can sell widgets to Micronesia tariff free isn't going to have positive impact you think it will.

Secondly, I don't think arguing for investment in training, apprenticeships, increases in wages or conditions makes someone an advocate for North Korea. No one advocates 'total self sufficiency' it's about 'greater self sufficiency' and that, I would argue is a good thing. It certainly is rarely a bad thing especially when we have a crisis of disaffected youth, communities and training. It makes sense to try and fill some of these gaps closer to home really.

I was making a point that we live in a global economy and looking to ensure that we can provide all of what we need from within these shores is very American in thinking. We import most of our food, fuel, energy, and building materials. If we try and become any more self-sufficient then we'll fail. The reason we left the EU is so we could forge our own trade deals. Great, we can buy kraft cheese to put on our burgers duty free. but the big purchases like German and French cars, lets whack 10% on to the cost. do you understand why we are seeing inflation at 4% ?

Thirdly, I didn't pay any attention to the 2000 lorry strike as I would have been getting pissed in the student union and chatting up girls but I probably would have had sympathy for their concerns if not all of their actions.

you would have been the only one, as most people back then were pissed off with the inconvenience.

The point is, what is your answer? Rewind history? Open up visas? We've just done that, there is a shortage in the EU too, and a global pandemic on.

my answer would be to re-join the worlds largest free trade economy and accept that Britannia no longer rules the waves.

The long term sustainable route to this is to make critical jobs like HGV drivers valued, trained and respected properly and make it a viable line of work for people.

Hopefully that happens and I don't see why anyone would oppose that ambition.

[az city]

Re: 127 is the answer

Firstly, yes, improving wages and living standards for poorer communities generally was a part of my reasoning for voting leave. Not the biggest reason, but a part. Although I should add, if i had 100 votes, 45 of them would have been for Remain, so it's a balanced argument. But yes, it was. I don't agree in a totally laissez faire, deregulated economic model such as the single market.

Secondly, I don't think arguing for investment in training, apprenticeships, increases in wages or conditions makes someone an advocate for North Korea. No one advocates 'total self sufficiency' it's about 'greater self sufficiency' and that, I would argue is a good thing. It certainly is rarely a bad thing especially when we have a crisis of disaffected youth, communities and training. It makes sense to try and fill some of these gaps closer to home really.

Thirdly, I didn't pay any attention to the 2000 lorry strike as I would have been getting pissed in the student union and chatting up girls but I probably would have had sympathy for their concerns if not all of their actions.

The point is, what is your answer? Rewind history? Open up visas? We've just done that, there is a shortage in the EU too, and a global pandemic on.

The long term sustainable route to this is to make critical jobs like HGV drivers valued, trained and respected properly and make it a viable line of work for people.

Hopefully that happens and I don't see why anyone would oppose that ambition.

When you were studying your “Economics-related” course, did you not understand the basic principle of comparative advantage?