Michael Gove.

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

So you think that poverty is an issue that should be depoliticised? What next immigration?

No, I think we should all try and find a solution to it.

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

They are in existence and have grown in every country though.
And they occur more frequently in two of the three regions/nations in the UK that have devolved (non Tory) governments.

So the evidence would suggest that the lazt narrative of 'iTs aLl tHe ToreYs fAUlT" clearly isn't true. And if it isnt true, then we won't find a solution.

Remind me, which party is in control of the Department for Work and Pensions that control welfare benefits?

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

Do you think he is right in saying that his foodbank can show you how to make meals for 30p per day? It probably costs that in gas or electric to cook a meal at the moment.

Also, we shouldn't need foodbanks at all, yet they are ever increasing under Tory rule. I know, I know, how political of me to point out the obvious.

Well, he invited all the Labour MP's opposite him to come to the foodbank to find out. I wonder if they will bother to do so? In all honesty, I would say it's doable with volunteers, yes.

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

Remind me, which party is in control of the Department for Work and Pensions that control welfare benefits?

They are responsible for the entire country, but there are regions where food banks are far more needed and used than others. This suggests that there are other issues at play, does it not?

What is so different between Wales, Scotland and North West England, Yorkshire and Humber, North East England etc?

This is from 2017/18 I'll grant you but there are a lot of factors at play here; some devolved, some not. But it's in Wales and Scotland that the need seems greatest.

Surely if you care about these issues, you would wonder if this is linked to the issue, no?

https://www.statista.com/chart/14092/the-places-most-dependent-on-foodbanks-uk/

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

Well, he invited all the Labour MP's opposite him to come to the foodbank to find out. I wonder if they will bother to do so? In all honesty, I would say it's doable with volunteers, yes.

I'm confused. What do you think he's suggesting when he's saying he can show people how to cook meals for 30p a day for you to say that it's possible with volunteers?

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

I'm confused. What do you think he's suggesting when he's saying he can show people how to cook meals for 30p a day for you to say that it's possible with volunteers?

I'm saying that he says the Foodbank he volunteers at can provide meals for 30p a day and they help users learn to cook healthy meals with the ingredients provided.

1 / I don't know whether thats true, but he invited MP's to visit to find out

2 / Yes, I think as long as volunteers are cooking the food, then I think a meal could just about be provided for 30p - something such as a stew, perhaps sausage, mash and peas etc.

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

They are responsible for the entire country, but there are regions where food banks are far more needed and used than others. This suggests that there are other issues at play, does it not?

What is so different between Wales, Scotland and North West England, Yorkshire and Humber, North East England etc?

This is from 2017/18 I'll grant you but there are a lot of factors at play here; some devolved, some not. But it's in Wales and Scotland that the need seems greatest.

Surely if you care about these issues, you would wonder if this is linked to the issue, no?
https://www.statista.com/chart/14092...-foodbanks-uk/

All areas that have been historically ignored by consecutive governments when it comes to funding infrastructure and employment?

Please get off your high horse and stop suggesting people don't care about certain issues just because they disagree with you regarding causality. It's a poor look on you.

You routinely vote and support a party that consistently punch down on the most needy. I could suggest that you're a hypocrite and don't care about these issues at all because you vote for the status quo to continue (or get worse in terms of the need for foodbanks).

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

I'm saying that he says the Foodbank he volunteers at can provide meals for 30p a day and they help users learn to cook healthy meals with the ingredients provided.

1 / I don't know whether thats true, but he invited MP's to visit to find out

2 / Yes, I think as long as volunteers are cooking the food, then I think a meal could just about be provided for 30p - something such as a stew, perhaps sausage, mash and peas etc.

It's the volunteers bit that's confusing me.

Either it costs 30p per day for someone to buy ingredients and cook a meal or it doesn't.

Sausage, mash and peas would cost more than that. Unless you buy the cheapest pack of sausages you can find and only have one of them with your meal.

All part of a varied diet too, I assume.

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

All areas that have been historically ignored by consecutive governments when it comes to funding infrastructure and employment?

Please get off your high horse and stop suggesting people don't care about certain issues just because they disagree with you regarding causality. It's a poor look on you.

You routinely vote and support a party that consistently punch down on the most needy. I could suggest that you're a hypocrite and don't care about these issues at all because you vote for the status quo to continue (or get worse in terms of the need for foodbanks).

The point is, the UK government is responsible for benefits in every nation/region in the UK. And yet there are glaring disparities nationwide, and those where they have far less responsibility (in transport, education, economic devt, healthcare, housing) the need for foodbanks is far worse.

I wasn't accusing you of not caring. I was answering your questions. I do think people who just use any situation of suffering and make a lazy political argument devoid of facts are guilty of caring more about politics than helping people. If you want to solve a problem, you look at the facts.

You have no idea how I vote, but I had three votes last week, and I assure you one of those went to a centre-left party. And as I said, you view it as consistently punching down on the most needy, but I have stated four facts here;

1 / the tories raised minimum wage more than labour
2 / the tories raised the tax threshold on lowest paid more than labour
3 / the tories typically get more working class people in jobs than labour
4 / the need for foodbanks is demonstrably higher in places where the tories have the least control over the levers of power.

Notice, I won't accuse you of voting for a party that consistently punches down, but the evidence isnt great.

[JamesWales]

Re: Michael Gove.

It's the volunteers bit that's confusing me.

Either it costs 30p per day for someone to buy ingredients and cook a meal or it doesn't.

Sausage, mash and peas would cost more than that. Unless you buy the cheapest pack of sausages you can find and only have one of them with your meal.

All part of a varied diet too, I assume.

As with another poster, I'm not sure you have listened to the video. The MP says that when people come to the foodbank in Ashfield, they have to sign up to a budgeting course and a cookery course. I think to solve the problem, this is a good thing, don't you? It's helping people more. Giving people skills.

He then goes on to say they can provide a meal for 30p a day.

I'm saying, that if that meal is provided for by volunteers (ie, cooked in the centre, as he seems to imply) then I think that could be done for 30p a day.

I also think people could make some meals at home for 30p.

Where it isn't possible, is if those cooking it are paid to do so - thats what I mean by volunteers.

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

The point is, the UK government is responsible for benefits in every nation/region in the UK. And yet there are glaring disparities nationwide, and those where they have far less responsibility (in transport, education, economic devt, healthcare, housing) the need for foodbanks is far worse.

I wasn't accusing you of not caring. I was answering your questions. I do think people who just use any situation of suffering and make a lazy political argument devoid of facts are guilty of caring more about politics than helping people. If you want to solve a problem, you look at the facts.

You have no idea how I vote, but I had three votes last week, and I assure you one of those went to a centre-left party. And as I said, you view it as consistently punching down on the most needy, but I have stated four facts here;

1 / the tories raised minimum wage more than labour
2 / the tories raised the tax threshold on lowest paid more than labour
3 / the tories typically get more working class people in jobs than labour
4 / the need for foodbanks is demonstrably higher in places where the tories have the least control over the levers of power.

Notice, I won't accuse you of voting for a party that consistently punches down, but the evidence isnt great.

Labour were in power for how long?

1/ did they raise the minimum wage more than Labour did in 'real' terms or was it more because of inflation?

2 / same question for the tax threshold

3 / the Tories use 0-hour contracts and people working more than one job to survive to suggest that they are getting more people into work. Saying that they typically get more working class people into jobs than Labour is an odds sentence considering the above.

4 / again, you think that because of devolution that decades of Tory rule can suddenly be forgotten and how the impact of decades of "Wales, Scotland and North West England, Yorkshire and Humber, North East England etc" being ignored in terms of funding for the things I already mentioned is just going to be fixed in an instant.

You've said a few times that you voted for Boris Johnson so of course I know who you vote for. Bit silly to tell me otherwise.

[Dave Blue]

Re: Michael Gove.

That knob pulled in £200k in expenses last year. Only the brain dead can defend a clown like this.

[Gofer Blue]

Re: Michael Gove.

‘Passing the reigns’ is becoming the new escaped goat :hide:

I saw it printed thus in a headline somewhere recently too! (It might have been on the BBC News website).

[Tito Fuente]

Re: Michael Gove.

As with another poster, I'm not sure you have listened to the video. The MP says that when people come to the foodbank in Ashfield, they have to sign up to a budgeting course and a cookery course. I think to solve the problem, this is a good thing, don't you? It's helping people more. Giving people skills.

He then goes on to say they can provide a meal for 30p a day.

I'm saying, that if that meal is provided for by volunteers (ie, cooked in the centre, as he seems to imply) then I think that could be done for 30p a day.

I also think people could make some meals at home for 30p.

Where it isn't possible, is if those cooking it are paid to do so - thats what I mean by volunteers.

I watched it twice and what you're saying doesn't make sense.

He talks about a budgeting course and a cooking course (great idea, nobody is knocking that James so calm down a bit and concentrate on what I'm saying). The 30p per day quote is in regards to how much people can prepare food for.

If it wasn't, then what's the point in people learning to cook and to budget when they can go and buy a hot, fresh meal for 30p.

Hence me being confused about you talking about volunteers cooking it.

Go and watch the video again and try to make sense of what you're saying.

[Eric the Half a Bee]

Re: Michael Gove.

As with another poster, I'm not sure you have listened to the video. The MP says that when people come to the foodbank in Ashfield, they have to sign up to a budgeting course and a cookery course. I think to solve the problem, this is a good thing, don't you? It's helping people more. Giving people skills.

He then goes on to say they can provide a meal for 30p a day.

I'm saying, that if that meal is provided for by volunteers (ie, cooked in the centre, as he seems to imply) then I think that could be done for 30p a day.

I also think people could make some meals at home for 30p.

Where it isn't possible, is if those cooking it are paid to do so - thats what I mean by volunteers.

In general, meals produced as cheaply as possible are far less healthy.

What I particularly detest is wealthy bastards telling those who are worst off how to manage on as little as possible.